Did Stigmata scare the hell into any of you?
02-03-00 | 09:01 PM
#26
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I don't know why everyone slams this movie so hard. While its not particularly scary, I thought it was a great movie. I was thoroughly engrossed the entire movie and enjoyed every minute of it. To me, it was a very suspenseful movie, and I happened to like the cinematography that others disliked. Even my wife liked it, who usually hates horror type movies.
02-03-00 | 10:49 PM
#27
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BY ROGER EBERT
"Stigmata" is possibly the funniest movie ever made about Catholicism--from a theological point of view. Mainstream audiences will view it as a lurid horror movie, an "Exorcist" wannabe, but for students of the teachings of the church, it offers endless goofiness. It confuses the phenomenon of stigmata with satanic possession, thinks stigmata can be transmitted by relics and portrays the Vatican as a conspiracy against miracles.
The story: In Brazil, a holy priest has come into possession of a lost gospel "told in the words of Jesus himself." In the priest's church is a bleeding statue of the Virgin Mary. The Vatican dispatches a miracle-buster, Father Andrew (Gabriel Byrne), to investigate. "The blood is warm and human," he tells his superiors. He wants to crate up the statue and ship it to the Vatican for investigation, but is prevented. (One pictures a vast Vatican storehouse of screen windows and refrigerator doors bearing miraculous images.)
The old priest in Brazil has died, and in the marketplace an American tourist buys his rosary and mails it as a souvenir to her daughter Frankie (Patricia Arquette), who is a hairdresser in Pittsburgh. Soon after receiving the rosary, Frankie begins to exhibit the signs of the stigmata--bleeding wounds on the wrists, head and ankles, where Christ was pierced on the cross. Father Andrew is again dispatched to investigate, reminding me of Illeana Douglas' priceless advice to her haunted brother in "Stir of Echoes": "Find one of those young priests with smoldering good looks to sort of guide you through this."
The priest decides Frankie cannot have the stigmata, because she is not a believer: "It happens only to deeply religious people." Psychiatrists quiz her, to no avail. ("Is there any stress in your life?" "I cut hair.") But alarming manifestations continue: Frankie bleeds, glass shatters, there are rumbles on the soundtrack, she has terrifying visions and at one point she speaks to the priest in a deeply masculine voice, reminding us of Linda Blair in "The Exorcist."
Now there's the problem. Linda Blair was possessed by an evil spirit. Frankie has been entered by the Holy Spirit. Instead of freaking out in nightclubs and getting blood all over her bathroom, she should be in some sort of religious ecstasy, like Lili Taylor in "Household Saints." It is not a dark and fearsome thing to be bathed in the blood of the lamb.
It is also not possible, according to leading church authorities, to catch the stigmata from a rosary. It is not a germ or a virus. It comes from within. If it didn't, you could cut up Padre Pio's bath towels and start your own blood drive. "Stigmata" does not know, or care, about the theology involved, and thus becomes peculiarly heretical by confusing the effects of being possessed by Jesus and by Beelzebub.
Meanwhile, back at the Vatican, the emotionally constipated Cardinal Houseman (Jonathan Pryce) rigidly opposes any notion that either the statue or Frankie actually bleeds. It's all a conspiracy, we learn, to suppress the gospel written in Christ's words. The film, a storehouse of absurd theology, has the gall to end with one of those "factual" title cards, in which we learn that the "Gospel of St. Thomas," said to be in Christ's words, was denounced by the Vatican in 1945 as a "heresy." That doesn't mean it wouldn't be out in paperback if there were a market for it. It does mean the filmmakers have a shaky understanding of the difference between a heresy and a fake.
Does the film have redeeming moments? A few. Arquette is vulnerable and touching in an impossible role. I liked the idea of placing her character within a working-class world; there's a scene where a customer in the beauty shop resists having her hair treated by a woman with bleeding wrists. And Nia Long has fun with the role of Frankie's best friend; when your pal starts bleeding and hallucinating, it's obviously time for her to get out of the house and hit the clubs.
"Stigmata" has generated outrage in some Catholic circles. I don't know why. It provides a valuable recruiting service by suggesting to the masses that the church is the place to go for real miracles and supernatural manifestations. It is difficult to imagine this story involving a Unitarian. First get them in the door. Then start them on the Catechism.
"Stigmata" is possibly the funniest movie ever made about Catholicism--from a theological point of view. Mainstream audiences will view it as a lurid horror movie, an "Exorcist" wannabe, but for students of the teachings of the church, it offers endless goofiness. It confuses the phenomenon of stigmata with satanic possession, thinks stigmata can be transmitted by relics and portrays the Vatican as a conspiracy against miracles.
The story: In Brazil, a holy priest has come into possession of a lost gospel "told in the words of Jesus himself." In the priest's church is a bleeding statue of the Virgin Mary. The Vatican dispatches a miracle-buster, Father Andrew (Gabriel Byrne), to investigate. "The blood is warm and human," he tells his superiors. He wants to crate up the statue and ship it to the Vatican for investigation, but is prevented. (One pictures a vast Vatican storehouse of screen windows and refrigerator doors bearing miraculous images.)
The old priest in Brazil has died, and in the marketplace an American tourist buys his rosary and mails it as a souvenir to her daughter Frankie (Patricia Arquette), who is a hairdresser in Pittsburgh. Soon after receiving the rosary, Frankie begins to exhibit the signs of the stigmata--bleeding wounds on the wrists, head and ankles, where Christ was pierced on the cross. Father Andrew is again dispatched to investigate, reminding me of Illeana Douglas' priceless advice to her haunted brother in "Stir of Echoes": "Find one of those young priests with smoldering good looks to sort of guide you through this."
The priest decides Frankie cannot have the stigmata, because she is not a believer: "It happens only to deeply religious people." Psychiatrists quiz her, to no avail. ("Is there any stress in your life?" "I cut hair.") But alarming manifestations continue: Frankie bleeds, glass shatters, there are rumbles on the soundtrack, she has terrifying visions and at one point she speaks to the priest in a deeply masculine voice, reminding us of Linda Blair in "The Exorcist."
Now there's the problem. Linda Blair was possessed by an evil spirit. Frankie has been entered by the Holy Spirit. Instead of freaking out in nightclubs and getting blood all over her bathroom, she should be in some sort of religious ecstasy, like Lili Taylor in "Household Saints." It is not a dark and fearsome thing to be bathed in the blood of the lamb.
It is also not possible, according to leading church authorities, to catch the stigmata from a rosary. It is not a germ or a virus. It comes from within. If it didn't, you could cut up Padre Pio's bath towels and start your own blood drive. "Stigmata" does not know, or care, about the theology involved, and thus becomes peculiarly heretical by confusing the effects of being possessed by Jesus and by Beelzebub.
Meanwhile, back at the Vatican, the emotionally constipated Cardinal Houseman (Jonathan Pryce) rigidly opposes any notion that either the statue or Frankie actually bleeds. It's all a conspiracy, we learn, to suppress the gospel written in Christ's words. The film, a storehouse of absurd theology, has the gall to end with one of those "factual" title cards, in which we learn that the "Gospel of St. Thomas," said to be in Christ's words, was denounced by the Vatican in 1945 as a "heresy." That doesn't mean it wouldn't be out in paperback if there were a market for it. It does mean the filmmakers have a shaky understanding of the difference between a heresy and a fake.
Does the film have redeeming moments? A few. Arquette is vulnerable and touching in an impossible role. I liked the idea of placing her character within a working-class world; there's a scene where a customer in the beauty shop resists having her hair treated by a woman with bleeding wrists. And Nia Long has fun with the role of Frankie's best friend; when your pal starts bleeding and hallucinating, it's obviously time for her to get out of the house and hit the clubs.
"Stigmata" has generated outrage in some Catholic circles. I don't know why. It provides a valuable recruiting service by suggesting to the masses that the church is the place to go for real miracles and supernatural manifestations. It is difficult to imagine this story involving a Unitarian. First get them in the door. Then start them on the Catechism.
02-03-00 | 10:51 PM
#28
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From: Florida
mcifani,
First, you put words in my mouth that I never said. I said the way you talk and act is the basis of values and to god's good will. I didn't say you can't ask for forgiveness from the lord. Someone who kills someone then prays to the lord must be truthfully sincere. I said its bad to drink to get drunk, not to drink a couple beers during an occasion or celebration. Everyone makes mistakes and learn from them. You can't keep making the same mistakes then say, lord please forgive me I was wrong. Like you said, its your outlook on life and how you treat each other. I mentioned on this thread and others that you criticize others based on their beliefs. By the way, I had a lot of friends and still have friends who have drug problems. They try to quit but they can't help from doing it, but they know its bad and are good human beings. Just because they do drugs doesn't mean their a bad person, but if they cause harm to others and dont feel remorse thats something different. To put in perspective, I stated that its against god's will and good values to drink to get drunk, curse or act badly towards another human being. I never said you couldn't be forgiven. Most of your before mentioned paragraph attacks me as if I said that and I didn't. Im saying you can't continually do immoral things then one day say god please forgive me. I know god is in all of us and he loves us all even for our sins, but you have to show him the same love as well.
One last thing, I am sure your a real cool guy but think before making fun of someone or criticizing next time. I have a good sense of humor as you might be able to tell from my before posts on this thread, so I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. I respect your views and I hope you respect mine, so hopefully we won't have to bother anyone by posting to this thread again.
To everyone else who might be reading this, sorry for the debate but it had to be done, hehe.
This is edit is due to The Zizz and his post before mine. I was saying this film interpreted some things wrong and this just proves my point. Once again, it was a good topic but was a horrible movie overall.
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-DVDjunkie21
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[This message has been edited by DVDjunkie21 (edited February 03, 2000).]
First, you put words in my mouth that I never said. I said the way you talk and act is the basis of values and to god's good will. I didn't say you can't ask for forgiveness from the lord. Someone who kills someone then prays to the lord must be truthfully sincere. I said its bad to drink to get drunk, not to drink a couple beers during an occasion or celebration. Everyone makes mistakes and learn from them. You can't keep making the same mistakes then say, lord please forgive me I was wrong. Like you said, its your outlook on life and how you treat each other. I mentioned on this thread and others that you criticize others based on their beliefs. By the way, I had a lot of friends and still have friends who have drug problems. They try to quit but they can't help from doing it, but they know its bad and are good human beings. Just because they do drugs doesn't mean their a bad person, but if they cause harm to others and dont feel remorse thats something different. To put in perspective, I stated that its against god's will and good values to drink to get drunk, curse or act badly towards another human being. I never said you couldn't be forgiven. Most of your before mentioned paragraph attacks me as if I said that and I didn't. Im saying you can't continually do immoral things then one day say god please forgive me. I know god is in all of us and he loves us all even for our sins, but you have to show him the same love as well.
One last thing, I am sure your a real cool guy but think before making fun of someone or criticizing next time. I have a good sense of humor as you might be able to tell from my before posts on this thread, so I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. I respect your views and I hope you respect mine, so hopefully we won't have to bother anyone by posting to this thread again.
To everyone else who might be reading this, sorry for the debate but it had to be done, hehe.
This is edit is due to The Zizz and his post before mine. I was saying this film interpreted some things wrong and this just proves my point. Once again, it was a good topic but was a horrible movie overall.
AND THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THAT!
------------------
-DVDjunkie21
My DVD List
[This message has been edited by DVDjunkie21 (edited February 03, 2000).]
02-04-00 | 04:55 PM
#33
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Well, Everyone has there own view on a movie.. stigmata in my mind is still a great movie..
though I think we will all agree END OF DAYS just completely sucked!!!!
NOFX, once you rent or buy this movie, do post what you thought of it though!
later guys
though I think we will all agree END OF DAYS just completely sucked!!!!
NOFX, once you rent or buy this movie, do post what you thought of it though!
later guys
02-05-00 | 10:01 AM
#34
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From: The Land of Corn
I will say I didn't care for either one. I would definitely rent this on 2 for 1 day at the local video store. Like I said, it did have some cool effects in it, but it reminded me more of a music video than a film.
End of Days on the other hand just sucked ....period
End of Days on the other hand just sucked ....period
02-05-00 | 10:34 PM
#35
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From: Seattle
quote:<HR>Originally posted by NOFX:
i've created 2 beasts, i apologize.<HR>
Moderators, please ban NOFX for unleashing the hounds of hell on us poor innocent by-standers...
j/k NOFX
02-06-00 | 04:55 PM
#37
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From: Savannah, Ga
That Duck Guy: It was 100 times better than End of Days.
HAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHhAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhAHAHAHHHAAHHAAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHHAAHHA HAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.............
With the reviews Stigmata is getting in this thread, there is no way in hell!
I though End of Days was an excellent movie.
Jonathan
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why my avg. is $7.36
HAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHhAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhAHAHAHHHAAHHAAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHHAAHHA HAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.............
With the reviews Stigmata is getting in this thread, there is no way in hell!
I though End of Days was an excellent movie.
Jonathan
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why my avg. is $7.36
02-08-00 | 12:24 PM
#38
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From: The deepest recesses of your inner fears
DVDJunkie--
The line is "Take your stinking paws off me you damn dirty apes! Uttered by Charlton Heston in Planet of the Apes.
The line is "Take your stinking paws off me you damn dirty apes! Uttered by Charlton Heston in Planet of the Apes.
02-08-00 | 10:49 PM
#39
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quote:<HR>Originally posted by TdHtXs:
That Duck Guy: It was 100 times better than End of Days.
<HR>
End of Days was, without doubt, the biggest stinking turd of 1999. There was absolutely nothing good to be said about it.
Even Arnold seemed to be embarassed about it when he was doing publicity.
And how was it that they explained the significance of 1999 being the end of days. The numbers 666, meaning the sign of the beast, were seen in a dream. And sometimes in a dream numbers look upside-down and backwards...
Yeah, and I guess sometimes a mysterious "1" floats in front of them to form "1999"? Puke.
03-17-00 | 12:44 PM
#40
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DVDJunkie likes The Curve and Jack Frost!!! HAHAHAHAHA CHECK OUT HIS LIST!
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quote:<HR>Originally posted by mcifani:
This is why i hate this, people listen to people in this forum and don't order a dvd.. DONT LISTEN TO people in here about a movie, watch it yourself and decide!!! DVDjunkie21, please don't tell me what i am, or not.. just because someone calls another person a fool or whatever name, doesn't mean they don't have good values, you have no right to judge me because of one thing i said... You either like this movie or hate it i guess, I though it was very well made, for the people who disliked this movie, please post movies that you did like, I'm very interested in what movies you like since this stigmata WAS SO AWFUL... True stigmata was no Ben Hur, but it was a very good reglious movie, and it truly did scare me.. unlike that piece of crap exorcist, or other cheezy horror flicks.. this movie actually got deep within you.
<HR>
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I know you are but what am I?
03-17-00 | 02:42 PM
#41
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From: Florida
This is what I posted in the other Stigmata thread you revived just to criticiz me...
If you noticed Jack Frost was free, and The Curve is a movie I personally like since Matthew Lillard is one of my favorite actors. Its funny how you only picked out 2 of the movies I own, since I usually get complimented on my list. Maybe next time you can give your review and not criticize someone, eh?
I don't see why you felt the need to put that quote above, since mcfani and I came to good understanding. Maybe you should read all the posts on the first page, and not try to start something by posting one.
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My sometimes visited DVD List l My Pic
If you like stick figures and horror, then visit StickDeath.com!
If you noticed Jack Frost was free, and The Curve is a movie I personally like since Matthew Lillard is one of my favorite actors. Its funny how you only picked out 2 of the movies I own, since I usually get complimented on my list. Maybe next time you can give your review and not criticize someone, eh?
I don't see why you felt the need to put that quote above, since mcfani and I came to good understanding. Maybe you should read all the posts on the first page, and not try to start something by posting one.
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-DVDjunkie21
My sometimes visited DVD List l My Pic
If you like stick figures and horror, then visit StickDeath.com!
03-17-00 | 02:55 PM
#42
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From: marshall,mn.,usa
not bringing up the dead or anything, but, mcifani, if you are such a great christian, then why are you calling someone a fool. i did drugs, stole, and got arrested, and i don't go to church. but, i tell you what. i don't go around calling someone a fool on forums because you don't like something he said. everyone has a right to express their opinion. you better shape up cos there isn't much space left in heaven.
03-18-00 | 12:20 AM
#43
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From: Kalamazoo, MI, USA
How ridiculous! You people really have a tendency to act like children. That's the beautiful thing about the Internet; you can bash each other without doing it face-to-face. GROW UP!!!
