It sucks if you try to sell disney or whatever dvds on ebay since all the bootlegs will bring the price down (supply and demand). Most people don't know/care how to spot a bootleg. It used to bother me, but since I know ebay will never do anything (they probably make a ton off the listings themselves) I've lost hope.

Oh get real, Tom. You *know* that the copyright holders want to prevent ANY unauthorized sales. They just don't want to waste resources putting small-time distributors out of business, because as long as the manufacturers exist, more distributors will pop up. It's crap because eBay has all these policies that they refuse to enforce, THAT's why it's crap!!! If the rights holders sued eBay for not enforcing their own policies, they could get many small-timers at once, and also remove a venue for distribution of unauthorized DVDs. Yes, some savvy studios are starting to use bootleg sales on eBay as a gauge of title demand, but I assure you that if it cost them nothing to shut these folks down (i.e. a simple e-mail to eBay telling them to do their frickin' job), they'd do it in a heartbeat.

At any rate, I'm not pretending to speak for the studios, I just think it sucks for honest buyers to be held to a certain standard, but sellers of bootlegs are allowed to continue selling despite numerous complaints simply because they're filling eBay's coffers.

Is that clear enough???

To further clarify, you can clearly see from any bootleg seller's feedback profile that MANY, MANY customers have complained, but eBay does nothing. The fact that people who aren't as savvy as you and I are getting ripped off by these guys is what I have a problem with. I wouldn't care so much if they actually said "Hey, if you want a fake DVD for less than the price of a real one, click here", but they're passing these off as imports, or often saying they're the real deal -- some kind of "special limited edition" of which they somehow have an unlimited supply. As I've said, the people who continually claim that a disc has no label and is purple on the bottom because it's an "import" are my biggest pet peeve, and last time I checked, we're allowed to have those, even if the studio who produced "Savannah Smiles" really enjoys seeing that movie sold illegally, which is of course ridiculous.

It reminds me of the Fox News slogan, "We report, you decide." That is such crap, because journalism isn't supposed to be that way. Just like you should be able to take for granted that the news you hear is true and unbiased, you should be able to take for granted that when you buy a DVD from ANYWHERE, it's the real thing, especially when they say so in the auction listing or in an e-mail responding to your question. Sellers shouldn't be allowed to purposefully mislead customers, and if you're not smart enough to tell that they're lying, tough luck for you. I'm not going to watch Fox News report something, then sit there and decide whether it's actually true or if it's just biased propaganda.

It's already been said, but it is quite rediculous how eBay does handle their bootlegger policies. I once tried to sell a DVD & offered my backup dvdr copy along with the original so the buyer wouldn't damage the disc. EBay ended my auction within the matter of an hour. I only offered the disc with the original since I'm not allowed to keep the backup once the original is sold. (By Law)

Yet whenever I bought some DVDs from a seller in New Jersey & they arrived in 100% bootleg DVD-R condition eBay does nothing. They would not reimburse me for my purchase, nor did the seller get his account suspended. Probably because this guy was selling hundreds of items a week paying them all sorts of listing fees frequently. It's a little rediculous how they let alot of bootleggers off & turn a blind eye to some, yet when a normal person lists a 100% legit disc with the backup for free they delete the auction & send a threatening email saying I'm not the legal rights holder ect. Also eBay should not allow a seller to leave negative feedback just because a winning bidder did, it makes the buyer feel intimidated & threatened even when they've done nothing wrong.

Hong Kong, Singapore, China, Taiwan, Thailand, and all the other countries these pressed bootlegs come from have different laws for piracy than us. Most of them don't really enforce the laws & some of them have strange copyright laws that they feel overpower ours. Such as in a few places, movie right owners can only hold a copyright on a title for 10 years before it becomes public domain. Everyone who shops eBay should be aware that if you're ordering something from any of the above countries that there is a large chance what your ordering is a fake.

While it would be nice if eBay could clean up the bootleg sales, it would be nearly impossible without eBay having the items in their own hands to look over. It's a problem eBay has had for years & has not decreases much in the 7 years I've been shopping on there. If you want to be so cautious as to miss out on some good bargains even on alot of original OOP material, then maybe you should look into places that sell used videos or conventions. Your best bet is don't bid if theres a doubt in your mind, a negative feedback with the seller, or you don't know 100% what the item your wanting to buy is supposed to look like, & don't buy from sellers who don't have real photos of the item. Also compare auctions with others, check for foreign characters on the covers that aren't on covers elsewhere, check to be sure it's not listed as R0, & only buy from those within the United States so you can file mail fraud charges if they do indeed ship you a bootleg.

I know I said alot & probably went off topic & mentioned everything everyone else has mentioned & if so I'm sorry. You can never be too cautious when buying on eBay & even then you sometimes still manage to get screwed. If you don't like the facts, there's not a whole lot you can do except take it as a loss & move on with your life.

That is simply not true. You even admit that later on in your post....

It is very significant that they DON'T do this. There is already legal precedence, so if those copyright holders wanted, they could simply notify eBay to close down all auctions for bootlegs of their intellectual properties or face a lawsuit.... and eBay would LOSE.

Who would be the one sending the email? A seller? A buyer? A "righteous avenger"? They have no legal authority to tell eBay what to do. Only the copyright holders do.

Well, this thread sure is getting deeper and deeper into no man's land ...

I think that's relatively straight forward and good advice. Know what you're seeking and ask questions - all the while using a little common sense. The second bit are pictures. Does the seller have any of the actual set? I've asked for pictures before .. and more recently on a current auction .. come to find out all the seller did was add more stock photos to their auction. If they seem to be dancing around the table (even when you've asked them clearly what you want) but not providing any meat, forget it.

I can also appreciate the fact that you dumped the copy that you received. I too once got burned for a $50 import and once I found out it was a fake, I just couldn't dump it off on any one else. I did what I needed to do with it .. but there's no option in dumping it off on some other unsuspecting customer. But ever since that experience, I've had no patience for shit like this. .. and being an importer myself, it's that much more wearisome a process at times when considering buys on the aftermarket.

Yep that is one of may questions too, I ask for scans of the disc, front and back cover etc. Pretty much people provide them fairly quickly. I tend to stick with the small seller, you can spot them. You know 'Joe past-time seller' in BFE Iowa or someplace like that for the HTF disc ... I avoid the Super Power Seller from Bootleg, China with the Offical Special Asian Release or the Official Brazilian Release all region free. Or the ads with the micro-print that say "disc cover may vary, small asian writing on case" etc etc ...
As Movie Exchanger said it's common sense, I've been burnt that one time, the guy flat out lied, I reported him to his states attorney generals office, filed complaints with eBay and Paypal and got my money back. HOWEVER, I must confess I did keep the DVD case, to replace a broken one ... LOL the rest went in the trash.
Now I'll admit if a movie is NOT been released on DVD and it doesn't look like it ever will be, I'll pick up a cheap copy if I can and I want to see it, but on the rare occasions that the real deal come out I'll grab one. I've given the boots away to friends, but never sold them and told them right up front it's a fake so don't try selling it. In those cases I figure it's no worse then recording a never been, likely never will be movie with a DVR off the TV. At the end of the day I perfer the real deal, factory pressed, shiny packaging, minty fresh disc.
If ones uses common sense they can avoid a lot of headaches.
The one thing I get sick of is the so called people saying the item is located in the US and it shipped from China, I use the filter to get rid of all non North American sellers (sorry Europe, blame Asia) but these butt head avoid that by lying about the item location ... that reason enough for me not to buy from them.
Ok rant over.

i've sold VHS videos of the monster squad, hearts of darkness doc, song of the south. all of which would have sold better had some cheap bootleg dvd option not been there. i reported these at the time and you guessed it they never got removed. of course ebays slant is that you dont know its fake until you actually have bought it. you have to spell it out that the dvd you are selling is a bootleg. companies like disney have a piracy devision but what do they do?

I can understand getting upset at bootleggers who sell titles easily available elsewhere, but doesn't anyone feel that there are some bootleggers on eBay who are providing a real service?

I'm talking about sellers who have access to things like workprints, unreleased versions, etc. Stuff like the 5 hour Apocalypse Now, or the many rare versions of Blade Runner, or the pilot of Mulholland Drive, etc......

I don't have a problem so much with unreleased items as I do with stuff availible in a large number of online shops. I purchased Night of the Creeps & the Friday the 13th TV Series off eBay in the past, but I knew what I was ordering & don't expect official releases. There's always exceptions for movies & shows that have never been in print before. As VisitorQ mentioned I too always try to track down an original of the few fakes I have when I find out about an official release. However sellers trying to pass off their bootleg prints as official material should be banned from eBay.

Tom, yet again, you're twisting what I say to fit what you think. I never said that rights holders WANT their stuff to be sold illegally so they can track demand, just that the smart ones listen to advisors like the guy who got "My So Called Life" released who tell them bootlegs are making a pile on eBay so they'd better get with the program. I'm pretty sure studio execs themselves would rather shut down bootleggers rather than learn from them. In the same way, record labels would rather sue people who share music online than accept it as additional exposure for their artists (which for the most part is really just an excuse people use to try and keep filesharing sites up). In other words, the harm outweighs any possible benefit, so for you to suggest that any studio actually wants eBay bootleggers to thrive is just plain ridiculous.

And yes, I meant the rights holders sending a simple e-mail, which may work, or it may not. There is such a mess of legal issues involved, that it's entirely possible that eBay can legally say they're covered because they tell people you can't sell bootlegs. It's like porn sites that require you to click a link saying you're over 18 to get in. Anybody can click that link, but they're hiding behind the fact that you misled them in order to gain access. I'd guess that eBay has been successfully using that excuse to avoid being prosecuted for the actions of some of their members. As long as nobody specifically states it's a bootleg, they can turn a blind eye, pretending to believe that it is a legitimate "Asian import" after all.

Lastly, you're conveniently ignoring the fact that I'm not really trying to speak for the studios (as you obviously are), I'm just saying it sucks that for some reason it's supposed to be the customer's responsibility to figure out whether they're being lied to or not... I don't think that's how business works, and any business outside eBay that operates that way would be in serious legal trouble very quickly.

And to respond to KFelon's comment about selling a "backup" of a DVD, sorry, but that's just as illegal as selling a bootleg. You're right, though, it does suck that you get slapped for doing that once, and plenty of others sell bootlegs constantly and don't get in trouble for it. Even sadder is the fact that the reason you got in trouble was that you honestly described the items up for auction, and the reason the others get away with it is that they tell eBay (and all their customers) that they're selling "legitimate Asian imports" (whatever the hell that means) when it's actually DVD-R copies just like your "backup". Since eBay has been misled by the seller, it seems they're avoiding prosecution because they've conveniently slid across the line into "victim" status instead of being nailed for enabling these creeps.

Hopefully, eBay will eventually get what's coming to them, but until then, all we can do is hammer away at the "bricks" in this wall, which are the individual sellers. Good luck, everyone!

Why does it bother you (op) that people are getting away with it?

I'm not the OP, but come on, why SHOULDN'T it bother us? I mean I can't speak for the OP as to whether it's simply a case of "I wish I could get away with that" or if he's genuinely concerned that people are getting ripped off, but for the most part I think it's just righteous indignation. I mean why should anyone be allowed to keep ripping people off like that, even if you haven't been one of them? Another point that has been brought up is that people who sell the same films on genuine DVDs and videotapes suffer because people would rather buy a bootleg DVD.

It seems this world is so much about seeing some dude beat the crap out of another one, and if anyone says "Hey, that dude's beating the crap outta that other guy", most people ask "Why do YOU care?" It's a sad commentary on the state of human beings on this planet when wrong only matters when we're the ones being wronged. I for one would be very grateful to anyone who spoke up if I was being beaten up, ripped off, or whatever.

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It most certainly is not ridiculous. There are plenty of examples of eBay shutting down auctions for bootleg and pirated material. I challenge you to show me an example where a copyright holder contacted eBay to shut down a bootleg/pirate auction and eBay refused. Just show me one and I will consider that you just may have an understanding of what is going on.

Oh please, I challenge you to do the same thing! How the hell would either one of us know whether eBay refused or not??? The fact remains that these people keep selling bootlegs despite multiple CUSTOMER complaints, that's what matters. Besides, any case where bootleggers keep selling the same movie is not an indication that the studio WANTS bootlegs sold, just that they may not have ASKED. It's also possible that eBay simply says "Sorry, we can't shut down that auction because they say they're selling Asian imports, not bootlegs. Here is all their account information, so if you'd like to prosecute them yourself, go right ahead. Maybe they'll tell you where the imports are coming from." but of course we'll never know that. Even so, it's ridiculous to think that studios actually WANT bootlegs sold, on eBay or anywhere. For any rights holder to encourage or even allow unauthorized copies would set a seriously dangerous legal precedent.

Funny, "sracer" sounds familiar... ever sell on eBay?

I think most people who buy bootlegs off ebay either
A. Know its a bootleg beforehand
or
B. Don't know and never do know.

For either of these situations, who cares (besides the studio obviously)?

The small percentage of people who actually feel ripped off or cheated will probably never buy a dvd on ebay again and the bootleggers have lost a customer.

If they get know they got burned and keep buying shady dvds on ebay, its pretty much their fault.

Either way it pretty much solves itself. Your self imposed moral superiority isnt required.

Oh really? What kind of research have you done to support your claims? Do you not see the tons of negative feedbacks where people say "Lame! It's a DVD-R copy!" or something like that? For that matter, why must these people find out by being burned once? It doesn't matter that they're smart enough not to buy again, it's the fact that they paid their money in good faith thinking they were getting a genuine DVD and they ended up with something they could have made themselves if they had paid $2 for the original VHS tape!

If you think that's "moral superiority", that's your problem. If you think it's okay for everyone to get ripped off at least once to teach them some kind of lesson, then I guess I am "morally superior".

Am I sick of it?
Let's see, today I look to see what the current value of The Killer: Criterion Collection is (I'm currently having to sell my DVDs to pay for hospital bills), and this is what I see:
http://search.ebay.com/search/search...dvd&category0=

I wonder how many of those are legimate copies?
So, yeah it pisses me off because it really screws over those of us trying to sell real store-bought DVDs!

I think losing 7-12 bucks is a pretty cheap lesson. The bootleggers lost a customer and these people learned to be a little more careful on the internet.

"EVERYONE GETS RIPPED OFF'" seems a bit extreme. It really shouldn't bother you that much. What it really sounds like is you bought a bootleg and you want vengence. Go collect the coins in your sofa and get your $7 bucks back. I insist.

Easy. If Disney had told eBay to stop bootleg Disney auctions and ebay refused, it would've been reported in the media. It most definitely would be reported.

That statement demonstrates quite a lack of understanding of the issue at hand. Customers have no "rights" to get someone to enforce copyright laws.... only the copyright owners can do that.

I know this is kind of terrible, but I've really benefited from the bootleg market on Ebay this past year. Several months ago I decided to get every OOP Criterion title that I could afford because I wanted to see the films before the price got too high. Of course for most of these titles there were a ton of bootlegs being circulated on Ebay. However, supply and demand kicked in and caused the price of not only the bootlegs to go down but also the legit copies because most people can't tell a difference. I ended up getting completely legit copies of Dead Ringers, Robocop, Flesh for Frankenstein, Blood for Dracula, Spellbound, Notorious, Rebecca, Sid and Nancy, Hard Boiled, The Silence of the Lambs, and The Unbearable Lightness of Being for an average of $20-$25 each. There were other legit copies of these going for $50-100, but if you're sharp and know what you're looking for you can find some real bargains.

but thats mostly down to the fact criterion prices have dropped alot in recent years. though if there are bootlegs it does make buyers a bit more cautious to pay alot.

Tom, I'm not saying that customers can enforce copyright laws, but they have the right to get what they've been told they're getting. It should be as simple as asking a seller "is this a bootleg", and if the seller claims it's actually an "Asian import" when it's either a pressed Malaysian bootleg or a homemade DVD-R, they should get their money back.

Ryo, You assume that I've been ripped off by a bootlegger, which I guess means you haven't comprehended what I've said up to this point, which would lead any moderately aware person to believe that I'm quite familiar with the tactics bootleggers use and how to avoid them. One of the tactics I speak of is always claiming it's the buyer's fault if they don't get what they were expecting, so I think that's pretty revealing here. At any rate, even if I could pull 7 bucks in coins out of my couch (which I assure you I can't because I typically wear jeans and my coins don't spill out of the pockets), it was already my money and I'd still be out seven bucks. If everybody who's been ripped off by a bootlegger (and I'm not part of that group) could go to THAT person's house and grab seven bucks out of THEIR couch (or take seven bucks worth outta their hide), then I'd be happy and all would be right with the world.

Better guard your couch...

I'm not against sellers who sell bootlegs per se... I'm against sellers who portray their bootlegs as the real product (thus commanding higher prices).