GatorDeb

If there's a multi-platform game, I buy it for the GC. I have the PS2 and XBOX for their exclusives... the PS2 for games like Gran Turismo, Disgaea and Karaoke Revolution and the XBOX for BC, Fable, and XBOX Live Mixer.

darkside

Not forever. It will catch up to them at some point. They need to focus on fixing their image and 3rd party support problems with their next console.

One thing they are doing lately is trying to release more games to make up for the weak third party support by adding more 2nd party developers working exclusively for Nintendo. There is no way they can increase the number of games they usually publish and keep the quality as high as its been in the past. If a few bad Nintendo published games start slipping through they run the risk of hurting their image with their hardcore audience and that could be a disaster.

Quality exclusives is the one thing that sets them appart from everyone else. Sony and Microsoft can get away some bad first party games because they have much stronger third party support. However, if the only big game Nintendo owners have to look forward to in a certain month ends up sucking and there is nothing else good from third parties to buy its going to really hurt them.

Losing Eidos and Acclaim is no big deal, but if things don't improve for Nintendo in the future and EA, Capcom, and Square (or other quality publishers) decide to pull their support Nintendo is done as a console manufacturer.

Decker

Absolutely. And the GBA will keep them rolling in $$$ for a long time. Certainly the GC isn't a massive failure along the lines of the Saturn or Dreamcast, but last is last and it's hard to imagine them surging ahead in the next generation of consoles either, especially with their history of reviving old franchises and characters.

Still my big problem with them is that they seemed kinda stubborn and unwilling to change. "No DVD player? We're making a GAME console, people don't want both." "No hard drive? Our system is less expensive and our memory cards will be adequite" "No online gaming strategy? Well we feel that connectivity with our GBA is a bigger selling point." You get the idea. They just seem a little out of touch and didn't learn much from the last generation of console. The N64 ended up being very hampered because they used a cart storage system instead of cheaply produced CDROMs. For the GC they came up with their own propriatary mini-discs instead of conventional DVDRoms for no apparent reason beyond keeping their console is a small square box. I really admire some of their games but I have a hard time understanding some of their other decisions.

Sorry to bag on the big N so much, but they kinda baffle me.

Draven

I'll be the first to admit that the GBA connectivity push is just a bad move all around. And the hard drive is a must in the next console, IMHO.

However, I am one of the people that uses DVD players for DVDs and game consoles for games. I don't even watch DVDs on my computer for that same reason. I don't think they are too far off the mark on that one.

Say what you will about the proprietary format, but doesn't that pretty much make it impossible to "hack" the system and the games? Something that Xbox and PS2 are forced to dump money into fighting?

Groucho

I love the smaller discs. I watch DVD's on my stand-alone player anyway, and the decreased load times are great!

Decker

Load times are a game-to-game issue. I don't think the size of a disc makes much difference; certainly I heard of games that load faster on the Xbox or PS2 than the GC version. I've also heard complaints that the small disc gives compression artifacts on FMV. Yes, FMV is the bane of many a gamer's existance, but still, if you have to sit through it, why not make it clean at least?

As far as the DVD player goes, I also never use either console as a player, but people do. It was especially true at the time of the PS2 launch when any DVD player would run $200. The ability to play DVDs (sorta ) out of the box was a big selling point. I would think a lot of people who are on the fence about which system to buy(those without a strong tie to the Nintendo exclusive games and characters) might be swayed that it's worth the extra $30 that a PS2 or Xbox would cost (yeah, I know about the remote, but they may not) in order to have an extra DVD player as well. Nintendo may continue to deny it, but sales numbers of DVD remotes confirm what I said before : People do use their consoles as a DVD player.

darkside

The size of a disc makes a difference in load times. The HD makes the load times faster on the Xbox, but the PS2 is painfully slow to load. I can't think of a single game where the PS2 loads faster than the GC.

One of Miyamoto's complaints about the optical format was load times and I think that was one of the big reasons for the mini DVDs and fast load times of the GC.

As far as piracy, no GC game I know of has ever been hacked, but I can download any PS2 or XBox game I want. Nintendo did something right with regards to preventing piracy.

However, Nintendo would have been better off using full size DVDs. The DVD player feature would have helped sales and the third parties would have had a much easier time making the Cube version of multiconsole games. I understand Nintendo's logic on using the smaller discs, but they would have been better off in the long run in my opinion using the standard DVDs.

Decker

This may be an isolated episode, and certainly not an A+ title, but I remember this complaint, taken from the IGN review of Finding Nemo for the GC:
There are few problems, however... What I didn't like, however, are the insanely long load times in the GameCube version.

Grab a watch and stare at it for three minutes. Go ahead, try it. Starting up Find Nemo on GameCube takes a whopping two minutes -- 120 whole seconds. Read to play? Well, the moment you select whether you want to load a game or start a new one, you will have to wait more than 30 seconds for… the level select screen. No joke. Once you select your level, you will have to wait another 60-80 seconds for the actual level to load. Either the makers of this game don't have kids, or this is some new, cruel way to torture parents. Ironically, the PS2, which by design has a slower disk drive than the GameCube, loads much faster. Chalk it up to a rushed, careless port, but the load times in the GameCube version will try the patience of even the most forgiving gamer.


You and the previous poster make good points about piracy. It certainly help to prevent that. The cost might be too high for some developers, though.

Groucho

It's easy to pick and choose reviews like that, but there are exceptions to everything. For the titles I have played, every Gamecube game has nearly non-existant load times, especially when compared to the PS2...and even the Xbox.

Anybody who actually owns a Gamecube alongside another console will attest to this...I'm not making it up.

Outlaw

Yeah Groucho has hit it on the head, pretty much every Gamecube game I've played has almost no load times and no "now loading" screens. Even F-Zero GX has no load screen and goes right to the race when you when you choose it. As it was put, that is something that they strive hard to do and have succeeded at very well.

Finding Nemo was rushed out the door and is poor counter example to this, but it is a good example of when developers (THQ I think it is for this game) cut corners, no optimizations for the GC, and rush the game out the door.

Decker

I didn't think that Finding Nemo quote proved anything except that there are exceptions to every rule. It's good to know that the GC mini-disc has a functional advantage, not just a cosmetic one.
I was under the impression, however, that the Xbox loaded faster, thanks to the HD. Maybe not, but I recall hearing that the Xbox version of SC II was the quickest loading.

I also still think a lot of the load time is a function of the game development technology, not the hardware. The PS2 which clearly has the slowest drive has games like Ratchet & Clank and Jak & Daxter that have essentially no loading times. Sly Cooper also has very negiligable loading times. While others like Midnight Club 2 and Test Drive seem to load forever.

Draven

For me the grand daddy is GTA: Vice City of the PS2. I read a few pages of my book waiting for that thing to load.

Decker

Tru dat. But remember, that's only one long load, then all the city and all the missions are readly available. I think that's a better way to go than stopping the action everytime you move more than 20 feet outdoors or into any building (cough, KOTOR, cough).

Groucho

I don't mind the loading screens in KOTOR because of all the "helpful" hints they show.