Go Back  DVD Talk Forum > Archives > Archives > DVD Talk Archive
Reload this Page >

Are DVD Fanatics Responsible For Lousy DVDs?

Are DVD Fanatics Responsible For Lousy DVDs?

 
Old 05-31-03, 06:59 PM
  #1  
Cool New Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Are DVD Fanatics Responsible For Lousy DVDs?

I spent the better part of this morning in the DVD aisle at Tower Records in Philadelphia.

Reduced my DVD wishlist by three titles (Blow Out, I Spit On Your Grave, and Dressed To Kill), but ended up contemplating (while looking for an unrated version of American Psycho) the following interesting phenomenon:

Why are so many crappy movies getting the 5Star DVD treatment? Cases in point: the rerelease of John Woo's Windtalkers as a bloated 3 DVD set. Now, I saw the movie when it came out: and to say it's boring is not saying enough bad things about it. There is really no movie here. A good story, to be sure; a story worthwhile telling (perhaps from the Navajo's point of view? rather than the Nick Cage angle?), but it's ruined by clunky pacing, bad acting, and superflous pyrotechnics.

Second example: Dances with Wolves. Now, the film has some gorgeous (National Geographic type) scenery, but where is the story? What is the point of this damn piece of self-serving horsedoodoo?

It boggles the mind why both these turds are getting the treatment they are getting. IMHO, both are (Windtalkers more so) strictly bargain bin material.

My sense is that at least in part the obsession of DVD buyers with mind- and meaningless details is responsible for that. Just look at some of the threads here. Favorite topics include:

-Why is there no insert in my DVD
-How do I remove the sticky rubber thingy from the back of the DVD cover.
-I'm not happy with the box my DVD came in. Can I return it?
-DVD cases are of uneven size: Should I committ suicide because of this?
-Which DVD has the prettiest disc art?

Huh?

Now, a studio reading all these threads will say to itself: this is just the right audience to sell bloated DVD packages to. Just stack 'em with yet another product-pushing "HBO special: THe making of...", six different commentaries )SPECIAL COMMENTARY FROM THE GRIP!, 5000 trailers for our upcoming stuff -stretch all this out to 16 disks, and we have a winner on our hands!

I dread the day American Pie will be rereleased as a 6 disk Super Special Edition. One disk, I am sure, will be devoted to a loving, storyboard by storyboard analysis of the infamous Apple Pie scene.

Ricardo
Ricardo41 is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 07:05 PM
  #2  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Cumming, GA
Posts: 396
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
while you make not like certain movies that are getting delux treatment, that does not in any way make them lousy dvd's. a lousy dvd is non-anamorphic (or worse, P&S), does not have DTS, and is barebones. Those 2 you mentioned (windtalkers and Dances with Wolves) hardly meets that criteria. By all accounts, these are excellent DVDs. The movies themselves you may not like, but the DVDs are excellent.
I would much rather every movie, even crappy ones, get delux treatment, then have barebones discs.
Kakkarat is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 07:09 PM
  #3  
DVD Talk Legend
 
matome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: NY
Posts: 12,304
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
It's all subjective. A new SE of a multi-Oscar winning, $190 mil grossing film that is replacing a long out of print DVD is certainly welcome in my book. Didn't I Spit on Your Grave (one of the most exploitative pieces of trash I have ever seen), just get a nice new SE re-release recently? Guess us DVD fanatics just helped you out there.
matome is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 08:36 PM
  #4  
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
Joe Molotov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oklahoma, USA
Posts: 8,507
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Okay, let me get this straight.

About Dances With Wolves you said:
"Where is the story?"
"What is the point of this damn piece of self-serving horsedoodoo?"
"why both these turds are getting the treatment they are getting?"
"strictly bargain bin material"

(Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, but let's keep in mind that this movie was OOP on DVD and a Oscar/Golden Globe Best Picture winner.)

But you seem proud of the fact that I Spit On Your Grave MILLENIUM EDITION is (was!) currently topping your wishlist? I like schlock-cinema as much as the next guy, but come on. Let's be reasonable.
Joe Molotov is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 08:52 PM
  #5  
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: on a river in a kayak..where else?
Posts: 4,949
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
jesus....if you dont like it, dont buy it. yet another concern that is nothing but a waste of time.
gutwrencher is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 08:52 PM
  #6  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Times Square
Posts: 12,135
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
Re: Are DVD Fanatics Responsible For Lousy DVDs?

Originally posted by Ricardo41
I spent the better part of this morning in the DVD aisle at Tower Records in Philadelphia.

Reduced my DVD wishlist by three titles (Blow Out, I Spit On Your Grave, and Dressed To Kill)......
Why are so many crappy movies getting the 5Star DVD treatment? Cases in point: the rerelease of John Woo's Windtalkers as a bloated 3 DVD set. Now, I saw the movie when it came out: and to say it's boring is not saying enough bad things about it. There is really no movie here. A good story, to be sure; .....
Second example: Dances with Wolves. Now, the film has some gorgeous (National Geographic type) scenery, but where is the story? What is the point of this damn piece of self-serving horsedoodoo?

It boggles the mind why both these turds are getting the treatment they are getting. IMHO, both are (Windtalkers more so) strictly bargain bin material.

Ricardo
Well, one of the things that boggles MY mind is that someone actually shops at Tower! But that's another topic....

So you don't like DANCES WITH WOLVES - fine, but you must admit that more than one or two people on this planet (even some in Philadelphia, I would imagine) HAVE
appreciated the movie .... but since you'd prefer to own I Spit on Your Grave you begrudge ANYONE getting a well-done edition of the movie.

With "friends" like you, DVD doesn't need any enemies.....
marty888 is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 08:53 PM
  #7  
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: In a "sweet spot"
Posts: 85
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I suppose that's the trade off to availability and choice.

It's all subjective, man. I Spit on your Grave might be a great movie to you as would be American Psycho, however, I could care less about the premise and story of either of these two movies by description. Then again, I could be missing out on a great deal. Who knows.

Marketplace will always win over. Because of the medium's offering in quality and relatively low cost, DVD has taken off. How did American Psycho fare during its run in the theaters? Did it rake in $83mil as Bruce Almighty did last weekend? Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking your taste in movies. That is far off from my points. Majority rules and the production companies will go where the money is to be made. If Bruce Almighty, Star Wars: The Phantom Menace each made $150 - 200 mil at the theaters, they will get the best treatment on disk or will be released 1000 times over if people keep buying or renting them. Frankly, both films were laughable, and not necessarily in a good way. But, if huge numbers are flocking to watch these movies in big screen .. and following up by running these films off the shelves once on disk, then that's all there is to know. At least for every 10 duds these companies are putting out these days, one of them is actually worth it.

Shoot, I wouldn't have come across as many "good" to "excellent" movies if it hadn't been for the DVD format, its enthusiasts or sites like DVDTalk. Think about it that way. I've always been interested in a good movie or so while growing up, but after having been introduced to DVD, I wouldn't know about over half the movies that I've seen or own. A lot have been horrible. So be it. For instance, did you ever try looking for a range of available foreign films 10 years ago at your local rental store?

The last piece of input that I would provide would end with a question - what actually is a lousy DVD as you term it? ... nonanamorphic, bad soundtrack mastering, lack of extras, 500 commentaries from the lead to the gaffer? There are a ton of movies out that have mulitple versions or all the fixings. Not all are horrible movies. No, Apocalypse Now and Fargo (two movies which I consider to be of some quality) are not a souped up as say, Blade II or Men In Black (with 50 versions floating around), but so what. At least Apocalypse is anamorphic and has a newly mastered 5.1 soundtrack that sounds pretty darn good. At least these movies are available for purchasing. At least that's the way I look at it.

By the way, Dances with Wolves isn't a horrible movie, but about 3 hours of it could have been trimmed. Costner, what's up with that guy?
KWilliamTaylor is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 08:59 PM
  #8  
DVD Talk Legend
 
JimRochester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Rochester, NY. USA
Posts: 18,011
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Crappy movies is all a matter of taste. I personally dislike horror and anime but enjoy popcorn movies that deep down I know are pretty shallow (read: Armageddon and Independence Day)

As far as the uneven treatment some movies get I totally agree. I hate to see some movies get rereleased 3 times or another be P&S only when I'm waiting for tons of good titles to appear in WS. When even universally panned movies like Battlefield Earth can be a number one seller the week it's released then the studios have incentive to release crap on DVD. If people rebuy an SE they have more incentive.

Fact of the matter is they'll release what they can make money on. The best thing a consumer can do is make your voice heard through contact with the studios, letting them know what you want. And upon release, vote with your wallet by not buying those you don't approve of.

I'm not fan a 11 hours of extras but will upgrade for an anamorphic picture and DTS sound.
JimRochester is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 09:12 PM
  #9  
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Portland
Posts: 8,324
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
One thing I learned while working in radio is.... No matter how bad you think something is, someone out there somewhere really loves it. This can be applied to books, movies, music, TV, etc.
renaldow is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 09:36 PM
  #10  
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: on a river in a kayak..where else?
Posts: 4,949
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally posted by renaldow
One thing I learned while working in radio is.... No matter how bad you think something is, someone out there somewhere really loves it. This can be applied to books, movies, music, TV, etc.
so true. I was in radio in northern cali for 15 years. I played obscure progressive and fusion jazz from Japan and Germany...and if just one person was turned onto something new by tuning into my show....it made it all worth it for me. not many people are into Allan Holdsworth or Steve Lukather.
gutwrencher is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 09:51 PM
  #11  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 452
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I found Ricardo's post rather amusing because I often think about this when an extended or director's cut comes out and nobody cares the theatrical cut has not been released or has a bad transfer. The attention is focused on the DTS soundtrack (or lack of), the packaging or the inserts. This happens quite often, most recently with Dances with Wolves. Grrrr!

To answer Ricardo's question, no I don't mind movies that I don't like getting the 5 star special edition treatment. I love extras and I don't think someone with different taste than mine should be deprived of them. I think at the very least all DVDs could have the trailer and a commentary on them, because people that love that film would enjoy having them and they are easy and (usually) cheap to include.

Oh, I wouldn't mind a commentary or two from a grip. I think it would probably be amusing.

Last edited by Avid; 05-31-03 at 09:53 PM.
Avid is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 09:56 PM
  #12  
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
Joe Molotov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oklahoma, USA
Posts: 8,507
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally posted by Avid
Oh, I wouldn't mind a commentary or two from a grip. I think it would probably be amusing.
Rules of Attraction had a commentary with Carrot Top, so hey, why not?
Joe Molotov is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 11:33 PM
  #13  
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Right Behind You
Posts: 4,986
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I thought this was gonna be an intelligent post. Sad, sad.
lesterlong is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 11:37 PM
  #14  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Drexl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 16,077
Likes: 0
Received 15 Likes on 13 Posts
While I don't know if anyone was asking for a 3-disc Windtalkers, why complain about DWW? It's a different studio releasing their own disc, and it's not even the same movie (it's the extended cut only)-to say nothing of the acclaim it received and its popularity among the DVD buying public.

Actually, I think what may have happened with Windtalkers was the release was prepared in advance-they had plenty of time since its theatrical release was delayed. When the movie tanked, they figured the only way to get a decent return on their investment was to double-dip. That's just my theory anyway.
Drexl is offline  
Old 05-31-03, 11:55 PM
  #15  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Lone Star State!!!
Posts: 1,184
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As far as I am concerned, if it enhances the movie; whether that be 6 commentaries, 340 deleted scenes, virtual tour of the on-location port-a-potty, etc... then put it in and price it right! Sure seems to have worked for LOTR: FOTR. That thing is packed with all kinds of goodies and 9/10ths of them are fantastic. Plus you can pick up the 4 discer for a whopping $25 at your local B&M!
SCHMEGGA is offline  
Old 06-01-03, 08:13 AM
  #16  
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: chicago
Posts: 2,647
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
when i saw the header for this thread, i thought for sure it would have to do with the impression that studios were cramming too much crap on the discs to appeal to dvd fans, who love quantity and the appearence of value, at the cost of impacting the a/v compression and delivery.
ckolchak is offline  
Old 06-01-03, 08:59 AM
  #17  
DVD Talk Legend
 
calhoun07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,401
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
When I saw the header for this thread, I thought for sure it would be about the increasing demand for DVDs and the studios trying to meet that demand and cranking out more product with less care.

Just because YOU don't like the title doesn't mean people out there won't want it. And I doubt that these carefully done special edtion DVDs of movies you don't like aren't keeping your favorite movies off of DVD. But then again, I am sure some moron is out there going, "They got Windtalkers 3 disc on DVD, but no [Insert most demanded title here]!" when the two have nothing to do with each other
calhoun07 is offline  
Old 06-01-03, 12:46 PM
  #18  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
madcougar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Houston
Posts: 6,691
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Re: Are DVD Fanatics Responsible For Lousy DVDs?

So what are you ranting about here? You would prefer for the studios NOT to produce as many 5-star DVD editions as they do now? Or should they run the titles by you for your approval?

As others have said, it's all subjective. One man's trash is another man's treasure. Reading your post made me think how much sadder this little hobby of mine would be WITHOUT all those "turds" getting new, pumped up editions. I have no doubt that the new "Windtalkers" edition is probably the crown jewel of someone's collection. Certainly "Dances With Wolves" which was nominated for 12 Academy Awards (and won 7) was worthy of a better edition.

Understand this, if it wasn't for us "DVD fanatics," you'ld either be stuck watching some lousy VHS copy of those movies you mentioned, or paying an arm and a leg for a laserdisc copy.
madcougar is offline  
Old 06-01-03, 04:04 PM
  #19  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Formerly known as "brizz"/kck
Posts: 23,427
Received 6 Likes on 2 Posts
...reduced my wishlist to...Blow Out, I Spit On Your Grave, and Dressed To Kill...


and YOU are bitching about a film sucking? give me a friggin break.....
HistoryProf is offline  
Old 06-01-03, 11:01 PM
  #20  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Clarkston, MI
Posts: 1,877
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Re: Re: Are DVD Fanatics Responsible For Lousy DVDs?

Originally posted by marty888
Well, one of the things that boggles MY mind is that someone actually shops at Tower! But that's another topic....
Hey, Tower Records aint half bad. Theres not one around me, but when I was in Atlanta I stopped by one, and it was decent. I'm more of a Best Buy man myself, but they have a pretty wide selection, at least the one I went to did.
MasterCXtreme is offline  
Old 06-03-03, 07:37 PM
  #21  
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 2,202
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hey Ricardo,

Are all these people bicthin about the T2 case over reacting and suicidal??

..Absolutely..
shanester is offline  
Old 06-03-03, 07:57 PM
  #22  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 14,806
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally posted by Kakkarat
while you make not like certain movies that are getting delux treatment, that does not in any way make them lousy dvd's. a lousy dvd is non-anamorphic (or worse, P&S), does not have DTS, and is barebones. Those 2 you mentioned (windtalkers and Dances with Wolves) hardly meets that criteria. By all accounts, these are excellent DVDs. The movies themselves you may not like, but the DVDs are excellent.
I would much rather every movie, even crappy ones, get delux treatment, then have barebones discs.
Tarantino is offline  
Old 06-03-03, 07:57 PM
  #23  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,459
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I would like a 3 disc SE of High Plains Drifter and Good Burger.

As for the title, I have had more problems with defective Dvd's in the last 6 months or so than I did in the first 4 or so years of buying Dvd's.
ernestrp is offline  
Old 06-03-03, 08:00 PM
  #24  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 14,806
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Oh, I bought DWW and Windtalkers DC the day they came out and LOVE THEM!

Keep bringing out the 'bad' and 'lousy' DVD sets, I eat 'em up!
Tarantino is offline  
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.