The gameplay in RS is the same as it was on the N64... Plain and simple. I have played BOTH extensively.

Yes, the graphics are better, but nothing new has been added to the gameplay...

The levels are the same size... There is no muliplayer... Yada Yada Yada...

You could do RS on the N64 if you took away the better graphics... (Granted it does have more moving objects than the N64 could handle...)

You could NOT do Halo on the Cube. Halo's levels are WAY too big... You could not do Halo on the PS2... You could not do Oddword on the PS2 (hence the reason they did it for the Xbox.)

Xbox has more powerful hardware. Case closed. Does that make it the better system? No. Does Gamecube having Rogue make it better? No.

Its all opinion. I like FPS, I like Quake, I like Unreal, but I like Rogue better. More than likely I would like it better than Halo, but more than likely, I can't say for sure til I play the game.

And you know what? So what. I like Rogue, others like Halo. Big deal.

In defense of Rogue, it is not a remake. It is a sequel. The levels are new, there are new hidden ships, new levels. The GAMEPLAY system is the same. Contra and Super C had the same system, Super C was not a remake, same goes for the Castlevania series, the Smackdown series. Hell even Madden is pretty much the same as I remember it when it first came out, just better graphics and more options. I swear that game plays the same damn way...after all these years I can still launch a 80 yard bomb for a touchdown on a whim.

Sure Rogue Leader doesn't REINVENT the series, but it is a sequel, not a remake.

>>And you know what? So what. I like Rogue, others like Halo. Big deal.

I agree big deal... I have both and like Halo better... Big deal...

I think Maria Carry (SP?) is butt ugly... Big deal...

Just my opinion. But I do enjoy a good debate... Thanks to all who participated.

"No... The reason they did it is because they are very afraid of Piracy. Load times has NOTHING to do with it..."

You're right. I remember hearing about the load time thing like 2 years ago and I can never shake it from my mind. Still, protecting against piracy is very important and it's actually an even better reason to use these mini DVDs.

"Many of the PS2 and Xbox games will hold more than 1.5 gigs!!!"

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!! Nintendo better close up shop! Seriously, if they could survive last generation with 1/50 of the storage space they'll surely be fine this generation. Plus, if a game really needs to be that big, developers can always use a 2nd disc. 2 discs would fit great in Gamecube DVD case and wouldn't rasie the production cost much at all. I don't think many games, if any at all, will need the full storage spac of a DVD though. Developers just don't have enough time to do all that programming. Do you think games are going to be 5 times longer or 5 times bigger just because DVDs hold 5 times more?

The mini DVD lack of loading time is very important. If you have ever read a interview with Miyamoto you know load times are a major issue to him. It's about more than piracy. 1.5 gigs is plenty of space to hold games. The only reason to need more is for FMV and that adds nothing to gameplay.

I won't even go into your bias against Gamecube games. I will say I've played all three systems and they all have their strengths. The PS2 is by far the best system to own right now anyway. It will be some time before anyone catches up to GT3, MGS2, and Final Fantasy X.

You know, I came on to this thread to post as a former EB employee, and what the hell has this digressed into? I'm so sick of this "my toy is better than your toy" $hit in this forum. I have an Xbox. I'm not buying a GC. Who's losing sleep over that one? Can I get a show of hands? Personally, I don't care what any of you bought, because when it comes down to it, I'm sitting here playing Amped, because I want to, and not because someone told me it's cool to do it. You know what else I'm playing Golgo 13 on the friggin' NES 8-bit. Anyone have a problem with that? It's almost like a "mine's bigger than yours" war in here, when what it really comes down to "is the b*tch satisfied?", and I'm happy with what I bought, and it's good to see that others are happy with what they bought. So be satisfied with what you bought, and if not, get rid of it, and stop labeling people as idiots because of a purchase one way or another.

SO on to the topic...I used to work at EB, before a DM forced me out because she hated the manager that hired me (and she forced EVERYONE from the regime out, for one reason or another...). I had actually been written up for giving my opinion on systems there (granted, it was by her...so I guess it doesn't count) and not like bad mouthing, but sticking to straight facts and such as to why the PSX would be a better purchase than a Saturn towards the end of the Saturn. My store never had a system bias, and in fact sold anything to anybody that wanted it. Now, did I let people buy Jimmy Johnson's VR Football 1997 for the Playstation over Madden or Gameday? No. Did I inform them of the obvious about the game? yes. but systems...no. It's all in what you want. You want Rogue, then fine, buy the Gamecube. I'll have you walking out of the store smiling as if you just bought a Jasmine St. Claire Vibrating doll whether or not I care about the GC at all. It's called good salesmanship, something of which EB cares less about than selling the Game Doctor Disc Repair thing. I've seen 2 of their best employees leave or get forced out for not meeting a quota of selling 1 per every 10 transactions, and these people had been with the company for YEARS. Like they can sell one to repeat customers all the time. EB as a whole has gotten away from what made them the best (at least around here), to the point where the employees don't care to make the sale anymore. That's my opinion, I could be bitter at EB and dumb woman who is the DM of the Western Pennsylvania/ Ohio Valley region...

I have something against the Xbox: microsoft.

I will never do business with that company, and I don't understand why anyone else does...

Then again there are many things humans do that I don't understand.

So are you running a mac or linux or unix or what??

By the way...good job of staying on topic there buddy.

Hey, when did I ever claim to be on topic???

Yes, I do I use a Mac.

Lots of people complain about MS but then go and bend over for them anyway. I prefer to remain true to my convictions, and I think I am better off for it.

Not meant as flame or anything, just my opinion.

Good to see that you stand behind your statement fully on the PC end of things...

Didn't Microsoft bail Apple out? Aren't they an owner or major shareholder or something of Apple? Not sure...

Who cares? I'm not trying to save the world. Why does everybody have to have a cause. Just buy an XBOX and enjoy it.......

I agree... What is the big stink against MS when it comes to games any way???

Looking at the Xbox...

Is MS charging more for the console? Nope. $299 for the Xbox, $299 for the PS2. And the Xbox is far superior.

Is MS charging more for the games? Nope. $49 for Xbox games, $49 for PS2 and Cube games.

Is MS buying out all the game publishers? Yes, but no more than Sony... MS bought Bungie and a couple other no names... Sony bought the Jack and Dexter folks and several others...

So what is the big deal? Who cares what name is on a console, just so long as it has great games?

Lets look at the Age of Empires series as an example of how to make a sequel...

AOE was and still is a GREAT game.

When Age of Kings (AOK) the sequel to AOE came out, here is what they added:

- Better graphics
- A new way to manipulate the economy (Markets)
- Another new way to manipulate the economy (Trade carts and boats)
- The ability to garrison units
- The ability to set way-points
- The ability to use formations
- Unique units for each Civilization
- Unique technologies for each civilization
- The ability to Queue farm production
- The addition of spies
- Much larger maps
- Much larger populations
- Etc...

Point is, they didn't just enhance the graphics, and give us new maps...

They added new gameplay options...

That is what a GOOD sequel should do...

I just thin RS is a BAD sequel... The gameplay is the same...

AOE wasn't that great. There was definitely a ton of room for improvement. Plus, there's a lot more...aspects to an RTS than there are to a space battle game. Therefore there's a lot more room for improvement.

Most of those upgrades you listed were already found in other games for years anyway. The simple truth is that they should have been in the game the first time.

Maybe we have different definitions of Gameplay. Just what the hell did you want them to change? Don't bother relisting your suggestions from before either. They weren't very good.

they haven't added much enhanced gamplay to madden or NBA Live or any of those games in years.... i mean sure they added franchise mode and create a player and other new FEATURES... but when you start an actual game, all you really have different is an updated roster....

it doesn't mean its a bad sequel.

AOE was the best selling RTS game of its time, by FAR!!!

My suggestions weren't very good? Well here are some new ones:

- Give players the ability to control the Empire. ATAT's, Walkers, etc.

- Add Multiplayer!!!! Give players the ability to go through mission together, give players the ability to go against one another, etc. (THIS WOULD ADD A GREAT DEAL TO THE GAME AND GIVE IT SOME REPLAYABILITY other than just going the same stuff to get a gold or silver metal!)

- Have more than just 10 small levels.

- Make the levels bigger.

How can you say these suggestions weren't very good? They would add sooooo much to the gameplay!!!

OK... So you are directly contradicting yourself in the first 2 statements. First you say they haven't added anything new, they you say they did...

The things they did add, such as a franchise mode, do change the gameplay. They change it to the extent that they can in a SPORTS game!!!!

Of coarse they cannot change the rules to how football plays...

But what they can change they do...

With Rogue Sqadron, it is a different story all together... Lucas could have added multi-player, could have let you control the empire and play the same levels from their vantage point, could have made the levels MUCH bigger, could have allowed to to actually switch to controlling a wingman during a level, etc...

Fact is, Lucas didn't add anything new to the game. The prettied the graphics and they have the SAME gameplay...

Seems pretty straight forward to me...

It is a BAD sequel to a good game. Nothing more. On its own it would be a great game, but because the N64 has had this game for years now, it has to be judged as a BAD sequel...

I feel that the same holds true for Super Smash brothers. At least from the pre-views I have read... They say that it is IDENTICAL to the N64 game, only it has better graphics.

That's not what I heard at all. There are several brand-new modes of play, including a single-player mode that is part fighter/part side-scroller.

"AOE was the best selling RTS game of its time, by FAR!!!"

So?

"Give players the ability to control the Empire. ATAT's, Walkers, etc."

That's an OK suggestion. Controlling an ATAT or Walker would be pretty damn boring though. I don't think controlling one of a million Tie fighters would be all that wonderful either.

"Add Multiplayer!!!!"

This is a greta idea. What are you gonna do though? Tons of games don't have multiplayer, it's just the way things are. It doesn't mean they aren't good games.

"Have more than just 10 small levels."

So the game is too short for your tastes? That's a valid complaint. More isn't always better though. I've played plenty of long games where I lost interest in the middle and had to suffer through the rest of the game. I think making the levels bigger would be a disaster too. The last thing I want to be doing is wandering around in space.

What this comes down to is that RL is about space combat and it has that nailed down pretty good. Here's another example: I hope there's a Gran Turismo 4 one day and I hope it plays like GT3. I think they really nailed simulation driving and Ill be pissed if they change it just for the sake of change.

It's called integrity. If everyone had some, the world would be a much better place IMO.

I never said they were charging more, just that I won't do business with them. If the xbox was $50 I wouldn't buy one.

And it's not like there aren't plenty of other options (at least for now...)

Ok I have to defend this game again. Call me a Star Wars fanboy if you want.

First of all there are levels where you play the empire, they are extras, but you get to play Darth Vader, thwarting the Rebellion at the first Death Star attack, then getting Revenge on the Yavin base. I think that is pretty cool. Ok it is not the whole game but those levels are in there.

Secondly, Lucas had NOTHING to do with this game. Factor 5 developed this game, not Lucas, not Lucasarts....Lucas did not create this game.

Finally levels with space combat were added, in the first the missions were solely planet based missions. In this game you can actually fly around in space missons like The Battle Of Endor.

One more thing. The graphics are more than prettied up, they are amazing, they are the most photorealistic Star Wars graphics I have ever seen. Hey maybe Halos graphics are better, I don't know. But I know I like the game. Hey if you don't like it that is cool, but your arguments for the game being bad are pretty thin. If you don't like it, you don't like it, that doesn't mean it is a "bad" game.

I think your experience will vary based on the store you visit.

For example, I visited the EB in Gurnee Mills (Chicago) and the fat, dorkbag, tool there was totally trashing the system, talking about how he was just "totally unimpressed" by it.

Meanwhile, I talked to an EB manager at Regency Square in VA and we ended up talking for about 15 minutes about the system, what it offers and what people have been saying about it (mostly positive).

Just depends on who you get when.

I know this guy!