Gene Wolfe
03-07-02, 08:16 PM
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Gene Wolfe
Has anyone else read his stuff? I'm currently reading On Blue's Waters, and it's one of the best pieces of modern literature I've read in a years.
Yes, I said "literature". It might be classified as sci-fi, but it's so much more than that. What really surprises me is that it is actually a retelling of The Odyssey, into which he somehow manages to fit his own story. I won't ruin it for you.
This is one of his best works in along time and can't wait to read the other books in the "Short Sun" trilogy. If you haven't read his stuff, I highly recommend starting with his brilliant "Shadow of the Torturer" and moving on through his other books.
You won't be dissapointed.
Yes, I said "literature". It might be classified as sci-fi, but it's so much more than that. What really surprises me is that it is actually a retelling of The Odyssey, into which he somehow manages to fit his own story. I won't ruin it for you.
This is one of his best works in along time and can't wait to read the other books in the "Short Sun" trilogy. If you haven't read his stuff, I highly recommend starting with his brilliant "Shadow of the Torturer" and moving on through his other books.
You won't be dissapointed.
03-08-02, 01:14 PM
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Agreed, most days he is my favourite and I've mentioned him hereabouts once or twice before in passing.
I am lucky enough to have the latest series you mention still to read: I've just re-read the two Soldier Of books, the New Sun sequence and am 90% through Exodus from the Long Sun, the final of the four Long Sun books.
This probably won't mean much to most readers here, but I'll post a draft of something I wrote for another (non-internet) forum:
I am lucky enough to have the latest series you mention still to read: I've just re-read the two Soldier Of books, the New Sun sequence and am 90% through Exodus from the Long Sun, the final of the four Long Sun books.
This probably won't mean much to most readers here, but I'll post a draft of something I wrote for another (non-internet) forum:
[....] I do now tend to the opinion that a major part of what Wolfe is writing about is to do with how we process information and the effect of this process on "understanding". [Those who have read Wolfe already] know about the puzzles; the frequent descriptions of dreaming; storytelling within the tales themselves; how we deal with memory or apparent lack of (some component part) of it; religious experience; the nature of divinity.
After witnessing Wolfe engaging in his familiar, tricksy (yet engaging) tactics it all seemed to me - after a while - as representing aspects of the same thing i.e. this "information processing" idea. The puzzles often untangle themselves with time: sometimes we didn't even know there was a puzzle until one or other character has a - usually understated - eureka moment. The dreams and stories are sometimes shown as representative. This is especially true of the dreams recorded in Latro's scroll (in the "Soldier of...." books); ostensibly written in a time when the gods walked among us. And, in the New Sun books, Severian learned that one tale or play might crudely and/or obscurely be representative of an earlier tale or actual happening. In the New and the Long Sun books Wolfe shows us technologies sufficiently advanced so as to be indistinguishable etc etc but also hints at a "real" divinity. In these two works he uses the holographic idea of a god or an entity that can split itself into many parts and have them act in the real world while the original contemplates eternity (or something) in some other dimension.
It all resolves to how we the readers - through the characters portrayed - are able to determine what we/they are perceiving and what it signifies. And with Wolfe I would suggest that almost everything is somehow significant. Layers of meaning are unravelled as a character's perceptions improve or evolve. Early on Patera Silk, for example, is offered a vision of what lies outside his world and keeps on improving on his intepretation as his awareness of the wider picture increases.
There are some weighty concepts that Wolfe throws around, albeit frequently in an oblique or tangential manner. At one point in a Long Sun book the bird the author refers to Patera Silk as being Orek's god. To me there seemed to be a clear analogy between the semi-sentient beast's relationship with (and perception of) his "owner" and that of the owner with his god(s).
Also of interest was Wolfe's deliberate portrayal of religious practice on the generation starship as being so similar to that of the ancient world of Latro - in the Soldier books. Scratch a modern man and you soon find a (noble) savage!? And the "gods" are equally as capricious and self-serving; is not surprising given their origins. Obviously, syncretism is something that is bound up in Wolfe's works: things achieve new meanings in new ages and/or when looked upon with new eyes: current practices are often traced back by characters and/or the narrator to earlier traditions.
I have to admit that I had difficulty following the "time" theme of the New Sun books particularly where the alien (?) visitors were involved. I suspect that the resurrection in the fifth book was somehow related to the fact that Severian(s) had wandered the passages of time. One point that was more clear on this re-reading was the "coincidence" of Severian so frequently meeting again people from his past: even in the final book when rescued at sea he came across an old classmate. For Severian, the Journeyman, there really was nothing much new under that sun.... with learning, experience and time his logical prowess increased and there were fewer and fewer blank areas for him to fill.
After witnessing Wolfe engaging in his familiar, tricksy (yet engaging) tactics it all seemed to me - after a while - as representing aspects of the same thing i.e. this "information processing" idea. The puzzles often untangle themselves with time: sometimes we didn't even know there was a puzzle until one or other character has a - usually understated - eureka moment. The dreams and stories are sometimes shown as representative. This is especially true of the dreams recorded in Latro's scroll (in the "Soldier of...." books); ostensibly written in a time when the gods walked among us. And, in the New Sun books, Severian learned that one tale or play might crudely and/or obscurely be representative of an earlier tale or actual happening. In the New and the Long Sun books Wolfe shows us technologies sufficiently advanced so as to be indistinguishable etc etc but also hints at a "real" divinity. In these two works he uses the holographic idea of a god or an entity that can split itself into many parts and have them act in the real world while the original contemplates eternity (or something) in some other dimension.
It all resolves to how we the readers - through the characters portrayed - are able to determine what we/they are perceiving and what it signifies. And with Wolfe I would suggest that almost everything is somehow significant. Layers of meaning are unravelled as a character's perceptions improve or evolve. Early on Patera Silk, for example, is offered a vision of what lies outside his world and keeps on improving on his intepretation as his awareness of the wider picture increases.
There are some weighty concepts that Wolfe throws around, albeit frequently in an oblique or tangential manner. At one point in a Long Sun book the bird the author refers to Patera Silk as being Orek's god. To me there seemed to be a clear analogy between the semi-sentient beast's relationship with (and perception of) his "owner" and that of the owner with his god(s).
Also of interest was Wolfe's deliberate portrayal of religious practice on the generation starship as being so similar to that of the ancient world of Latro - in the Soldier books. Scratch a modern man and you soon find a (noble) savage!? And the "gods" are equally as capricious and self-serving; is not surprising given their origins. Obviously, syncretism is something that is bound up in Wolfe's works: things achieve new meanings in new ages and/or when looked upon with new eyes: current practices are often traced back by characters and/or the narrator to earlier traditions.
I have to admit that I had difficulty following the "time" theme of the New Sun books particularly where the alien (?) visitors were involved. I suspect that the resurrection in the fifth book was somehow related to the fact that Severian(s) had wandered the passages of time. One point that was more clear on this re-reading was the "coincidence" of Severian so frequently meeting again people from his past: even in the final book when rescued at sea he came across an old classmate. For Severian, the Journeyman, there really was nothing much new under that sun.... with learning, experience and time his logical prowess increased and there were fewer and fewer blank areas for him to fill.
03-08-02, 03:28 PM
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You are really going to love On Blue's Waters. Much superior to the Long Sun books, also being told from Horn's point of view.
There are at least 4 different levels to the story. His retelling of "The Odyssey" is the most obvious. Something that happens at the end of the Long Sun is confusing and shocking, and it's a major element in The Short Sun plot.
He is brilliant. It's hard for me to stop gushing when I speak of his work. What's sad is that more people aren't reading him. Maybe it's because he's too literal and challenging, I don't know. Maybe it's because he writes in the sci-fi genre (although I think these books are nothing about sci-fi, they just happen to take place there). I know alot of "literary" type feel they are "above" sci-fi and refuse to read it, let alone recognize it as a valid form.
His books will never make good movies, that's for sure.
Benedict, do you know if he participates in any forums on the net? I'd love to get some feedback directly from him, but I'm sure most of his answers will be along the lines, "figure it out for yourself".
There are at least 4 different levels to the story. His retelling of "The Odyssey" is the most obvious. Something that happens at the end of the Long Sun is confusing and shocking, and it's a major element in The Short Sun plot.
He is brilliant. It's hard for me to stop gushing when I speak of his work. What's sad is that more people aren't reading him. Maybe it's because he's too literal and challenging, I don't know. Maybe it's because he writes in the sci-fi genre (although I think these books are nothing about sci-fi, they just happen to take place there). I know alot of "literary" type feel they are "above" sci-fi and refuse to read it, let alone recognize it as a valid form.
His books will never make good movies, that's for sure.
Benedict, do you know if he participates in any forums on the net? I'd love to get some feedback directly from him, but I'm sure most of his answers will be along the lines, "figure it out for yourself".
03-08-02, 04:55 PM
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<small>
</small>I suspect that he does not participate regularly (not even sure if he has internet access!) but, from articles I've read over the years, I gather that sometimes he will tell people if they are wrong, or.... 
I recall once reading that there was a PO Box contact address but you can always write care of his agent.
In the meantime:
Originally posted by Eric F
[....] do you know if he participates in any forums on the net? I'd love to get some feedback directly from him, but I'm sure most of his answers will be along the lines, "figure it out for yourself".
[....] do you know if he participates in any forums on the net? I'd love to get some feedback directly from him, but I'm sure most of his answers will be along the lines, "figure it out for yourself".
I recall once reading that there was a PO Box contact address but you can always write care of his agent.
In the meantime:
03-08-02, 07:04 PM
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Thanks for those sites.
I didn't realize he was in his 70s already. Hopefully he still has a few more books left in him. The good thing about him is that he doesn't release books in a series untill they're all finished.
I don't want to name names (Tad Williams, Terry Brooks), but so many series start off well and turn to crap because it takes so long for the authors to finish.
But Gene Wolfe is on another level. As far as modern sci-fi writers go, IUrsala K. LeGuin, Bradbury, Asimov, Clarke and Vonnegut come close, but you can tell, they're hardly "modern" anymore (in one case, dead).
I can't think of any yung-uns coming up in the sci-fi genre worth reading. The two I mentioned before aren't all that good, not after reading Wolfe.
I didn't realize he was in his 70s already. Hopefully he still has a few more books left in him. The good thing about him is that he doesn't release books in a series untill they're all finished.
I don't want to name names (Tad Williams, Terry Brooks), but so many series start off well and turn to crap because it takes so long for the authors to finish.
But Gene Wolfe is on another level. As far as modern sci-fi writers go, IUrsala K. LeGuin, Bradbury, Asimov, Clarke and Vonnegut come close, but you can tell, they're hardly "modern" anymore (in one case, dead).
I can't think of any yung-uns coming up in the sci-fi genre worth reading. The two I mentioned before aren't all that good, not after reading Wolfe.
Last edited by Eric F; 03-08-02 at 07:07 PM.
03-09-02, 04:09 AM
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<small>
</small>I forgot his age until I was looking through those sites.
I never really quite knew whether the fifth New Sun book was an afterthought....
.... so far as I know the only series he has left uncompleted thus far is the "Soldier of...." and a third one is in the works!
Concerning other writers, David Zindell contemplates philosophical matters in an intelligent often lyrical manner. I posted a review of his latest a while ago. If you haven't already read Jack Vance, his Dying Earth writings have been collected. They are an admitted influence on Wolfe.
Originally posted by Eric F
I didn't realize he was in his 70s already. Hopefully he still has a few more books left in him. The good thing about him is that he doesn't release books in a series untill they're all finished.
I didn't realize he was in his 70s already. Hopefully he still has a few more books left in him. The good thing about him is that he doesn't release books in a series untill they're all finished.
I never really quite knew whether the fifth New Sun book was an afterthought....
.... so far as I know the only series he has left uncompleted thus far is the "Soldier of...." and a third one is in the works!
Concerning other writers, David Zindell contemplates philosophical matters in an intelligent often lyrical manner. I posted a review of his latest a while ago. If you haven't already read Jack Vance, his Dying Earth writings have been collected. They are an admitted influence on Wolfe.
09-04-04, 06:20 AM
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<small>
</small>I see he has another one out!!!
Well, part one, with the second out towards the end of the year.
I think this should be a case of "run, don't walk, to your bookstore!!"....
Originally posted by Eric F
Hopefully he still has a few more books left in him. The good thing about him is that he doesn't release books in a series untill they're all finished.
Hopefully he still has a few more books left in him. The good thing about him is that he doesn't release books in a series untill they're all finished.
Well, part one, with the second out towards the end of the year.
I think this should be a case of "run, don't walk, to your bookstore!!"....
Last edited by benedict; 09-04-04 at 06:25 AM.
09-16-04, 03:52 AM
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I read The Knight a couple months ago. Like all of Wolfe's books, I felt like I was missing a lot of what he was trying to convey. I did enjoy the novel, amd I'm looking forward to the sequel.
