People have been claiming that the New 52 is temporary since before it even launched. Its two years later and there is no end in sight.

I don't like a lot of the things they did with the New 52, but I'm not in denial that its ever going to go back to the old ways. DC has NEVER reverted to an older continuity. NEVER.

When the Silver Age started with new heroes like Barry and Hal, DC eventually just merged the old Golden Age heroes like Jay and Alan into the Silver Age by creating the multiverse concept. They never reverted to the old continuity, they just merged them.

Then when COIE happened, they never went back to the older Silver Age continuity. They later merged some of the concepts like with events like Zero Hour in the 90s, but they never reverted.

So they aren't going back to the pre-New 52 continuity either. At best, we might see some of the old concepts brought back and merged, but that's the best we can hope for.

DC is bringing the New 52 into their animated stuff now as well. Also Six Flags Superman rollercoaster has been changed to the New 52 Superman. The New 52 is here to stay. Its not going anywhere.

Maybe DC never really reverted back to an older continuity (and why would they)? But they have abruptly changed course and, like you said, given in to the fans and incorporated the old stuff back in.

The huge thing about Byrne's post-Crisis Superman was that he was depowered, his Kryptonian heritage was completely different, and most importantly (for whatever reason) he was the sole Kryptonian alive. Supergirl as we knew her, gone. No more Superboy, which royally screwed the Legion (which, up until the new 52, has always gotten screwed over with these changes). Creators come in who were much fonder of their silver age memories, and we have the old Krypton back, some version of Supergirl back (heck, a whole city of Kryptonians), the Legion back, etc. Byrne himself retconned back in the Golden Age Wonder Woman. Johns, largely responsible for bringing back the Legion, brought back Hal Jordan and Barry Allen (which had been teased for years and years but never done). He brought back the JSA. The multiverse, the entire reason for Crisis on Infinite Earths, came back. Heck, didn't they finally retcon Monarch to be Captain Atom, as was originally intended, some years back? Most of this stuff took years and years and years. So I have my doubts that the new 52 is "here to stay" any more than any of this other stuff.

Marvel's a bit worse, of course... they set up a new status quo every few months (ie: every event). They just don't pretend to care as much about continuity, and basically shift the timeline.

So after almost 2 years which of the new 52 hold up as the best?

Wonder Woman

Shazam! You're right PS, that site reads like something I would have written, if I had kept up with the note-taking, continuity-fact-checking, character-reference-list-making ways of my youth.

I spent hours just scanning his page and reviews, ruining my COIE plan and sleep last night and explaining today's 3 hour nap. Now I think I'll start my DC quest even farther back in time; digging out my Crisis on Multiple Earths trades right now.

I really doubt they cave in to the fans that much. Most of the stuff that is brought back isn't because fans actually demand it, but rather because its what the people writing the stories want. For example, Geoff Johns is a huge Silver Age fanboy, and that's the reason why he brought Hal and Barry back. Over at Marvel, Joe Quesada broke up Peter and MJ's marriage not because the fans wanted it, but because Joe Q personally hated the marriage.

If DC really listened to fans, then Cassandra Cain, Stephanie Brown, and Wally West would still exist. Tim Drake wouldn't have been so badly butchered, and he would still have his own solo Robin series if DC gave in to fans.


Well yeah, stuff like the mutliverse coming back, Johns' hardon for Hal and Barry and bringing them back, and so on were all in the mid 2000s. COIE was 1986. So that was a span of 20 years. Sure the changes from COIE weren't permanent, but they weren't really temporary either. 20 years is a long time.

Everything changes given a large enough timespan. Even people change over a large period of time. I am certainly not the same person I was now that I was 20 years ago.

I do fully expect DC in 2033 will barely resemble the New 52 era we have now, but I still wouldn't call the New 52 temporary because 20 years is a long time. Temporary to me would seem like DC getting rid of the New 52 era in the next 5 years or so, and that just isn't going to happen. Heck, Snyder's Batman Zero Year story arc is a full year long itself. Its 11 issues which will actually take 12 months to publish since September is Villain's Month with a break in the normal schedule for all those .1, .2, .3, .4, etc issues.

Wake up, the multiverse is already starting to come back into play with DC. They've already started a comic called Earth 2, set in a totally different continuity.

http://www.dccomics.com/comics/earth-two/earth-two-1

The new 52 won't be the primary DC continuity in seven years...it all hinges on Dan DiDio and how long he remains in his current position.

Yeah, I know about Earth 2. There's also the World's Finest series which is also set on Earth 2.

So what? Just because there is a multiverse doesn't mean that the New 52 universe is going to end anytime soon. That is REALLY REALLY stretching. Hey you know what? There's also a Batman '66 comic based on Adam West as part of the multiverse. Maybe the New 52 will end and we go back to the Adam West era... That makes about as much sense as the logic that Earth 2 means the New 52's days are numbered.

People have been saying the New 52 will be temporary since ever before it launched. These people are purely dreaming. Its like the people that have been saying Nintendo is going the way of Sega for the last 15 years or religious people saying Jesus is coming back soon for the last 1,000 years.

You can wish in one hand and crap in the other, and lets see which gets filled first.

Yes, there's a 99% chance there will be another reboot in 20 or so years, but the New 52 isn't going away anytime soon. Why would it when comics sales have dramatically increased the last two years? Comic sales are at the highest point now than they were throughout the entire last decade.

Its not just Dan Didio after all. Its the whole board of directors that demanded they do something to increase comic sales. They aren't going to revert back to something that wasn't selling as well. DC is a profit based business in the end. The New 52 is selling well, so there is zero reason to end it.

I didn't say the new 52 would go away, it will simply be another line of continuity. Marvel seems to have no problems maintaining two parallel universes as an ongoing concern.

I'm not exactly sure how DC will handle it, I don't think an exact duplicate of the pre-52 DCU is coming back.

There have been rumors for years now that the Ultimate Universe is going to be shut down, though I don't know the validity of it. I do know that not wanting to confuse readers is what led to COIE in the first place, and that if I were a new reader trying to get into comics I'd be super confused about the Ultimate and regular marvel universes.

I do wonder about all the new readers. The hype has certainly died down, so I'm wondering if people who came back because of the new 52 are really still around or if it's largely the same set fanbase just spending more money (I realize it's probably a combination of both, based on increased sales)? Certainly this whole villains month would tick me off if I were a regular reader. What seems like creators being treated poorly, creators jumping ship, and editorial wielding a lot of power turns me off as well. But that may just be a minority complaining about that.

I do know that, with a few exceptions, DC was in the dump sales-wise and creatively prior to the new 52. JMS had just finished slaughtering the Superman and WW franchises, and Robinson/Bagley on Justice League was pretty bad. And it got them a ton of attention and increased sales, so it was the right thing to do, and putting premier creative teams on stuff like Action and Justice League certainly made those books better.

Marvel and DC aren't the same though and don't always do the same things.

Its really only been recently that Marvel has been able to successfully maintain an alternate universe with the Ultimate line. Their previous attempts at alternate universe ongoings, such as the 2099 or MC2 universes, were never big sellers. Ultimate has really been the exception, not the rule.

I still don't see why you think an Earth 2 ongoing really means anything. If anything Earth 2 is more of an Elseworlds alternate universe kind of thing, and DC does that stuff all the time so its nothing new. Kingdom Come universe, All-Star universe, the Earth One graphic novel universe, Batman '66 ongoing, Superman: Red Son universe, the Batman becomes Dracula universe, and countless others.


Yeah, those rumors have been around since about 2007-2008. The Ultimate universe sold very well in the early 2000s because the main 616 universe wasn't very good back then and Ultimate was a lot better. Sales of the Ultimate universe rapidly declined in the late 2000s which led to a lot of back-to-back gimmicks to increase sales.

Gimmicks like the Ultimatum storyarc killing more than half the characters, relaunching with shiny new #1 issues, killing Peter Parker and replacing him with Miles Morales, etc.

All those gimmicks resulted in short lived increases in sales, and sales have begun to plummet again. I remember originally Marvel claimed that Ultimate would never cross over with 616 because doing so would mean that they have run out of ideas and Ultimate would be creatively dead. Well last year they had the Spider-Men crossover where 616 Peter met Ultimate Miles. I have also read online that there was a very recent storyarc in which 616 Galactus was shown getting ready to enter the Ultimate universe to devour it. A lot of people are wondering if this might finally be the end of the Ultimate universe.

Its possible that with these 616 crossovers some of the more popular Ultimate characters like Miles Morales might live on in 616 while Galactus devours the rest of the Ultimate universe. And heck, hasn't Ultimate Nick Fury already made the transition to 616? I read online that there was a miniseries in which it was revealed that 616 Fury has a son who looks just like Ultimate Fury.

Yeah, because of the movie-verse, they had to turn Fury into Sam L Jackson Fury, in the most eyeroll-inducing way possible, but hey, that's comics for you.

What is the deal with the first Superman new 52 annual? I just realized I don't have it since I got into the game late and bought most of the issues off of ebay. The sellers on there want like 60 bucks for it, whereas the Action comics one you can get for $5. Was it some super limited exclusive or something?

Good question! The original DC Comics solicitation might shed some light:

I dunno who the "mysterious new GL" was, but I'd guess that's the reason for the demand.

Its probably Simon Baz, the Arabic Green Lantern DC introduced last year.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Baz

Huh, $60?? I think you're just not looking at the right auctions. This one is available for $5:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/Modern-Age-1...w+DC+52+Comics

And there were a couple others in the last couple months that closed at $2.50 and $4.99, respectively.

Strange. I search Superman annual #1 new 52 and that auction doesn't come up in results.

DC strikes again. This time, they're telling retailers that the villains month issues with the special covers will be heavily allocated, so not all orders will be filled; at the same time, retailers can order non-special-cover issues for a dollar less. I'm sure this will create a speculative feeding frenzy for these issues, which is once again just getting bleeding the pocketbooks of the fanbase that's already collecting this stuff. Oh, but if you really want the covers, you can get all of them in second edition form, bundled up for $199, which begs the question, why didn't they make more first editions to fill orders?

From SavageCritic:
http://www.savagecritic.com/retailin...entertainment/

You know it's true.

I think practically every move that DC and Marvel makes these days is a publicity stunt. It wouldn't surprise me if this had been planned all along.

Now with the allocation, this is quite literally the resurgence of the gimmicky, limited edition holographic covers. Welcome speculators! I'm surprised they're not polybagging them with cards or something.

I used to collect cards as well, and unfortunately was a big ole stupid ass during that ~1990 crap. I probably have a longbox of worthless card/comic polybags.

^ Ditto.

Marvel started polybagging a couple of years ago. They still do it on occasion (Age of Ultron #10). They also did a special holographic cover for Age of Ultron #1. But they didn't charge extra for it.

Oh, geez. This blog post brilliantly analyzes everything that's wrong with DC nowadays: http://whenwillthehurtingstop.blogsp...13/08/sir.html

Long but worth it.

Seems more like a bitch-fest about aspects of the DCU he doesn't like, ymmv. It's coherently written but I don't agree with virtually any point it makes. He wants to change the nature of the Spectre and all sorts of other nonsense. He's upset that Barry Allen is boring.