Duane Swierczynski is my single favorite author right now & I know at least a couple of you are hard-boiled fans like myself, so you know who his is, for those that aren't run out now, put down your funny books & go buy The Wheelman, or The Blonde right now.

Now my interest in all things "X" related has pretty much died, but I've always thought Cable was such an underrated character & I loved his on-going series, so I'm pretty psyched for this. Not the type of comic I would ever, ever have pegged Swierczynski to tackle as his first comic book gig, as I'm sure that 99% of the fans that would read Cable, have never heard of the guy. I have not clue what the premise of the new Cable series is going to be, but Ariel Olivetti is going the art, which isn't that bad.

It would be soooo fuckin' awesome if Swierczynski did a story-arc on Criminal. This is the first creative news I've been psyched about from Marvel since Criminal began.

Cable? As in Cyclops' son? Isn't he dead?

I wouldn't call Criminal a "Marvel" book. It's published under the Icon imprint, and is independent of the Marvel Universe.

I don't know what to make of this. I didn't really like Lapham's mainstream work despite loving Stray Bullets. And most of the time when I see an indy writer move to a mainstream book the results end up being mediocre, and sub-par compared to their previous work. Unless they're given the right level of creative freedom, and have flexibility as a writer, it's just going to fall flat.

Grant Morrison is probably one of the best indy writers to ever transition to the mainstream. But then again...he had the ability to bring a lot of his great ideas with him. You can tell there was a real strain on his work on JLA though - most fans and critics agreed that the worst aspects of the book were when he couldn't bring his ideas into full fruition, and when changes in the DCU encroached upon his stories. Although he seemed to run with it better than most writers could have - he made Electric Superman interesting to read!

...then again, as much as I love Seven Soldiers, All-Star Superman, Batman, et al, it pales in comparison to Zenith and The Invisibles.

It's published by Marvel, of coarse it's a "Marvel" book.

I'm not really seeing the points you are trying to make. What is the connection b/w Lapham & Swierczynski? One is a novelist making his comic debut, the other is an established comic book writer for over 25 years.


Again, I just don't get what the connection is. This isn't an independent comic book writer, this is a mainstream prose author. And even if it was an "indie" writer, I still don't see what you are basing your point on. The greatest writer in the history of the medium, a guy named Alan Moore started as an "indie" creator, & went on to literally change one of the most iconic characters in the history of the medium. What about a guy named Brian Michael Bendis? I think a few people read his comics. Warren Ellis, Garth Ennis, Ed Brubaker (IMO writing the 2 best mainstream books Marvel publishes), Mike Allred, Brian Azzarello, Greg Rucka (a great example, started w/ prose, then went indie, & then went on to write absolutely brilliant mainstream work. I can go on & on, with the writers that started on independent comics & then put out some of, if not their absolute best work under the big 2 publishers.

I couldn't care less about Cable, but I'm looking for some hard boiled books to read, so I think I'll check the guys novels out.

Of the two, which one would you suggest reading first?

I think calling it a Marvel book is about as justified as calling anything put out by DC "WB" books. Just because it's the parent company doesn't

It's a writer moving into the comic book mainstream. If you want a better example, think of Brad Meltzer...and his work is seriously lacking.

I can think of another great comic writer who started in the indy field: Chuck Austen.

This makes absolutely no sense. We aren't talking about who owns the companies, only the publisher. Criminal is published by Marvel, hence it is a Marvel comic. Plus the original issue at hand, was me referring to the best news creatively out of Marvel was the creative team of Criminal, & it was just that, news that came from Marvel about was of their comics. Again, making it a Marvel comics.

Yeah, but you weren't talking about a novelist moving into mainsteam, you were specifically talking about an "indy comic book writer". Which was not relevant to Swierczynski. I'm also judging by your posts that you clearly haven't read anything he is written.

Again, this makes no sense. You state that "most of the time" indie writers flop on mainstream work. You are saying that a majority flop, yet all you can name is one that failed (& I'm pretty sure is first published comic was War Machine, which is a mainstream Marvel book), while I rattled off a bunch succeeded phenomenally just to start. Your just making a blanket statement that just isn't true.

Actually it is published under a subsidary, Icon. It has its own editorial staff and everything. Anyway, I just didn't like how you associated it with the MU since it does not take place within the MU, does not associate with MU characters, and can't be ruined by any writer for Marvel.

Icon = creator owned, very little editorial/company control, each comic is a self-contained world - save for when they break the 4th wall

Marvel = company owned properties, heavy editorial direction, each comic takes place in a larger world

I admit I haven't but that doesn't make my point unnecessarily invalid. My point was that a lot of writers I really like that publish under their own creative control who move to a mainstream book usually flop because they don't have the same level of creative freedom they had before, and don't really get to exercise their full creative potential.

Actually, Chuck Austen's first work was on Miracle Man, although that was only as an artist. He published under a pseudonym for years. Anyway, that's besides the point. The writers you listed all got to stardom on books that didn't limit their creative potential.

Brian Michael Bendis: Hit stardom with Powers and later Torso, indy/creator owned books. Later hit the mainstream under Ultimate Spider-man, which allowed him creative freedom to do what he pleased with the Spider-man character, as it didn't take place in the regular MU. His Daredevil is very displaced from the regular MU both in continuity and in execution. It's a real look at some superheros that wouldn't otherwise be seen.

Warren Ellis: Hit stardom with The Authority and Planetary, for which he was given a great deal of creative control to guide a large portion of the Wildstorm universe - which allowed him a great deal of freedom.

Garth Ennis: Hit stardom with Preacher, yet another creator-owned property. His Hitman work was spotty and critically divided. Broke into the Mainstream with Punisher - yet another book isolated from the MU with a great degree of creative control.

Ed Brubaker and Greg Rucka: Best mainstream work on Catwoman and Gotham Central in the DCU, and i'm sure you'll agree. You'll also acknowledge these two books were the sort of grim noir that these two specialize in.

last, but not least:

Alan Moore: Never really broke into the mainstream so much as wandered in every now and then. You'll notice he took every chance to leap upon total creative control to do what he wanted with characters that didn't allow him the freedom - Watchmen with the Charlton Comics characters and Supreme with Superman. You'll also notice how quick he was to leave mainstream comics.

My point was this, in case it wasn't clear enough:

A writer that succeeds in another medium or the same medium in which he/she is granted a great deal of creative freedom is not guaranteed to produce the same level of work as previously displayed if they are denied their creative freedom. That is not to say that they are a bad writer. They simply cannot reach their full potential. Furthermore, some writers are best left to the indy/creator owned field.

...And just so you don't think i'm threadcrapping or anything, this is a good thing.

1. For indy writers, it finally gives them the recognition they deserve. It also brings attention to work that lingered in obscurity, which can now reach a greater audience with a larger print run/TPB.

2. Comicdom needs more diverse writers. However, this also does not always have benefits. Kevin Smith, JMS, Brad Meltzer, all hit stardom almost immediately but now face relentless criticism over story quality.

3. Lastly, a good writer might be able to turn around a mediocre book. And as far as mediocre books go, Cable is the top of the heap.