Console Wars: Tech/Specs Thread
05-26-05, 11:37 AM
#26
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: In the Universe.
Posts: 2,923
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by joshd2012
A couple things to note about PS3:
1) The Cell processor only has 7 of its 8 cores available because one of them will be running the background OS exclusively. Its not available for game developers to use.
1) The Cell processor only has 7 of its 8 cores available because one of them will be running the background OS exclusively. Its not available for game developers to use.
05-26-05, 05:24 PM
#27
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: HB, CA
Posts: 2,600
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by joshd2012
1) The Cell processor only has 7 of its 8 cores available because one of them will be running the background OS exclusively. Its not available for game developers to use.
Originally Posted by joshd2012
2) It will use 7 controllers because that is the limit of the technology. BluTooth can support 1 master and 7 slaves - thus, 7 seven controllers.
Originally Posted by joshd2012
3) There are 3 ethernet ports - one input and two outputs. It has been hinted at that Cells can only communicate at the Gbit transfer rate, so in order to connect Cells, you would need to connect them directly using this port. Thus, the PS3 should beable to connect to two other Cell operating devices - like a DVR or TV or Blu-Ray burner, etc.
05-26-05, 06:28 PM
#28
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Posts: 6,677
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by belboz
If you've got a link to a better explanation of what you're trying to say, I'd appreciate it. Ethernet doesn't have in/out ports. On a switched network, it'll run at full duplex or otherwise it can run at half duplex (I/O on the same port, just taking turns).
Gigabit Ethernet support seems like overkill at first, considering that home broadband service doesn't carry nearly that much bandwidth. But when you look at the number of Ethernet ports available on the machine, it starts to make more sense. Chatani talked about the availability of an HD IP camera peripheral, which would presumably be plugged into one of the gigabit Ethernet ports. The camera will allow you to broadcast an HD-quality video stream, for video messaging and conferencing, and more. The presence of so many ports also leaves open the unspoken possibility that other high-bandwidth peripherals might be plugged into the PS3: a digital video recorder or another PS3, perhaps?
05-26-05, 06:50 PM
#29
DVD Talk Legend
Based on the specs sony released at e3, the PS3 is theoretically supposed to be up to 25% faster than Xbox360, but with factors such as the PS3 being more difficult to program for (to take advantage of the subcores etc...), the systems should end up being very similar. PS3 should also cost alot more to produce overall (between the cpus and gpus and the fact that they want to stick so many ports in the thing).
The PS3 spec will no doubt change alot between now and next year. Meanwhile, the microsoft has already sent the 360 beta kits to developers who had previously been working with highly modified G5s basically as alpha kits for the past year - they were supposedly 1/3 the power of what the 360 is expected to be. ATI has really outdone themselves with the GPU for the 360.
Originally, Microsoft was prepared to lose the battle in both their first and second generation and hoped to be established enough by their third generation to dominate the field. Now they are pretty confident that they can come out on top this generation... especially after seeing what the competition came up with. Rumors about Nintendo releasing a retro machine turned out to be true and many were a bit shocked to see how unprepared Sony was.
The tables have somewhat turned from last time between Sony and MS - last gen, MS was focused on hardware muscle dominance while Sony focused on software - giving huge concessions to major publishers for exclusive rights to key games while MS stuck to their policies and treated every publisher like the next. This time, it looks like MS is going to be the one with the must-have software and an unprecedented list of launch titles. Meanwihle, Sony spent E3 focused on the PSP and what appeared to be a rushed PS3 prototype touting the hardware power and ignoring the games. They have plenty of time to prepare a decent launch lineup for next year when they debut, but they also might be hoping to coast on the huge PS2 library like they did when they launched the PS2 with PS1 titles. Their original marketing campain for the PS2 was genius and it created a need to own one - especially with Japanese buyers.
Given the specs of both systems, they are both going to cost more than consoles have traditionally come out priced at. Even at 500, both MS and Sony are going to be taking signifigant financial losses on hardware. As an example - the GPU the 360 is going to use from ATI is a few generations ahead of what is currently available for PCs... they plan to release it for PCs in a few years at a price point of 500 bucks. And Sony appears (to many) to have simply taken specs for the 360 and announced specs that would be somewhat better. "360 has 2 USB ports? We'll have 6!" "360 has 3 cores? We'll have 7!" Sony has plenty of time to get their act together though and they simply didn't have as much time to prepare as MS spent on it. I think they were caught by surprise a little bit by what MS had to show.
Last I heard, 360 was going to still have both the less expensive version (just as a pricing gimmick) and the full featured version which would include wifi and a hard drive. The idea was to connect all sorts of devices to the 360 (hence the name)... it is certainly aimed at being alot more than just a video game console. The PS3 is expected to have similar aspirations. Nintendo may have originally come up with this idea back in the NES days - I remember reading an article my dad saved for me from the Wall Street Journal (this was ages ago) describing how Nintendo wanted to make the NES a central hub for communication and home shopping among other things. It took us this long to see this sort of thing realized.
In other news... Ted Turner is launching a service similar to what the Phantom was intending to offer - essentially beating them to the punch... the kicker is that Ted's service is not going to require any special hardware... just a PC. Ted reported that publishers have already agreed to offer around 300 games so far.
All this info is probably old and useless, but I haven't been reading the long threads much around here. But basically - until Sony releases real specs, it's kinda useless to compare...
The PS3 spec will no doubt change alot between now and next year. Meanwhile, the microsoft has already sent the 360 beta kits to developers who had previously been working with highly modified G5s basically as alpha kits for the past year - they were supposedly 1/3 the power of what the 360 is expected to be. ATI has really outdone themselves with the GPU for the 360.
Originally, Microsoft was prepared to lose the battle in both their first and second generation and hoped to be established enough by their third generation to dominate the field. Now they are pretty confident that they can come out on top this generation... especially after seeing what the competition came up with. Rumors about Nintendo releasing a retro machine turned out to be true and many were a bit shocked to see how unprepared Sony was.
The tables have somewhat turned from last time between Sony and MS - last gen, MS was focused on hardware muscle dominance while Sony focused on software - giving huge concessions to major publishers for exclusive rights to key games while MS stuck to their policies and treated every publisher like the next. This time, it looks like MS is going to be the one with the must-have software and an unprecedented list of launch titles. Meanwihle, Sony spent E3 focused on the PSP and what appeared to be a rushed PS3 prototype touting the hardware power and ignoring the games. They have plenty of time to prepare a decent launch lineup for next year when they debut, but they also might be hoping to coast on the huge PS2 library like they did when they launched the PS2 with PS1 titles. Their original marketing campain for the PS2 was genius and it created a need to own one - especially with Japanese buyers.
Given the specs of both systems, they are both going to cost more than consoles have traditionally come out priced at. Even at 500, both MS and Sony are going to be taking signifigant financial losses on hardware. As an example - the GPU the 360 is going to use from ATI is a few generations ahead of what is currently available for PCs... they plan to release it for PCs in a few years at a price point of 500 bucks. And Sony appears (to many) to have simply taken specs for the 360 and announced specs that would be somewhat better. "360 has 2 USB ports? We'll have 6!" "360 has 3 cores? We'll have 7!" Sony has plenty of time to get their act together though and they simply didn't have as much time to prepare as MS spent on it. I think they were caught by surprise a little bit by what MS had to show.
Last I heard, 360 was going to still have both the less expensive version (just as a pricing gimmick) and the full featured version which would include wifi and a hard drive. The idea was to connect all sorts of devices to the 360 (hence the name)... it is certainly aimed at being alot more than just a video game console. The PS3 is expected to have similar aspirations. Nintendo may have originally come up with this idea back in the NES days - I remember reading an article my dad saved for me from the Wall Street Journal (this was ages ago) describing how Nintendo wanted to make the NES a central hub for communication and home shopping among other things. It took us this long to see this sort of thing realized.
In other news... Ted Turner is launching a service similar to what the Phantom was intending to offer - essentially beating them to the punch... the kicker is that Ted's service is not going to require any special hardware... just a PC. Ted reported that publishers have already agreed to offer around 300 games so far.
All this info is probably old and useless, but I haven't been reading the long threads much around here. But basically - until Sony releases real specs, it's kinda useless to compare...
05-26-05, 07:19 PM
#30
New Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
the CELL chip sounds interesting but i dont value games on graphics and look at the graphics on games like halo 2 and everquest 2 (i think thats the game i mean) do we really need games to look more realistic than that?
i hate it when people say games cause murder,death and aggressive behaviour but i got my first games console when i was 3 years old what if someone gets a next-gen console for a kid and something like manhunt(lame) or cold fear(pretty good/not so lame) that has ''ultra realistic graphics'' theyl'l scar a kid for life.
and i'm only 17 not some angry adult. also it sets games back at least a few months past the expected release date just so the grass sways in the breeze.dont get me wrong its cool that games do that but if we keep improving graphics on console games how will game like pokemon and paper mario look in an ultra realistic style? try making a realistic camel - volcano hybrid does it look the same.
look at the new zelda its got amazing graphics but its looking to much like the ocarina of time (atmosphere) i preferd the wind waker since theres so much more stuff you can do with a cartoony game.
anyway just to make sure you dont think i'm just complianing heres what i'll say about the new console's
PS3: i dont think the ps2 needs improving but it is almost five years old now so its is time for a change from the black box many gamers lose girlfreinds to.allthough not to an ugly piece of crap.though i love the playstation and will probably buy this just for the new final fantasy games it is probably the ugliest looking console ever.either that or a draw with the d.s (i preffered the origional design). i think they need to stick with the old controller not the new ''banana'' one ,to coin a phrase if its not broke why fix it?.(this begs the question why did they release the slim ps2 at all?)
REVOLUTION: now i have only had my 'cube' for 2 years so maybe i'm the only one thinking this but does it need replacing allready?.that said it is nice to finally have a dvd plaing nintendo console BUT i hope you dont have to buy something seperatly to play em' as i'm helluva' broke right now so i havent got one for my x-box yet.
i like the look but it needs to be a bit bigger just because it looks like my cat could easily break it (it breaks everything).i think this will sell better than the ps3 but not the 360.
THE X-BOX 360: a lame name it would have been better called just the '360' but hey at least it looks better than the ps3 who expected that?.at first i didnt like the new look it reminded me of the small ps-one though ,looking over towards my x-box, it does look better than its predeccesor allough a lot like what an offspring of an x-box and a dreamcast wold look like,maybe microsofts just giving sega more input on things since they screwed it with nintendo with 'sonic heroes'(shudders at the memories) the always grinding worst sonic game ever. i think the 360 will easily outsell the ps3 on sheer looks alone and the revolution just because of halo 3.
i hate it when people say games cause murder,death and aggressive behaviour but i got my first games console when i was 3 years old what if someone gets a next-gen console for a kid and something like manhunt(lame) or cold fear(pretty good/not so lame) that has ''ultra realistic graphics'' theyl'l scar a kid for life.
and i'm only 17 not some angry adult. also it sets games back at least a few months past the expected release date just so the grass sways in the breeze.dont get me wrong its cool that games do that but if we keep improving graphics on console games how will game like pokemon and paper mario look in an ultra realistic style? try making a realistic camel - volcano hybrid does it look the same.
look at the new zelda its got amazing graphics but its looking to much like the ocarina of time (atmosphere) i preferd the wind waker since theres so much more stuff you can do with a cartoony game.
anyway just to make sure you dont think i'm just complianing heres what i'll say about the new console's
PS3: i dont think the ps2 needs improving but it is almost five years old now so its is time for a change from the black box many gamers lose girlfreinds to.allthough not to an ugly piece of crap.though i love the playstation and will probably buy this just for the new final fantasy games it is probably the ugliest looking console ever.either that or a draw with the d.s (i preffered the origional design). i think they need to stick with the old controller not the new ''banana'' one ,to coin a phrase if its not broke why fix it?.(this begs the question why did they release the slim ps2 at all?)
REVOLUTION: now i have only had my 'cube' for 2 years so maybe i'm the only one thinking this but does it need replacing allready?.that said it is nice to finally have a dvd plaing nintendo console BUT i hope you dont have to buy something seperatly to play em' as i'm helluva' broke right now so i havent got one for my x-box yet.
i like the look but it needs to be a bit bigger just because it looks like my cat could easily break it (it breaks everything).i think this will sell better than the ps3 but not the 360.
THE X-BOX 360: a lame name it would have been better called just the '360' but hey at least it looks better than the ps3 who expected that?.at first i didnt like the new look it reminded me of the small ps-one though ,looking over towards my x-box, it does look better than its predeccesor allough a lot like what an offspring of an x-box and a dreamcast wold look like,maybe microsofts just giving sega more input on things since they screwed it with nintendo with 'sonic heroes'(shudders at the memories) the always grinding worst sonic game ever. i think the 360 will easily outsell the ps3 on sheer looks alone and the revolution just because of halo 3.
05-26-05, 09:50 PM
#31
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: HB, CA
Posts: 2,600
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Trigger
Based on the specs sony released at e3, the PS3 is theoretically supposed to be up to 25% faster than Xbox360, but with factors such as the PS3 being more difficult to program for (to take advantage of the subcores etc...), the systems should end up being very similar. PS3 should also cost alot more to produce overall (between the cpus and gpus and the fact that they want to stick so many ports in the thing).
As for costs, MS has to pay a license fee for the CPU technology that Sony probably doesn't. Also, they still have to pay a company like Flextronics for final assembly. It's probably not enough to entirely offset the cost of all the extra hardware in the PS3, but it narrows the cost gap to less than what most people would think at first glance.
Originally Posted by Trigger
Originally, Microsoft was prepared to lose the battle in both their first and second generation and hoped to be established enough by their third generation to dominate the field. Now they are pretty confident that they can come out on top this generation... especially after seeing what the competition came up with. Rumors about Nintendo releasing a retro machine turned out to be true and many were a bit shocked to see how unprepared Sony was.
Originally Posted by Trigger
...This time, it looks like MS is going to be the one with the must-have software and an unprecedented list of launch titles.
Originally Posted by Trigger
the GPU the 360 is going to use from ATI is a few generations ahead of what is currently available for PCs... they plan to release it for PCs in a few years at a price point of 500 bucks.
Originally Posted by Trigger
And Sony appears (to many) to have simply taken specs for the 360 and announced specs that would be somewhat better. "360 has 2 USB ports? We'll have 6!" "360 has 3 cores? We'll have 7!"
Originally Posted by Trigger
Sony has plenty of time to get their act together though and they simply didn't have as much time to prepare as MS spent on it. I think they were caught by surprise a little bit by what MS had to show.
Originally Posted by Trigger
The idea was to connect all sorts of devices to the 360 (hence the name)... it is certainly aimed at being alot more than just a video game console. The PS3 is expected to have similar aspirations. Nintendo may have originally come up with this idea back in the NES days - I remember reading an article my dad saved for me from the Wall Street Journal (this was ages ago) describing how Nintendo wanted to make the NES a central hub for communication and home shopping among other things. It took us this long to see this sort of thing realized.
05-26-05, 10:39 PM
#32
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,189
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by belboz
As for costs, MS has to pay a license fee for the CPU technology that Sony probably doesn't. Also, they still have to pay a company like Flextronics for final assembly. It's probably not enough to entirely offset the cost of all the extra hardware in the PS3, but it narrows the cost gap to less than what most people would think at first glance.
05-26-05, 10:56 PM
#33
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by belboz
That 25% figure sounds like it was pulled out of someones ass.
Originally Posted by belboz
As for costs, MS has to pay a license fee for the CPU technology that Sony probably doesn't. Also, they still have to pay a company like Flextronics for final assembly. It's probably not enough to entirely offset the cost of all the extra hardware in the PS3, but it narrows the cost gap to less than what most people would think at first glance.
Originally Posted by belboz
This is all sort of meaningless. What a company expects and what actually happens are almost always two different things. Is MS confident? Yes, of course. But they were confident they could crack the Japanese market last time around. They were also confident the XBox would be profitable this generation.
Actually - they weren't at all confident in the asian markets - they spent alot of money on advertising there, but it was mostly just to plant a seed of brand awareness. They pretty much gave up on both Japan and Korea before even launching... they were still disappointed and the numbers were even lower than projected, but they didn't really have anything resembling high hopes for that in the first place. This time they actually are pretty confident based on some of the software they're going to launch with and reactions to their product.
Originally Posted by belboz
I think this very much remains to be seen. I have no idea who's going to have the better launch line-up or who's going to have more must-have titles. I don't think you or your "sources" do either.
And you don't have to listen to anything I say... sounds like you think my 'sources' is a magic 8 ball. If my comments/information isn't interesting around here, I don't have to post here.
Originally Posted by belboz
Just to clarify, by the time the 360 ships, the GPU in it will be more advanced than the R520 and G70 chips that ATi and nVidia will have available for PCs at that time. I don't know if it's more advanced enough to qualify as a "full generation" ahead, though. The logic in the eDRAM is a pretty nifty technology. My concern with it, though, is that it's only 10MB, which is only enough to fit a 720P frame with z and stencil information. Hopefully, that doesn't mean their support for 1080i/p is upsampled 720p.
Originally Posted by belboz
I don't see any particular reason to believe that unless you wanted to.
Originally Posted by belboz
I think the only reason Sony released as much info about the PS3 as they did was to suck the wind from the 360 announcement. Otherwise, they probably would have waited until Tokyo before releasing all the specs. If I were MS, I'd be pissed. The mass media is talking about the 360 and PS3 on equal terms when they should have had the spotlight all to themselves.
Originally Posted by belboz
I think the story this generation will be about broadening the role (and market) for the consoles into that of an entertainment hub. As much as certain people here hate it, the whole "convergence thing" is actually starting to happen. They could still fuck it up with the software, but just looking at the hardware, I think Sony is better prepared for this than MS. The Blu-ray drive, the standard memory ports, the built-in WiFi, and the extra ethernet and USB ports give the box more capabilities in this regard.
05-27-05, 12:59 AM
#34
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: HB, CA
Posts: 2,600
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
meh, I probably shouldn't have put "sources" in quotes like that. Made it seem snide, which was not my intention (well, maybe just a little bit). For things like message boards where there's really nothing at stake, I'm happy to afford people the courtesy of taking them at their word until given reason not to. Not that I've been keeping track, but AFAIK, your sources have been more or less on the money so far (though I'm still waiting for the "unprecedented" part of the launch lineup to be announced 
).Anyway, your posts draw plenty of replies, so you should take that as affirmation that your posts here are valued. Heck, people rarely ever bother replying to any of my posts, and yet I still insist on inflicting my profound and fascinating thoughts on everyone.
05-27-05, 03:00 AM
#35
DVD Talk Legend
Honestly - my "source" is a friend of mine and I probably blab too much some of the stuff [he or she] tells me in confidence... I haven't really followed message board gossip or visited IGN or other game news sites, so I don't always remember which info is priviledged and which is commonly known. I know alot of things said to me are prefaced with "you can't tell anyone about this, but..." It's kinda fun really - I helped [him or her] get the job they have and it's neat hearing about this 'insider' kinda stuff.
Then there's alot of me just interjecting my own opinions. I was hoping for a better showing from Sony this time because I really want to get a PS3 since I have several PS2 games and no PS2 to play them on. I pray they don't keep that rediculous controller (MS people joked about how much it looked like an old Sidewinder controller) and just keep it more traditional. Also - I wasn't originally planning on getting a 360 because I was kinda mad that they weren't supporting the Xbox as long as they maybe should have. But after E3 and some of the discussions I've had, I don't think i'll have a choice but to get one... unless there are some huge changes between now and launch.
But either way - no hard feelings, I didn't mean to sound like I was taking your comments like a bad sport.
Then there's alot of me just interjecting my own opinions. I was hoping for a better showing from Sony this time because I really want to get a PS3 since I have several PS2 games and no PS2 to play them on. I pray they don't keep that rediculous controller (MS people joked about how much it looked like an old Sidewinder controller) and just keep it more traditional. Also - I wasn't originally planning on getting a 360 because I was kinda mad that they weren't supporting the Xbox as long as they maybe should have. But after E3 and some of the discussions I've had, I don't think i'll have a choice but to get one... unless there are some huge changes between now and launch.
But either way - no hard feelings, I didn't mean to sound like I was taking your comments like a bad sport.
05-27-05, 09:40 AM
#36
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Trigger
(MS people joked about how much it looked like an old Sidewinder controller)
Honestly, all the hardware looks very tempting at this point. Hopefully we will see a lot more of the actual software over the next few months. I personally give MS a big thumbs up for putting the 20GB HDD in every console and keeping that a standard feature. I wish the Xbox360 was Wi-Fi internet compatible out of the box, but as long as the add on is affordable I think its a fair trade for the HDD. The backwards compatibility is a tough thing that was really out of Microsofts control, but they are at least going to try and make some of the major games work with it.
If they launch with some good software they will be in good shape, especially if the popularity of Live continues to grow.
05-27-05, 11:50 PM
#38
Member
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Sunnyvale, CA 94086
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by jiggawhat
Actually from what I've heard, 7 cores were going to be available because of processor yield issues.
05-27-05, 11:54 PM
#39
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,189
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Darknight
No, he's right. If you look at the CPU, it does have 8 cores, but they only say 7 because like the Xbox 360 and the PSP, there is going to be an OS running in the background at all times and one of the cores is dedicated to that.
I'll find a link in the morning though, I'm going to bed.
05-28-05, 09:42 AM
#40
DVD Talk Special Edition
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 1,156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by joshd2012
In any case, as mentioned above, the description of the PS3 having 1 input and 2 output ethernet ports also makes no sense. If the PS3 is just a switch, then its has 3 LAN ports. If it is a router, then it has one WAN port and 2 LAN ports. The input/output distinction doesn't apply.
05-28-05, 10:07 AM
#41
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Posts: 6,677
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I believe that they are referring to communications between cells, rather than broadcasting an HDTV stream. I'd have to find it again, but I remember reading an interview which mentioned that Cells could "talk" if connections got up to Gigabit level. Being that, as you mentioned, Internet connections won't be that high for many years, it will probably be used soley for home intranets.
I know it sounds like a marketing ploy, and it may be, but even the new nForce4 requirements for motherboards requires Gigabit ethernet - Sony isn't the only one making it a standard.
Edit:
I think Cells require that much bandwidth.
I know it sounds like a marketing ploy, and it may be, but even the new nForce4 requirements for motherboards requires Gigabit ethernet - Sony isn't the only one making it a standard.
Edit:
Honda: You used to talk about the concept of CELL or PS3 with grid computing as one of analogies. Since then it's been disclosed what kind of processor CELL actually is. How does the computing model of CELL that has networking functions by itself translate into a game console in future?
Kutaragi: In the next spring, CELL will start to enter homes as the form of PS3. Thought in it there are 7 SPEs, it may be seen only as one hardware from users. But since PS3 has Gigabit Ethernet from day one, you can connect CELLs right away at 1Gbps when you have more CELLs in your home. It can be a home server, or more PS3s, in various styles CELLs in home can connect with one another via network. With 100Mbps bandwidth, they can be connected even through internet.
Kutaragi: In the next spring, CELL will start to enter homes as the form of PS3. Thought in it there are 7 SPEs, it may be seen only as one hardware from users. But since PS3 has Gigabit Ethernet from day one, you can connect CELLs right away at 1Gbps when you have more CELLs in your home. It can be a home server, or more PS3s, in various styles CELLs in home can connect with one another via network. With 100Mbps bandwidth, they can be connected even through internet.
Last edited by joshd2012; 05-28-05 at 10:11 AM.
05-28-05, 08:08 PM
#42
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: HB, CA
Posts: 2,600
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The same arguments about whether we really needed that higher speed took place when fast ethernet first came out. It was really expensive for a while and everyone said it's not worthwhile, but then it dropped to a price point where it only cost a little more than regular ethernet and all of a sudden the market exploded. Everything was 100 megabit, even print servers that didn't need even 10 megabits of bandwidth.
The same thing is happening with gigabit ethernet. It's been affordable for most early adopters for over a year now. But, now it's being included for free in chipsets and the cost of switches has come down to maybe only double that of 10/100 switches.
Well before the PS3 hits end of life, gigabit ethernet networks will be common in homes just like 10/100 ethernet is now.
The same thing is happening with gigabit ethernet. It's been affordable for most early adopters for over a year now. But, now it's being included for free in chipsets and the cost of switches has come down to maybe only double that of 10/100 switches.
Well before the PS3 hits end of life, gigabit ethernet networks will be common in homes just like 10/100 ethernet is now.
06-01-05, 08:27 AM
#44
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Posts: 6,677
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Big 3 Duke it out:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/05...s_6126725.html
The Electronic Entertainment Expo marked the start of the next-generation console war. With all sides gearing up for full conflict, opening volleys of insults and predictions are starting to surface in the media at large. The Japanese newspaper Asahi Shinbun's Friday edition featured an article with comments taken from the heads of the three console makers: Microsoft senior vice president and chief Xbox officer Robert J. Bach, Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi, and Nintendo president Satoru Iwata. All three contenders talked about the strategies behind their own consoles and tossed harsh words over the corporate walls toward each other.
Microsoft senior vice president and chief Xbox officer Robert J. Bach--
(NOTE: Bach's comments are translated from Japanese and not directly quoted from his English statement.)
Asahi Shinbun: What do you think of the competitors' machines? Will Sony continue to dominate the gaming market?
Robbie Bach: The other two companies' presentations [at E3] weren't surprising. Sony's [PS3's] capabilities are the same as ours. Nintendo is aiming for the niche market [with its Revolution]. The current-generation Xbox sold more than the PlayStation 2 in North America last Christmas. We will become the market leader with our next-generation console.
Sony's [PS3] will be able to use seven controllers simultaneously and connect with two high-definition TV sets. But it's hard to share a single screen with seven people, and it's also difficult to imagine a room with two high-definition TV sets. We don't know about the selling price yet, but to say the least, our cost of manufacturing [an Xbox 360] is less than Sony's [PS3].
AS: Why doesn't the Xbox 360 adopt a next-generation disc format?
RB: The next-generation disc standard hasn't been solidified yet. Sony is taking a risk. We can decide after the standard has been created.
AS: What has Microsoft learned from its previous game console release?
RB: We'll basically be starting again from square one in the Japanese market. Our current Xbox console didn't have enough software for Japanese consumers. This time, we're teaming up with powerful Japanese game makers, including Square Enix, the maker of Final Fantasy. As for Microsoft's overall game division, we plan to get out of red ink by June 2007.
Ken Kutaragi, Sony Computer Entertainment president--
AS: What do you think of the competitors' machines? Will Sony continue to dominate the gaming market?
Ken Kutaragi: Microsoft is trailing behind us, but they are not a threat. They are good at improving [on products], but we will be advancing to the next level with revolutionary technology. Beating us for a short moment is like accidentally winning a point from a Shihan (Karate master), and Microsoft is still not a black belt. Just like with their operating systems, they might come out with something good around the third generation of their release.
It isn't a bad thing to have a high price. When we released the original PlayStation at 39,800 yen ($368), Nintendo's Super Famicom was in the 10,000 yen range ($100 range). Still, everyone went for the PlayStation. This time, ours [the PS3] will be like a BMW that's equipped with a Ferrari engine. Nintendo's [Revolution] will be something like a new model of a family car. Some people might want it, but if it was me, I'd want to advance to the next level.
AS: Why is Sony's next-generation console adopting a next-generation disc format?
KK: The current DVD [format] had a slow growth during its first three years of release, but it dramatically penetrated [through the market] after the release of the PS2, and its software prices had gone down. By using Blue-ray in the PS3, we hope to boost the amount of available [Blu-ray] software and sales of high-definition TV sets. With enough product [in the market], the Blu-ray will be one step closer to becoming the standard [next-generation] format.
Satoru Iwata, Nintendo president--
AS: What do you think of the competitors' machines? Will Sony continue to dominate the gaming market?
Satoru Iwata: It's questionable what the "horsepower" of the two other companies' consoles will be used for, such as fast calculations and high-definition resolution. Creating game software in high definition will require everything from the [graphic's] models to the background to be redone, and it will bloat up development costs. And yet, it has no use for people that aren't playing with a high-definition TV set. Game consoles are not an essential product in life, so we want to make ours as compact, thin, and as inexpensive as we can so that it won't be viewed with hostility by family members.
AS: What has Nintendo learned from its previous game machine release?
SI: We launched the Nintendo DS last year, and the release of our Nintendogs, which came out this April, is being called the second launch [of the DS, since Nintendogs massively boosted sales of the handheld in Japan]. We want to push the DS's sales with the release of game software during the first year. There's a big gap between people that enjoy games that take time and playing skills, and people that don't. I'm feeling a real sense of danger about the decline in the Japanese gaming population. Patting a dog and telling it to stay [in Nintendogs] is something that anyone can enjoy. We're aiming to increase the population of game players with these new kinds of games.
AS: Sony's PS3 is adopting the Blu-ray next-generation disc format. What about the Revolution?
SI: It will be more beneficial to the consumer if we took the money for [adopting the use of] a next-generation disc format and used it somewhere else where we can present more new fun. Nintendo is a company that likes to see smiles on the faces of people that love entertainment. We're not about selling new kinds of TVs or taking control of the living room.
Microsoft senior vice president and chief Xbox officer Robert J. Bach--
(NOTE: Bach's comments are translated from Japanese and not directly quoted from his English statement.)
Asahi Shinbun: What do you think of the competitors' machines? Will Sony continue to dominate the gaming market?
Robbie Bach: The other two companies' presentations [at E3] weren't surprising. Sony's [PS3's] capabilities are the same as ours. Nintendo is aiming for the niche market [with its Revolution]. The current-generation Xbox sold more than the PlayStation 2 in North America last Christmas. We will become the market leader with our next-generation console.
Sony's [PS3] will be able to use seven controllers simultaneously and connect with two high-definition TV sets. But it's hard to share a single screen with seven people, and it's also difficult to imagine a room with two high-definition TV sets. We don't know about the selling price yet, but to say the least, our cost of manufacturing [an Xbox 360] is less than Sony's [PS3].
AS: Why doesn't the Xbox 360 adopt a next-generation disc format?
RB: The next-generation disc standard hasn't been solidified yet. Sony is taking a risk. We can decide after the standard has been created.
AS: What has Microsoft learned from its previous game console release?
RB: We'll basically be starting again from square one in the Japanese market. Our current Xbox console didn't have enough software for Japanese consumers. This time, we're teaming up with powerful Japanese game makers, including Square Enix, the maker of Final Fantasy. As for Microsoft's overall game division, we plan to get out of red ink by June 2007.
Ken Kutaragi, Sony Computer Entertainment president--
AS: What do you think of the competitors' machines? Will Sony continue to dominate the gaming market?
Ken Kutaragi: Microsoft is trailing behind us, but they are not a threat. They are good at improving [on products], but we will be advancing to the next level with revolutionary technology. Beating us for a short moment is like accidentally winning a point from a Shihan (Karate master), and Microsoft is still not a black belt. Just like with their operating systems, they might come out with something good around the third generation of their release.
It isn't a bad thing to have a high price. When we released the original PlayStation at 39,800 yen ($368), Nintendo's Super Famicom was in the 10,000 yen range ($100 range). Still, everyone went for the PlayStation. This time, ours [the PS3] will be like a BMW that's equipped with a Ferrari engine. Nintendo's [Revolution] will be something like a new model of a family car. Some people might want it, but if it was me, I'd want to advance to the next level.
AS: Why is Sony's next-generation console adopting a next-generation disc format?
KK: The current DVD [format] had a slow growth during its first three years of release, but it dramatically penetrated [through the market] after the release of the PS2, and its software prices had gone down. By using Blue-ray in the PS3, we hope to boost the amount of available [Blu-ray] software and sales of high-definition TV sets. With enough product [in the market], the Blu-ray will be one step closer to becoming the standard [next-generation] format.
Satoru Iwata, Nintendo president--
AS: What do you think of the competitors' machines? Will Sony continue to dominate the gaming market?
Satoru Iwata: It's questionable what the "horsepower" of the two other companies' consoles will be used for, such as fast calculations and high-definition resolution. Creating game software in high definition will require everything from the [graphic's] models to the background to be redone, and it will bloat up development costs. And yet, it has no use for people that aren't playing with a high-definition TV set. Game consoles are not an essential product in life, so we want to make ours as compact, thin, and as inexpensive as we can so that it won't be viewed with hostility by family members.
AS: What has Nintendo learned from its previous game machine release?
SI: We launched the Nintendo DS last year, and the release of our Nintendogs, which came out this April, is being called the second launch [of the DS, since Nintendogs massively boosted sales of the handheld in Japan]. We want to push the DS's sales with the release of game software during the first year. There's a big gap between people that enjoy games that take time and playing skills, and people that don't. I'm feeling a real sense of danger about the decline in the Japanese gaming population. Patting a dog and telling it to stay [in Nintendogs] is something that anyone can enjoy. We're aiming to increase the population of game players with these new kinds of games.
AS: Sony's PS3 is adopting the Blu-ray next-generation disc format. What about the Revolution?
SI: It will be more beneficial to the consumer if we took the money for [adopting the use of] a next-generation disc format and used it somewhere else where we can present more new fun. Nintendo is a company that likes to see smiles on the faces of people that love entertainment. We're not about selling new kinds of TVs or taking control of the living room.
06-01-05, 08:39 AM
#45
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,189
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MS:
That'll happen... :smirk:
Sony:
Zing!
Nintendo:
Could have fooled me.
s for Microsoft's overall game division, we plan to get out of red ink by June 2007.
Sony:
Just like with their operating systems, they might come out with something good around the third generation of their release.
Nintendo's [Revolution] will be something like a new model of a family car. Some people might want it, but if it was me, I'd want to advance to the next level.
Nintendo:
We're not about selling new kinds of TVs or taking control of the living room.
06-01-05, 12:30 PM
#46
DVD Talk Special Edition
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wasn't everyone at E3 saying that while they are skeptical, if Sony's specs turn out to be true then the PS3 will be much more powerful than the 360? Is Microsoft just hoping that if they continue to say "the 2 systems are equal in power" then it will just become a given?
06-01-05, 12:40 PM
#47
Mod Emeritus
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 15,325
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Gromit
Wasn't everyone at E3 saying that while they are skeptical, if Sony's specs turn out to be true then the PS3 will be much more powerful than the 360? Is Microsoft just hoping that if they continue to say "the 2 systems are equal in power" then it will just become a given?
06-01-05, 12:55 PM
#48
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Blu-Ray: We Don't Need No Stinkin' Petition
Posts: 6,677
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think if you look at the specs on purely an overall basis, the two consoles look very similar, but I think Sony has a slight edge (more to be seen once programmers start using it). If you start to focus on one aspect, that is when you will start to see the benefits and shortcomings of the two different approaches.
And yes, I that Microsoft is playing the PR card pretty hard in terms of power. MS issued a PR note which claimed the Xbox was "3 times more powerful than PS3" because it had three cores and PS3 only had one. Now, we all know that is bullshit. And that is why I think we will see more "the power is the same" comments from MS than we will of power superiority. They really need to step back and focus on Live and forget about the power comparisons, because when it comes down to it, I think PS3 will be a more powerful gaming platform.
And yes, I that Microsoft is playing the PR card pretty hard in terms of power. MS issued a PR note which claimed the Xbox was "3 times more powerful than PS3" because it had three cores and PS3 only had one. Now, we all know that is bullshit. And that is why I think we will see more "the power is the same" comments from MS than we will of power superiority. They really need to step back and focus on Live and forget about the power comparisons, because when it comes down to it, I think PS3 will be a more powerful gaming platform.
06-01-05, 01:12 PM
#50
Retired
Exactly, the X-box has the best specs this gen, but the best looking games on the PS2 and GC look pretty much as good as the X-box's best. Not identical, but close enough that 99% of people won't care much.