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Note, Dances with wolves ee is a flipper

Note, Dances with wolves ee is a flipper

 
Old 04-24-03, 04:21 PM
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I prefer two discs to a DVD-18 for several reasons.

One, I like artwork on the disc. It not only looks nice, but it protects that side of the disc from scratches or wear.

Two, for those with changers it's much better to just have your player change over to the second disc.

Three, the DVD-18s are essentially two DVD-9s glued together with side-two upside-down. I've heard horror stories of the sandwich coming apart on these, thus ruining the disc (both sides) and making it unplayable.

Four, purely from a manufacturing standpoint, DVD-18s are harder to produce. That means higher cost to the consumer. Remember when the two replication houses making the T2: UE couldn't make them fast enough to meet consumer demand?

They're more prevalent now, but they're still more expensive to make than 2 separate discs, which are very cheap to produce.

There's really no ADVANTAGE to a DVD-18 except to put more content on a single platter. Maybe eventually DVD players will be able to switch sides without having to physically swap the disc over (like some LD players) and that would be a plus, then.

I just don't see why anyone would prefer the DVD-18 to two DVD-9s. I was happy to get the 2-disc T2 rather than the DVD-18.

-- Jough
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Old 04-24-03, 09:38 PM
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Originally posted by jough

I just don't see why anyone would prefer the DVD-18 to two DVD-9s.
Sounds like a good poll idea to me. For the record, I'd go for two DVD-9 because it's too easy to get fingerprints DVD-18s.
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Old 04-25-03, 12:26 AM
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Originally posted by spyzdope
Sounds like a good poll idea to me. For the record, I'd go for two DVD-9 because it's too easy to get fingerprints DVD-18s.
i'm pretty sure it was done, as i remember voting in it.yes, here it is. http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hlight=flipper
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Old 04-25-03, 01:03 AM
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Originally posted by WiccanPagan
i'm pretty sure it was done, as i remember voting in it.yes, here it is. http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hlight=flipper
So there you go. 77% of us prefer 2 discs to a flipper.

That's fairly substantive.
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Old 04-25-03, 01:32 AM
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Originally posted by jough
I prefer two discs to a DVD-18 for several reasons.

One, I like artwork on the disc. It not only looks nice, but it protects that side of the disc from scratches or wear.

Two, for those with changers it's much better to just have your player change over to the second disc.

Three, the DVD-18s are essentially two DVD-9s glued together with side-two upside-down. I've heard horror stories of the sandwich coming apart on these, thus ruining the disc (both sides) and making it unplayable.

Four, purely from a manufacturing standpoint, DVD-18s are harder to produce. That means higher cost to the consumer. Remember when the two replication houses making the T2: UE couldn't make them fast enough to meet consumer demand?

They're more prevalent now, but they're still more expensive to make than 2 separate discs, which are very cheap to produce.

There's really no ADVANTAGE to a DVD-18 except to put more content on a single platter. Maybe eventually DVD players will be able to switch sides without having to physically swap the disc over (like some LD players) and that would be a plus, then.

I just don't see why anyone would prefer the DVD-18 to two DVD-9s. I was happy to get the 2-disc T2 rather than the DVD-18.

-- Jough
I couldn't have said it better myself. I dislike two-sided discs in any circumstance. I especially don't like it when the movie is on one and the special features are on the other side. I say raise the MSRP by 50 and give me two discs.
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Old 04-25-03, 02:37 AM
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Originally posted by jough
Maybe eventually DVD players will be able to switch sides without having to physically swap the disc over (like some LD players) and that would be a plus, then.
-- Jough
Unfortunately, just like laserdisc, they didn't think this through. The disc will be spinning the wrong way on top, so the player needs to stop the disc, spin it backwards, then continue. This would be worse than a layer change. They could try creating a new type of dvd18 with a opposite spiral side b, but I doubt this will happen.
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Old 04-25-03, 06:06 AM
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Originally posted by aam1
Unfortunately, just like laserdisc, they didn't think this through. The disc will be spinning the wrong way on top, so the player needs to stop the disc, spin it backwards, then continue. This would be worse than a layer change. They could try creating a new type of dvd18 with a opposite spiral side b, but I doubt this will happen.

Oh really? This player can player both sides:

http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTE...ntentItemPage=

Last edited by tacomantt; 04-25-03 at 12:45 PM.
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Old 04-25-03, 06:52 AM
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I assume you have this as I can't see anywhere to confirm the double sided status. So have you tried a flipper? How long does it take?
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Old 04-25-03, 08:46 AM
  #34  
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Like I said, Bizarro World.
These aren't the early days of DVD when ~2hour movies were flippers.
Dances With Wolves DC is 4 freakin hours!
I guess I can thank Disney for getting people to drool over disc artwork.
I'm just out of the loop. But the question is, why stop at 2 discs? How about 5 discs with pics of all the cast on each?

Anyway to go over jough's point and why still don't understand...

One, I like artwork on the disc. It not only looks nice, but it protects that side of the disc from scratches or wear.
Artwork and protection. I have never had a problem with any of my DVD10s (basically the same thing but 2 DVD5) I have over 550 DVDs and have yet to have problems with scratches. Even my Blockbuster discs work flawlessly. When I'm done watching them, I put them back in the case, no problems. Artwork seems to be a strong point around here, I could only suggest staring at the box art, seems like the same thing to me.

Two, for those with changers it's much better to just have your player change over to the second disc.
Again, these are not 2 hour movies that need to be flipped. Most of the time they are 3 1/2+ hours, Movie/Extras, Fullscreen/Widescreen(Windtalkers). If Windtalkers was dual inventory Blockbuster would have stocked the full screen one.
And what about the people with changers that auto flip discs? Do they count? Why do I have to waste prescious space in my 300 player with a redundant disc?

Three, the DVD-18s are essentially two DVD-9s glued together with side-two upside-down. I've heard horror stories of the sandwich coming apart on these, thus ruining the disc (both sides) and making it unplayable.
I never understood this argument. All of my DVD18s play fine. I think someone read an article once and ran with it.

Four, purely from a manufacturing standpoint, DVD-18s are harder to produce. That means higher cost to the consumer.
Remember when the two replication houses making the T2: UE couldn't make them fast enough to meet consumer demand?
That was the early days. The same thing was said about DVD9s.

There's really no ADVANTAGE to a DVD-18 except to put more content on a single platter. Maybe eventually DVD players will be able to switch sides without having to physically swap the disc over (like some LD players) and that would be a plus, then.
That is a huge advantage to me and they do make players that flip discs.

I just don't see why anyone would prefer the DVD-18 to two DVD-9s. I was happy to get the 2-disc T2 rather than the DVD-18.
And I don't see why anyone would want 2 discs when they can have one. Technology and advancement is a good thing. When I saw my T2UE was 2 discs, I immediately traded to get the DVD18 version. T2 is not a flipper by the way.

Doug

Last edited by Doug Schiller; 04-25-03 at 08:52 AM.
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Old 04-25-03, 12:49 PM
  #35  
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Originally posted by aam1
I assume you have this as I can't see anywhere to confirm the double sided status. So have you tried a flipper? How long does it take?
I posted the wrong multi disc DVD player. I updated it to the correct one (the Sony). Sorry. The duel sided nature is now listed in the spec section for the DVP-CX875P player.

The way it works is that there is a turn-table. For the DVD to be flipped, the turntable ejects the DVD onto the table, then rotates the table 180 degrees and then reloads.
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Old 04-25-03, 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by aam1
I assume you have this as I can't see anywhere to confirm the double sided status. So have you tried a flipper? How long does it take?
Haven't tried it to see how long it takes, but from that link one of the bullet points says:
Disc Flip Mechanism Automatically corrects for CDs and DVDs inserted backwards, also allows access to both sides of a DVD without removing the disc from the player.
So there you go.
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Old 04-25-03, 01:41 PM
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Originally posted by Doug Schiller
These aren't the early days of DVD when ~2hour movies were flippers.
Dances With Wolves DC is 4 freakin hours!
I guess I can thank Disney for getting people to drool over disc artwork.
I'm just out of the loop. But the question is, why stop at 2 discs? How about 5 discs with pics of all the cast on each?
Ha.

Ha.

It's not really a matter of the artwork, as much as the points that I made above. I wouldn't care if they painted the top of the disc black and put a title on it in big block letters. It's not really about the artwork, it's about not putting content on both sides, so that those of us without that ONE Sony model that will flip the disc for you can put the two discs in a changer.


Artwork and protection. I have never had a problem with any of my DVD10s (basically the same thing but 2 DVD5)
Well, you're lucky, then. I tend to handle my discs only by the edges and inside spindle, so generally it's not a problem, but I travel with discs a lot, and carrying sleeves tend to only put the soft cotton on one side, so it's easier to scratch the top of the disc sliding them into and out of the sleeve.

Also, and this may not be a problem for many, but my eyesight isn't so great and I can't tell at a glance which side is which. It's only an extra couple of seconds to see the TINY print around the spindle, but it's a pain in the neck to try to read which side is which. I try to put my discs away like a blind person would - I always put the disc back with Side 1 (or the Widescreen side) down, so that I can just pop the disc in the player.


I could only suggest staring at the box art, seems like the same thing to me.
Box art won't address the concerns I brought up above, I don't care how good the art is.


I never understood this argument. All of my DVD18s play fine. I think someone read an article once and ran with it.
Again, you're lucky. I went through three mis-pressed T2: UEs before finding the over-run copies they made with two DVD-9s.


And I don't see why anyone would want 2 discs when they can have one. Technology and advancement is a good thing. When I saw my T2UE was 2 discs, I immediately traded to get the DVD18 version. T2 is not a flipper by the way.
You don't see why? I outlined FOUR reasons above why *I* would prefer two discs to a flipper (even if the "flipped" side is simply special features, as on the T2 disc).

You may not have the same concerns or reasons, but surely you can understand why some other people may prefer two discs to a flipper. If not, I could try to explain it again using smaller words.

-- Jough
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Old 04-25-03, 04:17 PM
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Originally posted by Doug Schiller

Artwork and protection. I have never had a problem with any of my DVD10s (basically the same thing but 2 DVD5) I have over 550 DVDs and have yet to have problems with scratches. Even my Blockbuster discs work flawlessly. When I'm done watching them, I put them back in the case, no problems.
Granted it's relatively easy to avoid getting fingerprints and scratches on DVD-18s or DVD-10s. But it's still easier to avoid getting fingerprints on DVD-9s or DVD-5s, especially one-handed, when you're in a darkened home theater environment (not to mention that you might have popcorn salt and butter all over your hands too )

Last edited by spyzdope; 04-25-03 at 04:26 PM.
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Old 04-28-03, 06:49 AM
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Originally posted by jough


So there you go.
Eh?
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Old 04-28-03, 05:54 PM
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Originally posted by aam1
Eh?
I was commenting on the player that would automatically flip discs around and thus make the point of a DVD-18 verses two DVD-9s moot.

So there you go.

But most people do not have this player (do they? I know I certainly don't) so until they do, it's two DVD-9s for me whenever I can get them.

:P
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Old 04-29-03, 06:56 AM
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Originally posted by jough
I was commenting on the player that would automatically flip discs around and thus make the point of a DVD-18 verses two DVD-9s moot.
Ah, but if you have a multiplayer, a dvd18 would take up half as much space as a 2 dvd9s!
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Old 04-29-03, 03:45 PM
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Doug, you asked why people prefer 2 DVD-9's over a DVD-18. Jough gave you a detailed explanation with multiple reasons. Also, from the poll, almost 80% prefer two DVD-9's, and 2% prefer one DVD-18.

To each his own, though.

Last edited by Boshwok840; 04-29-03 at 03:50 PM.
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Old 05-21-03, 12:54 PM
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I have a jukebox. Definitely wish they had gone with a 3-disc set instead of a flipper.
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Old 05-21-03, 02:25 PM
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C'mon a flipper is nothing to be upset about. You get up...after 2 hours...flip the disc. It's VERY simple. Heck you can use that as a bathroom break or something if you want.

Really it's not something i stress out over. Especially when you consider the length of the film.
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Old 05-21-03, 03:15 PM
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Flipper discs seem cheap and unappealing to me, for no other reason than they remind me of R18 Silver CD-Rs.
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