Gallant: Like I said there is going to be a performance hit which Anand says, but I think they're overstating on what kind of performance hit it's taking. Excuse me if I don't fully trust Anand when it comes to console hardware. From what I've understood from a friend at EA, the performance hit is pretty small which is why they are using the technique they're doing at all.

Yes I currently do run Linux off my PS2. Here's a couple pics:

http://ps2linux.scea.com/main.jpg
http://ps2linux.scea.com/screenshot.jpg

Also here is a diagram that lists the output of the Graphic Synthesizer:

http://www.video-source.com/stuff/misc/gs-output.jpg

Where was that quote about resolution in their article? I only quickly looked at it and couldn't find it. I need to see the context in what they're saying to understand their point.

Wowza: What are you talking about? What court case with Midway? Plus Midway continued to release games on the system. Otherwise you wouldn't have the various sequals to Blitz and Hangtime/Showtime.

BK: Cool! Is that for PS2 developers only or is some sort of hack?

Here's the part of the article that has that quote: http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1561&p=10

The quote comes from the first paragraph. Just a typo?

GP

Ah found the quote and like I said I wouldn't trust Anand when it comes to console hardware. It's not their normal field of expertise. You can expect errors such as this. Had an article about the PS2 been written around the time of the launch, the misconception of 4 megs of VRAM could have very well ended up in an article from them since that was the conventional way of thinking back then. Anand is under the assumption that the PS2 only outputs in a field rendering mode which is only one of the possible ways of sending video output. It is not the only way like Anand is stating. In fact not all games use this mode and some are using the normal 640 x 480 method. Clearly shown in the picture I gave above, it shows what the system is capable of outputing. The GameCube does something similar as the PS2 as it can render in either method.

That PS2 Linux kit is actually a consumer level hobby development kit. It's similiar to what Sony did with the Yaroze program during the PS days. You get:

40 GB HDD
Ethernet Card
PS2 Linux Software
USB Mouse
USB Keyboard
VGA Adaptor Cable
PS2 Technical Documents for the EE, GS, and VU

Unfortunately it was offered with limited availability and hasn't been available since. It is rumored it might get a release in the US though.

OK, so PS2 does 480p, is there a VGA connector like the Dreamcast had? I had that and the games looked great in 480p, very crisp.

Darknight, which gaming systems do you personally own?

And as seeing you seem to have quite a bit of insight into the technical side of things, let me ask you this, "if you could only have one of the newer systems (PS2, Cube or Xbox) which would you have?"

Gallant: There isn't an official VGA adaptor outside of the one that is used with the Linux kit. Even if there was one, it's unlikely any of the games would work with it since the games would have to be coded to recognize the adaptor and output in that mode. That's why despite me having a VGA adaptor, none of the games will show up on the monitor. The only thing you can get right now is a third party VGA box which is just a line doubler that lets you hook the PS2 up to monitors. It's not true VGA output, but it should look better than normal composite output.

Shuki: Well it depends on what aspect you would have me pick a system. If it was on games, it's purely subjective to each person, but the best bet is the PlayStation 2 given their third party support and exclusive software in comparison to the other two systems. If it's which one is likely to be the leader, again the PS2. If you mean by technical merrit, then it would have to be the Xbox. Here's a list of systems I currently own:

3DO Panasonic FZ-1
Atari Jaguar
Atari Lynx
Bandai WonderSwan (JP)
Bandai WonderSwan Color FF1 LE(JP)
Bandai WonderSwan Color FF2 LE(JP)
Capcom CPS-2
JAMMA Arcade Cabinet (JP)
NEC PC Engine (JP)
NEC PC Engine CD (JP)
NEC PC Engine Core (JP)
NEC PC Engine LT (JP)
NEC Turbo Duo
NEC Turbo Express
NEC Super Grafx
Nintendo Famicom (JP)
Nintendo Famicom (New Style) (JP)
Nintendo Famicom Disk System (JP)
Nintendo Famicom Sharp Twin (JP)
Nintendo Game Boy x 3
Nintendo Game Boy Color x 4
Nintendo Game Boy Light
Nintendo Game Boy Pocket x 3
Nintendo Game Boy Advance x 4
Nintendo NES
Nintendo Super NES
Nintendo Nintendo 64 (JP)
Nintendo Nintendo 64DD (JP)
Nintendo GameCube
Nintendo Virtual Boy
Sega Dreamcast (JP)
Sega Dreamcast
Sega Game Gear
Sega Genesis 1 (Altered Beast version)
Sega Master System
Sega Nomad
Sega Saturn
Sega Sega 32X
Sega Sega CD 1
SNK Neo Geo Cartridge (JP)
SNK Neo Geo Pocket Color x 4
Sony PlayStation SCPH-1000 (JP)
Sony PlayStation SCPH-1001
Sony PlayStation SCPH-7501
Sony PSOne
Sony PlayStation 2 (JP)
Sony PlayStation 2

FFX was intended to be one of the first games to have Hard Drive support just in time for when it is released (to eliminate loading time, which isn't bad anyway), but probably due to time, they couldn't have it implemented so it wasn't added. For similar reasons, 5.1 sound in FMV's was removed. No announcements of this was announced, but let's just say I have inside info.

Darkknight, so the average gamer can't get true 480p, but just a, somewhat better than 480i, line doubler?

OK, this is kinda what I was getting to in that long, and way-too drawn out argument. Thank you so much for clearing that up and nice to have such a technical person posting here.

Thanks again.

GP

Vism: FFX does have HDD caching and dolby 5.1 in the Japanese version. I can understand removing the HDD aspect in the US version, but the dolby 5.1 audio doesn't make any sense to remove. I could have sworn SSX Tricky used 4.1 audio instead of 5.1 in DTS. If not, then I can't remember which other EA game did use DTS. I'm pretty positive it was SSX Tricky.

Gallant: Just to be clear, some games are being rendered in the interlaced mode, and some are being rendered in full frame. Just there is no way to take advantage of that despite the system and games already doing it. I just wanted to make sure that you knew that not all the games currently out are being rendered in the interlaced mode.

I do understand that, do you see something being created in the future to take advantage of 480p? Otherwise it's like driving a Corvette and never going over 50. :D

Oh! I see the DTS option now, hehe... thanks.

holy game system collections darknight is that for real?!?!

And I suppose I was wondering if you could only buy one system which would it be (taking everything into overall consideration)? Sounds like it would be the PS2. Seeing as you own a GC and the PS2 it looks like Xbox probably wouldn't be your choice huh?

I know it's all up to the individual gamer and the games they want but I was just curious as to your personal opinion.

Gallant: Possibly when the Network stuff comes out we'll see the VGA adaptor released to the general public. Unfortunately it looks like Sony sees VGA output that less than 1% of the gaming population uses as something that isn't worth their time. Probably the issue of games being rendered in interlaced and non-interlaced which hinder compatibility since I believe without a line doubler, which would cost extra, a simple VGA output wouldn't always work. Hopefully in the future we'll see progressive options like we're seeing in current GameCube games so that at least you can get 480p out of the component video output on a HDTV monitor/tv.

Shuki: Yep, that collection is for real. I've got nothing against the Xbox, it's just that it's the underdog, and is the one that least likely will do well out of the three. It's a fine system with some faults, but the other two systems have a much more probably rate of becoming more of a success and most likely a bulk of the software development will be on the PS2. So if you're going for one system, without knowing your tastes, the PS2 is the safe bet to recommend. But again, it's up to the taste of the user to select which system has more software that they like. My personal philosophy is that all systems have at least a few quality titles that are exclusive to it. Thus, by owning all systems, I don't have to worry about what game is on what system, I just have to worry about what game I want to play.

Gallant; Hope you're still paying attention and see this. You should check this link which further details Anand's inaccuracies. It's also a good read about the PS2.

http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenT...5&m=5050993713

Thanks! Very enlightening! :)

Darknight- How is the Wonderswan? I've been thinking about getting an import for quite some time. I'd love to know how you like it and such. I was very sad when the Neo Geo Pocket went under, because I just loved the damn thing to death. Anyways, the Wonderswan has always been one of those "damn I wish that would come out in the US, but it would die quickly here" things...

KEEP THE PS2!! Even if it means waiting on the xbox. I was just looking at some video of Baldur's Gate for the PS2 and I'm floored! Too many great games on it (and coming for it) to get rid of it. If you do get rid of it, I bet you'll regret it in the near future....

Lord; There are a couple good games for it, but there really isn't a lot of software out there to justify it IMO unless you can get it for cheap. The color screen on the WSC isn't that great and IMO is worse than the NGPC and GBA. It's not unusable, but it doesn't look as good as I remember seeing it when Bandai sent out the preview units before it was released. Unless you want to play through the Square titles in Japanese, a WSC is almost pointless. Beatmania is great on the system, as is Gumpey, but again, the software selection is rather limited. NGPC had more worthy games if you don't factor in the Square stuff. Heh the NGPC is the only system I can actually claim to have every game for. =) Too bad they're not all final retail copies though. Some might even be beta, but still, nice to have every game on one system. =)