Yeah, uhmmmm, that is probably b/c of the disease he has that nearly ended his career.


And, I have immense respect for his Savage Dragon work.

Hitch did start off as an Alan Davis emulator, though he's grown a lot since then... I always wondered why Davis doesn't get as much respect as he probably should, considering the accolades surrounding Hitch.

Of course, if you're going to emulate, might as well emulate from the best and go from there. Travis Charest started off as a Jim Lee impersonator (that early Flash annual and Darkstar issues were somewhat painful), but developed into one of my favorite, although slowest, artists. Phil Jiminez still has that Perez influence, but has also grown a lot. The Dodsons always reminded me of Adam Hughes, but thankfully they've been a little more prolific. And while this may just stem from similar influences, I always thought Ed McGuiness drew like the late, great 'Ringo.

Then, of course, you have guys like Marat Mychaels and all the Liefeld impersonators who I haven't seen around for some time.

Now where the heck is a good Art Adams clone?

Oh, trust me, I know. Alan Davis is easily my favorite superhero artist, and one of maybe 3 artists who's every single work I will buy. His work slowed down mostly due to a childhood wrist-injury that has gotten worse since he got older. I'm really looking forward to his ClanDestine relaunch.

I didn't know about Larsen's disease.

Yeah I was hoping for your comments on this matter. All the comments from you guys make sense. I'm going to talk to the owner and see what's up.

At the store I go to, i've seen some books "shorted" while others were "overed". It doesn't happen on a weekly basis, but occasionally. Also, i'm not sure how your book handles the distribution of the books, but when I used to fill the files, the store was open and customers would try grabbing the books on the shelf before we could fill customer's orders (we'd unpack the boxes, sort everything out, make sure the quantities were correct and then fill orders). But, again, that was more of an "occasional" thing.

I wondering why Alan Davis doesn't do more. He was a really prolific artist in the 80s and 90s. Love his work.

It seems like Hitch has gotten really sloppy lately though; perhaps time constraints really got to him. I really liked his work on Authority, but his JLA and Ultimates work just weren't up to the same quality.

Jimenez's art used to borrow heavily from Perez, but his work in Infinite Crisis seems to borrow more from Davis and Hitch. I guess he's like Kaare Andrews, who can draw extremely clean, consistent art, but doesn't really have a style to call his own.

Me neither, as I observed him to be a in good spirits the last couple of times I saw him at Heroes Con. So what's the story?

He kinda talks about it in this thread.

And if anyone hasn't read his last work (Fantastic Four: The End), you really need to. The story's alright (he wrote it too, but his writing work on Excalibur was much better), but the art is some of the most beautiful superhero work I've ever seen. I bought the mini, but I had to buy it again when the hardcover came out, just to get it all under one cover with no ads.

That's bullshit. If you don't think Bagley -- or John Byrne or Walt Simonson or Jack Kirby or any of the countless other artists who can turn out a monthly (or more!) with no problem -- are good artists, then you've got poor aesthetic tastes. Conversely, I don't think Jim Lee is a particularly good artist, no matter how long he takes to do a page.

The reason people like Lee and Hitch miss deadlines is because, though some combination of their own stupidity, their editors' stupidity, and their publisher's stupidity, they keep winding up in situations where they can't draw fast enough to meet the deadline. Look, if Brian Hitch can only put out 3 pages a week, I have no problem waiting because the pages do look beautiful. But don't schedule him for a monthly 20-pager.

One other thing that Sessa didn't mention is that this time of year in particular, stuff sometimes gets delayed going out to the West Coast due to the weather.

I think we all should realize that the speed with which artists can churn out pages is not a barometer for how good or bad they are. The final product is the only thing that should be judged. I would say of the people you mentioned, who can put out pages faster than hell, they are "smarter" artists in that they know when to pull back on the detail and when to go all out. Bagley is kind of sick with how quick he puts out, and while he may not be my favorite artist based on his style, his work never looks rushed to me and always has a high level of quality. When you go and really look at some of his books though, you can see some simple backgrounds or no backgrounds at all in some scenes. Thing is, the lack of a hyper detailed background doesn't hurt the story at all. So he is a master story teller in knowing just what a page calls for and what isn't necessary.

I think guys like Hitch and Lee only have the one mode: hyper detailed. The way they cut corners to get a book out faster is to have splash pages, which is overly obvious versus what Bagley does. I think it's a little ridiculous to say Jim Lee isn't a good artist. I understand his style might not be one that you enjoy, but the dude obviously has talent to spare. But art is subjective so there is no point in arguing the point. We like who we like.

I do agree that lateness, barring the instances of unforeseeable emergencies and/or sickness, can almost always be blamed on stupidity. With so many comic artists being so accessible (in interviews, blogs, podcasts, cons, etc) I feel like I've come to a point where I can sort of understand what it takes to get a monthly book out. And frankly, I think that system is broken. There are some gifted artists (like Bagley) who can maintain a certain level of quality while also drawing multiple pages a day. However, there are some artists who just cannot meet that pace. Some would just chalk that up to laziness, but I think that is bullshit. Different artists have different speeds. There are other artists who can keep the monthly pace, but have to really kill themselves to do so. And then there are your Hitch's and Lee's and Quietly's.

And I think the obvious fix to almost ALL lateness is for better scheduling. If an editor understands the talent they're working with, and the speed it takes them to deliver pencils, then simply make sure they have that time. How hard is that to understand? And of course some artist would procrastinate with having so much time, and again it is on an editor to be on the artist to keep the pages coming on a regular schedule. If this was done effectively, I think 90% of all lateness issues (on mainstream books) would be solved.

You will hear the argument that the big two can't give an artist too much lead time because of the costs that go into creating a comic, and if that book isn't being sold a lot of money gets tied up. My answer to that is how many mini-series get canceled at Marvel or DC due to low sales? Almost none, right? And series get canceled due to low sales, but they almost always get a handful of issues out before they go away. So it shouldn't matter if a series that is going to get canceled still has a few issues in the can. If anything that would give the writer and artist enough time to give a canceled series some closure.

I think I'm rambling so I'll stop. My main point is I don't like blaming the artists so much as the publishers. The publishers are enablers of lateness. You know those really morbidly obese people who are bedridden? The big two are the mother that insists on continually making them a stack of pancakes, a half dozen scrambled cheesy eggs, and 15 pieces of toast.

Not to disrupt the whole monthly issue debating, but has anyone read SENTENCES by MF Grimm? Not a bad graphic novel at all. i enjoyed it. If you like rap music or gang-type films/stories, then I recommend you at least check it out from the library and giving it a read.

It's on my "to buy" pile. Just haven't got around to ordering it yet.

*ahem*You should work on your reading comprehension before replying. Oh, and throwing Kirby's name in with other "fast" artists is pretty fucked up - dude was on an entirely different level, along with Byrne and Simonson, who were exactly the guys I had in mind when making the exception.

I agree. Kirby, Byrne, and Simonson are on a totally different level than Bagley.

However, his point was that a good artist usually just takes more time, not necessarily that all artists that are quick are bad artists.

Here's an example of why I think Lee is not a particularly good artist:



In this picture, Robin looks like he's dislocated his hips. His right leg is bent at an impossible angle. And the perspective on the buildings is wonky -- each one seems to have a different vanishing point.

I'm not saying his art can't be aesthetically pleasing. If you like it, more power to you. But I think he's using a lot of style and flash to cover up some real shortcomings in the fundamentals.

OK, I could throw out a dozen or two more names of good artists who can turn out pages quickly enough to draw a monthly book (Bill Sienkiewicz, Barry Kitson, Jeff Moy, Stuart Immonen, Tom Grummet, Keith Giffen, Brent Anderson, John Romita Sr. and Jr., Tim Truman, Ty Templeton, Mike Allred, Charlie Adlard, Tom Scioli, Jim Starlin, Kyle Baker, John Buscema, Tony Harris, etc., etc.) You could tell me that they are on an entirely different level than the guys you had in mind. We could go on and on.

Some good artists take time to do pages. Some do them relatively quickly. Some bad artists take time to do pages. Some take time. Hitch's problem isn't that an artist needs to take eight weeks (or whatever) to draw a book well. It's that he needs to take eight weeks (or whatever) to draw a book well. And even that's not a problem, as long as he isn't given an assignment that demands that he take less than eight weeks to draw a book.

You could say the same exact things for Simonson, who's way more "style over fundamentals" than even Lee is. But I think you're letting your subjective dislike for Lee's art cloud your objective take on it.

Oh and speaking Byrne and Simonson, they actually make great examples for my case - as soon as Byrne started churning out more than one book a month (circa '92), his art took a big hit. And when's the last time Simonson had a regular monthly? Thor? That was like 25 years ago, and even during that run, an issue or two before a fill-in artist would step in, you could see the quality of his work drop.

Basically, all artists would be better if they had more time. Heck, any artist (comics or otherwise) will tell you that no work he does is truly "done" - if they wanted to, they could keep working on one piece into infinity. The trick is to know when to stop - some stop too late, and some stop too soon.

Very few of those you named have churned out monthlies for more than a year (that is, they've either had many fill-in artists, or few months breaks during their runs to catch up), the others, well, like I said above, stop too soon, and the rest kinda suck... Maybe that's too strong - but everyone you named is a lower caliber than the artists I tend to like, which rarely, if ever, do monthlies longer than 6 or 8 months in a row.

slop, Simonson's art is like Kirby's art in the 1970s or 1980s, or Gil Kane's, or Carmine Infantino's. It was very stylized, but you could tell they understood the rules of anatomy and perspective. You have to know the rules of art before you can know when and how to break them -- and I've never seen any evidence that Jim Lee knows the rules of art.

Byrne was doing two monthlies as early as the 1970s. And while I don't necessarily care for a lot of his more recent work, I don't think it's fair to say it has slipped.

Walt Simonson has done a ton of stuff since Thor. Fantastic Four. The Avengers. X-Factor. Orion (and if you haven't read that one, do yourself a favor and track it down -- it's amazing!) During Simonson's run as writer/artist on Thor (about 30 issues), he had two fill-in issues. They were consecutive, and came immediately after the Surtur Saga, generally considered to be the high point of Simonson's run. In any event, I'm not sure why it matters whether we're talking about a book today or a book 25 years ago -- the bottom line is Simonson is (or was, if you prefer) capable of doing a monthly book without blowing deadlines. And if he's no longer capable of doing so, more power to him for not signing on to do so.

As for my list of artists, I'd like to know who you think can't do a monthly for more than a year (Brent Anderson and Tim Truman are, off the top of my head, the only two who may not be able to), and who you think is "lower caliber" than the artists you tend to like. For that matter, who are those artists?

Out of the ones you named, the ones I really like are Mike Allred, Jim Starlin, Bill Sienkiewicz and Tony Harris. As much as I like Allred, I don't think his art on X-factor/Xsatic was too hot, which afaik, was the only time he really did a monthly - his minis are awesome though. Tony Harris was great on Starman, but would get way behind. And ExMachina has had many breaks in order to let him catch up. The only monthly I recall Sienkiewicz doing was early New Mutants, which I thought looked pretty shitty - it's his fully painted graphic novels that look awesome - and he certainly doesn't do those monthly. I can't even recall what Starlin's last monthly was - it must have been thirty years ago*.
edit *(it was Dreadstar, which I loved, which also looked worse with each passing issue, until it couldn't go monthly)

The other artists I like, but to a lesser degree, are Kitson, Immonen, Romita Jr., and Tim Truman. But (besides Truman) their stuff is so straight forward and almost plain, of course they're able to meet monthly deadlines. The art from the rest of the guys you listed I'm either not familiar enough with or don't care for at all.

And since you asked, some of my favorite artist are (off the top of my head - I'm sure there's more):

Alan Davis (as I mentioned earlier, my favorite superhero artist)
Barry Windsor-Smith (probably my favorite overall artist, by far - too bad he's been MIA)
Michael Golden (another MIA)
Art Adams (also hasn't done nearly enough work lately)
George Perez (I'm digging Brave & Bold right now)
Alex Ross (even when he's just finishing other people's art like in Justice)
J.H. Williams III (his work on Promethia was astounding, and almost monthly for 32 issues)
Jeff Smith (did anyone like his Shazam as much as I did)
Michael Kaluta (I'm not sure what he's been up to recently)
John Bolton (actually, since he experiments so much, he's sort of hit and miss, but when he hits... wow)
Charles Vess (he actually makes fairies cool)
Brian Bolland (wish he'd do less covers and more interior art)
I also really dig this forum's own Ethan VanSciver.

And from the above, besides William's Promethia run (which he was given extra time to finish anyways), only George Perez has done a monthly with any sort of consistency. Davis did it once on Excalibur, but when he got ahead of schedule on it (and turned his art in early), they burned off the books by going bi-weekly, thus putting him behind schedule (true story).

Anyways, I really think the artists I named off are only good because they do take their time with their art, and can't turn in that quality of work on a monthly basis - I'm sure they could stick to schedule if they had to, but their art would suffer for it, as would most any artist - that' all I was saying.

Definitely check out his work on Madman and The Atomics -- both of which are being reprinted in trades from Image. Trippy, cool, fun stuff.

You're right. Tony Harris shouldn't be on a list of guys who can do a monthly.

Check out his work on Moon Knight (reprinted in Essential Moon Knight volumes 1 and 2). It's really cool to see him evolve from Neal Adams clone at the begining to the Bill Sienkiewicz we know and love by the end. That also gets at the point I was trying to make with respect to Jim Lee -- Sienkiewicz doesn't just start out with his expressionist style. He evolves into it slowly, building off a foundation in the basics.

Kid Cosmos, which he's been doing off-and-on throughout the 2000s. He's also doing Death of the New Gods, though that's a mini, and I'm not sure how much he drew before they started soliciting it.

I'm not sure what you mean by "straight forward and plain." Are you suggesting that the reason Rob Liefeld can't meet a deadline is because he's drawing all those tiny lines he seems to love so much all over the place?

I'm not sure which ones are "not familiar with" or "don't care for at all," so here's a quick bibliography for each.

Jeff Moy -- artist on Legionnaires back in the 1990s. He's mostly left the industry due to lack of work, and is now working for Raven Software.

Stuart Immonen -- All sorts of stuff. Currently, he's doing Ultimate Spider-Man, but he's got a list of credits going back to the early 1990s.

Tom Grummet -- I don't know what he's up to these days. He was penciler on Thunderbolts for a few years before the Ellis/Deodato relaunch

Keith Giffen -- He's been knocking around the industry since the 1970s. Most recently, he did the layouts for every single issue of 52. He's also done full pencils on a bunch of stuff over the years (my favorite stuff is his work on LSH back before he discovered Jose Munoz)

Brent Anderson -- All sorts of stuff since the late 70s. Strikeforce Morituri, for one. Astro City, for another (that's not monthly, but the hold-up is not due to Anderson).

John Romita Sr. -- Whether this is "not familiar with" or "don't care for at all," you sir are a heathen and a philistine. Good day to you!

Ty Templeton -- I said good day!

Oh, all right.

Ty Templeton -- All sorts of stuff, which you would probably say is easy to put out quickly because it's relatively cartoony. He did Batman Adventures for a few years, and the Spider-Man/Human Torch mini of a few years ago, and some other stuff I can't think of offhand.

Charlie Adlard -- Walking Dead

Tom Scioli -- G0dland

Kyle Baker -- The Bakers, Plastic-Man, Why I Hate Saturn, Cowboy Wally, and a bunch of other cool stuff. Another guy who's relatively cartoony.

John Buscema -- he's in the John Romita Sr. category.

All good artists, and many are among my favorites as well (if Kaluta's done anything since he did covers for Books of Magic, I can't think of it).

As for Smith's Shazam, that one was a miss for me. It just didn't feel like Captain Marvel to me.

Many of those guys were monthly at various points in their careers (Windsor-Smith, Golden, etc.)


And all I was saying is that if these artists can't turn in high quality work on a monthly basis, then I don't want them to be forced to do so. But the fact that they take longer doesn't mean their art is better than someone who takes less time -- it just means they take longer to draw. Ain't no shame in that, but there ain't no shame in being able to meet a monthly schedule. Different people draw at different speeds. It's not as if every hour you spend on a page gives you one more "Art Quality Point," and JR Jr. decides to phone it in at 5 Art Quality Points while Art Adams is willing to give his fans 20 Art Quality Points on every page.

Ty Templeton is a really good artist and writer. I said it a while ago, but his run as writer on Batman Adventures is one of my all time favorites. Just a shame it got cut short thanks to fucking someone thinking two comics based on Batman cartoons couldn't co-exists (BTAS and The Batman comics). He has some really solid work under his belt on both sides of the fence, and I don't get why he isn't a bigger name.

I guess I should contribute my "best/worst artists" list...and try to input something new, with less historical ruminations

1. Brian Bolland. This guy's line-art is incredibly smooth, detailed, expressive, and his style is incredibly unique. You'll never see consistent monthly work or specials from him though - it took him nearly 2 years to finish The Killing Joke. I guess he's of the mind that good art takes time, as he's a self-professed perfectionist. There isn't ever a single weak panel in TKJ, and his covers are the reason why I was buying Batman books for a long time.

2. Scott Kolins. Love cartoony styles along the lines of Ed McGuiness, Mike Weiringo, etc etc. This guy really helped carry the Flash books with Johns.

3. Jae Lee. Incredibly detailed, rich artwork great for dark storytellling. What i really love is how incredibly stylized and dark his work is but the heavy contrasts, dark palette, and somewhat surreal art isn't ever unintelligible.

4. Michael Lark, John Paul Leon, Sean Phillips. Their dark, noir style is great for the stories they craft. You can't see anyone else doing these books because the art is such a huge impact on the way the story is told.

5. Frank Quitely. Love this guy's art. It's so expressive that it almost seems like it's in motion. Some people really complain about how ugly his characters appear, but it's a refreshing change from the vapid perfectionism that permeates comic art.

Now, for the worst:

1. John Romita Jr. I really hated this guy for a long time. His work on Uncanny X-men was mediocre, amateurish, and lacking especially compared to his peers. His style is almost never consistent and his work on Spider-man is really just being carried by good computer coloring and inking. All his characters look exactly the same, he can't draw likenesses, and his settings aren't consistent or unique. Ultimately one of the weakest artist in the industry that seems to get so much headlining just because of his legacy.

2. Chris Bachalo. When you read a comic, it helps if you can actually tell what the hell is going on.

3. Steve Mcniven. Another talent whose art is carried by detailed computer coloring and inking. His characters never move realistically, his proportions are always off, and the dynamics of a scene are never consistent (example, character is moving one way, hair/body is actually appearing to move another way).

4. Michael Turner. A cheap Jim Lee/Mark Silvestri rip off at first, his Prima-Donna attitude as well as inability to draw any more than a few poses or splash pages make his art extremely weak. And apparently, he can't draw feet.

Sound advice. I used to go to a comic shop that was on the way to work, so I could grab my fix every Wednesday morning. Then for about 4 weeks straight I'd go in and ask if there was anything pulled for me, and they'd say no. Then I'd go straight to the new comic shelf and grab 1-4 titles that should have been pulled. I tried to be patient, but finally I told the guy in front of about 5 or 6 other customers that I was no longer coming in because he couldn't keep a simple pull list straight. I understand missing an occasional title, but not missing everything for one month.