superfro

Most of the things you do are in a tightly timed aspect in the game, thus if you're needing to back up and make a running jump, you've probably already lost.

Decker

LIMBO - 800 points.

Very disappointed in mini-discount.

pinata242

Wow, that's weak. 400 points and it would be a no-brainer. 600 I'd recommend it. 800 is really pushing the boundary.

Odds are it'll be on sale again in the future, maybe even a deep cut like 'Splosion Man's $2 sale a few weeks ago. If you're not hurting for stuff to play, I'd still say wait until the next sale.

Decker

I think I will wait. I've spent a lot recently (including 1200 on the Vietnam expansion --totally worth it). I just feel upset right now. I've waited for weeks for LIMBO to be discounted and they give that weak sauce discount? The least (pecentage-wise) of any game during this sale? As their big finale? That's messed up.

superfro

It's worth the $15. I can't roll my eyes hard enough at this.

Decker

Yeah? I think i should have been 800 points all along. The demo was nice and all, but didn't really thrill me.

I spent 1200 Points on Lara Croft. It got reduced to 600.
I spent 1200 Ponts on Monday Night Combat. It got reduced to 600.
I spent 1200 Points on Hydro Thunder. It got reduced to 400.
(I got an 800 point rebate eventually, so total cost to me was 2800 points. Total for those games purchased from this sale is 1600 points)

I pass on LIMBO, deciding to wait for the end of the year sale. It only gets dropped to 800.

Explain to me why I should be happy at this turn of events. I feel like I got screwed. Again. Certainly, LIMBO will be this price again. It might be cheaper in the future and it might not, but there's no way that they don't at least match this price with a future sale, right? I don't feel any compelling need to grab this now that it's been reduced a whopping 33%.

pinata242

pinata242

Hey, just fudge the numbers and move the 800 point rebate you got to this sale. That means you get LIMBO for free! Right?

Decker

After I've just bought Mafia II for $12, Battlefield Bad Company 2 for $6.67, Super Meat Boy for $3.75, The Witcher for $5, Amnesia for $4.80 and FEAR Complete for $10, it seems like 800 points ain't such an enormous deal for LIMBO, artistic achievement or not.

And if I'm going to get lectured for being too cheap to buy it on "sale", I want that person to at least have paid the full price for the game with his own funds.

superfro

So don't. (In fact why do you even care if the game didn't even thrill you?) But nobody screwed you. And certainly not because it didn't get as big of a discount as you happen to believe it should've. That's just typical entitlement bullshit. As highlighted by the framing of your reasoning of buying the other games that were deeper discounted at full price when originally offered. If you don't feel any of those games were worth the price you paid for them then that is on you for making poor purchasing decisions. It's not all of a sudden Microsoft dicking you around because they discount the games 5 months later.

And I would have had I not been given a review copy. For full price. And I'm not attempting to lecture you for being too cheap. I was saying I feel the game is still worth $15, and thus $10 is still a good deal. My eyerolling is in regards to the "anger" about it.

But...does getting a review copy make me unable to have a valid opinion on the game from a price point perspective? Like equating value to gaming purchases is a foreign concept to anyone that has ever gotten anything for review purposes?

Decker

You make some good points. But shouldn't I feel entitled to get this game (which, let's be honest, has been promised to us since the beginning of this sale with a really obvious clue) at least the same discount (at least 50% off) that each and every one of the previous eleven XBLA games featured in the daily deal got? If they were all discounted 50% or more and this game was discounted 3% would that be okay since it's such a great game? I think a precedent was clearly established in this sale over the previous ten days of discounts and I think it's a shitty thing to suddenly shrink that discount on the last day of the sale just because you have a very highly anticipated title

I don't know about that. Getting stuff for free clearly changes your perspective of worth. It's fundementally different than paying for things, on a basic almost emotional level. I try to think of myself in a similar situation for comparison. Pharma guidlines have drastically changed things (can't even get a free pen any more), but back in the "good old days" I used to be given lots of stuff for free from drug companies. I got some amazing perks that were probably worth lots of money. Show tickets, concerts, gourmet dinners and weekend retreats. Would I have paid hundreds of dollars of my own money for those experiences? No, but I still think they were worth hundreds.
When you say "Limbo is worth $15", I believe you. I clearly trust and value your opinion. But if someone else says "I paid 1200 points for that game and I don't regret it at all", that might carry more weight.

Chew

I'm with Decker: disappointed in the Limbo discount after a week of amazing sale prices.

I don't need it right now either, I can wait.

foxdvd

Limbo is on a lot of game of the year lists...and is selling better than the other games...it does not need as big a discount....

One of the rare 15 dollar XBLA games that I felt ok with spending 15 bucks on...but I wanted to play it bad after the demo...so if the demo did not do anything for you skip it...

Kedrix

The discount does feel weak, I'm with you guys too. Ain't it a 2-3 hour game anyway? Anywho, I'm still wondering when we are going to get some Deathspank sales (unless I missed them), but I digress.

MoviePage

Absolutely worth every one of the 1200 points I spent on it, and I'm usually first in line to bitch about getting screwed by post-purchase price drops or sales. I've played many games this year, and Limbo would be very near the top of my list.

mattysemo247

I'm going to pass on Limbo for now as well. I've spent more on this recent sale then I have in the past three years on XBL stuff so I'm good for now.

Decker

I might still grab it today. It certainly seems like it's worth 800 points. Assuming I get over my disappointment before New Year's, I'll probably grab it sometime today.

And a closing thought on A World Of Kefflings -- I really enjoyed it. I'm done now, built everything. It's a cute game, not at all difficult. Nothing too special, just fun to mess around with. Now I have nothing left to do except building more and more empty buildings until I finally unlock that final achievement of building 100 building. I put 9 hours in total. What a waste of time!

superfro

This is actually a perfect example. I really want the follow up, but I know it'll be on sale at some point down the road and I have a HUGE backlog, and the first to even finish yet so I'm waiting. However, if it ever does go on sale and it's for only $5 off that is not Microsoft screwing me. (Or better yet, them discounting the orignal DeathSpank is not screwing me because I decided to buy it for $15.) I just don't get that point of view. Well I do, because it's prevalent in a lot of places online anymore, but it's just such a childish reaction. Previous purchases do not "qualify" you for some kind of reward or benefit in this situation. The discount isn't a loyalty program. Again, I totally understand being disappointed with the price cut not being as deep, but to take it personally is a whole other deal.

Also...this.

So you listen to no reviews from major sites? Because hardly any of those reviews are going to be based on personally purchased product. Isn't that one of the keys in the reviewing process? Just because you're provided something for free you still need to evaluate it as though it wasn't. I understand it can cause people to have a different reaction, but I guess that's the difference IMO between good and bad reviewers. I strongly disagree with getting something for free means you can't offer a valid or grounded opinion on it's overall value to the buying public.

Decker

Fair enough. I'll concede that you are capable of assigning fair worth to XBLA games, even those you receive for free if you, in return, can give me a logical well-reasoned explanation for why you feel this short, single-player-only game with no local co-op or online capabilities, no bonus level DLC and extremely limited re-playability is worth $15 instead of the standard $10 rate. And that argument can't be based solely on the stated opinion that it's really good.

The year's best CDs don't list for any more than Justin Bieber's. Movie tickets to The Social Network don't cost 50% more than Little Fockers just because it's a much better film. You might pay a premium for night and weekend showings, for Imax, for 3D. Hell we even have a theater with moving chairs in it for a price. But the quality of the product does not figure into ticket pricing. And it shouldn't figure into XBLA pricing either.

superfro

I've offered my thoughts on the game, and I'm sure you know where to find them. But in short the game keyed into my artsy-fartsy indie side immediately. The entire design aesthetic alone would've maybe been enough to make me want to purchase the game. Add in the sound production, tight platforming action styled gameplay, and the overall experience and it was a no brainer for me. "Extremely limited re-playability" is entirely opinion based. I can play through the game as many times as I want and it's still enjoyable. I don't see that as any different as watching a movie over and over. I don't need a prize of some sort every time. The experience is the reward and the reason for doing so. However, when I discussed the game I'm pretty sure I was clear about it not being a game that everyone would enjoy. In fact I think the minority of gamers in general would even give a shit about it.

Also, $10 is no longer the standard right? Didn't that officially move to $15 with Summer of Arcade? That's another reason though why it's not a cut and dry issue. There are many factors. Paramount for me is people needing to be ok with a $15 game offering them 2-3 hours of gameplay and that being "worthwhile". I've paid almost $15 to see a 90 minute movie. Why is that justifiable but a 2-3 hour game isn't?

But we're not talking about standard pricing. (However that argument wouldn't hold up there either, as you have releases that are priced $5,$10,$15+ and those are all based on many factors. I would assume 'quality of product' included in some cases.) We're talking about discounts. It's not at all uncommon for things that don't have to be on sale not going on sale or not doing as big of a discount. To continue with your theater example, movies that do better box office take longer to get to cheaper second run theaters, take longer to come out on DVD, etc.

MoviePage

For me, Limbo single-handedly ended the "can videogames be art?" argument. There's just no question that it's a significant artistic achievement, and it should be the title that comes up first in the debate henceforth. I never thought I'd be able to describe a videogame as Bergmanesque, but this one fits the bill.

slop101

Why? Just because it's in silhouette? Would it still be art if it were the same exact game, but with bright, rudimentary 8-bit graphics? I'm just asking because you give no real reason as to why it's art - sure, it has elements of art in it, but what is it that makes the GAME art? Again, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, I'd just like to hear your reasoning. Reasons matter.

MoviePage

Not just because of the look of it, although that's certainly part of the overall aesthetic, but also because of its exploration of ideas related to death and the afterlife, and perhaps most importantly, its subjective presentation of these elements which allows for a variety of interpretations. The fact that many people have written many hundreds of words attempting to fathom the game's true "meaning," often coming to completely different conclusions, really says it all as far as I'm concerned. For me, it was a very meaningful and emotional experience.

MrX

I'd never played a Keflings game before but I downloaded the demo for the new one and then bought it. I think I played it for almost 2 hours tonight It was a nice change after investing 75 hours in Fallout: NV.

If anyone wants to send me some collectibles for the achievement that would be much appreciated

orangecrush

I agree. Getting a weak discount is still getting a discount. Decisions about what to buy should be solely based on perceived value. If you think a game is worth 800 points and not 1200, buy it at 800. Were people who bought braid on sale a while ago screwed because Braid got a price drop to 800 points?
Many reviewers (especially long time video game reviewers) don't really address value at all when it comes to media. I think that getting the use of something for free does change your perspective on it. On the other hand, paying for something also affects your opinions too. People often overvalue things that they have bought.

I really like DVDTalk's skip, rent, recommended, collectors. I also like CAG's recommended price. Ultimately value is subjective.