HE Pennypacker

That is seriously the greatest post in this thread.

If ANYONE can give even a semblance of a plausible answer to at least 30% of the questions raised in that clip, I'll be impressed. I know CH was trying to be more amusing than anything else in that clip, but fucking hell, that nicely sums up this show for me. Hours upon hours of macguffins and things that ultimately didn't mean a god damn thing in the grand scheme of things. Kudos to the team that created that video and once again, fuck Tweedledee 'n' Tweedledum.

HE Pennypacker

Really? Am I just drunk then? In that case disregard my previous post.

PhantomStranger

The flash-sideways were basically a complete waste of our time as viewers. Plot filler disguised as a wish-fulfillment fantasy for the characters before going to Heaven. The writers were obviously afraid of changing the format of the show into a conventional narrative, and so foisted upon us flash-sideways that really did not matter. I will be fast-forwarding through them if I ever re-watch season six.
Here is the deal. Lots of people have speculated that the original plan was the Island was to be Purgatory all along (which really does explain a lot of the series), but that the writers got cold feet when so many fans started guessing that outcome.

Personally, the show only makes sense if you believe the Island exists outside of our reality. Make it a character test for each person to ascend to Heaven, and calling a spade a spade, we end up with the conclusion that the Losties were always in Purgatory, except when they escaped to the real world.

rocketsauce

...and it's also the second time the video has been posted here

HE Pennypacker

I see.

Sorry man.

Joe Schmoe

Re-watching the church scene now. Kate's outfit is so obviously different from what she was wearing in the parking lot that it almost makes me think the change was deliberate. Assuming it wasn't a continuity error, what could it mean? I know Kate said she'd meet Jack inside when he was ready to leave, but is it possible the Kate outside the church simply said that to get Jack to go inside? Maybe the Kate in the parking lot wasn't ready to let go even though she remembered her time on the island? (The same way Ben remembered his island life but chose not go into the church.) Maybe Kate didn't actually go into the church until many years later after she lived a long life but Jack wouldn't know the difference when he finds her inside.

whotony

Catching up on about 500 posts.

The shoe was revealing the passage of time. was clean and new in the pilot and dirty and old in the the finale.
the Injury to Jack in the pilot was on his left side close to his back, the injury in the finale was on his right side in the front, different.

Why is it flipped?

No doubts for me anymore after watching the ep a second time.
The Island seems to literally be a cork since Des and Jack had to put that stone/cork right back in the whole.

Agree, perpetual there always has to be a guardian.

I wasn't dissapointed I loved it but had the same emotions afterwards, made me think about a lot.

Well said. makes one wonder if this were to happen to us who would the people be that we meet up with, might not e who we would expect.

very good point.

Yes.

correct.

Yes this is the moment when Jack dies on the Island, this is right when he moves to this place they all created for meeting up somewhere when they all eventually die.

I think he died when he died on the island, but the other point of your idea I think makes a lot of sense.

whotony

I think it may have been the idea.

HE Pennypacker

You seem like you are up for the challenge.

Why not address the "unanswered" questions from the College Humor video posted on the previous page?

I'd like to hear your input.

HE Pennypacker

Actually, please provide a few words explaining the majority of the answers now. Thanks.

Joe Schmoe

As far as how Hurley ended up at the church if he was made ageless, Jack didn't bless the water before he had Hurley drink it. Assuming this wasn't a continuity error but deliberate, this means Hurley only drank dirty puddle water--not Holy Water. I know Jack said, "Now you're the same as me," but Hurley wasn't exaclty thrilled to get the job, so maybe Jack said it simply to boost Hurley's confidence. Hurley still could have served as island protector and died defending it or died of old age.

MrX

Almost all of them were wearing different clothes

Quapil

Sadly, the more time passed the more I'm fed up with the ending.

What I don't get...no matter how you fuck up, you still end up in buddy-heaven...except if you're Micheal of course. You can be a mercenary and still turn up, maybe get shot a few times, who knows, I'm pretty sure you will get reset somehow.
So, basically (and if you're not Micheal), no matter what you do, you end up there to live happily ever after in Heaven...and there is no opposite to that? The whole series they have black and white themes and now it's white only? It's either buddy heaven or whisper on the island?

But why did Desmond tell Jack that it doesn't matter what they do, before he entered the cave?
Sigh....I guess it's time to let go too....Farewell Lost, I enjoyed you almost 6 years but you turned out to be a foul apple in the end

whotony

Maybe tomorrow, quick answer, they where just different adventures on the way to the final place and as in life sometimes we don't get all the answers to all of our questions, like when someone answers "why not" to the question "why me?".

MrX

Because Desmond already knew where they were all going to end up when they died and whatever Jack did wasn't going to change that.

Quapil

So it wasn't a test after all. No matter what Jack would have done, he would have gone there.....that's the part it ruins everything for me

discostu1337

Well said!

tr0n

Island Desmond didn't have the full knowledge of the "purgatory" world. He thought it was a world where you could start over and be with the people you loved. From my viewpoint, he had no idea that what he saw was the afterlife, he just assumed there was an alternate world where the plane didn't crash.

That's why when Jack went into the cave, Desmond said that Jack was right all along.

RocShemp

I rewatched the episodes from Ab Aeterno to The End today. Desmond said it didn't matter because he thought he found a place where they all got what they wanted. He didn't realise they were all dead in that place. That's why later complained that he thought pulling the cork would send him home. Basically, Island Desmond didn't know shit as he misinterpreted the Sideways Universe. Sideways Desmond was the only one who figured it out. That was also why Island Jack told Island Desmond that there were no shortcuts. At the time he didn't know how right he was.

Remember how the MiB would always bring out the worst in people? He'd've done that one a global scale if he ever got out of the Island. Think Owlman's state of mind in Crisis On Two Earths and add the ability to corrupt individuals. Jack did save the world by killing Flocke and keeping the energies of life and death in balance by putting back the cork. He didn't heal because he was engulfed by the light in the pool. It didn't kill him outright but it overloaded him, so to speak. Basically, too much of a good thing.

The MiB was "special" he had an innate ability to manipulate the energies of the Island. That's why the Fake Mother originally looked to him as a replacement. The problem is he truly didn't understand how he could do the things he did or why exactly. He was essentially an über version of Walt, Miles, Hugo, and Desmond combined. That's why his soul tore from his body rather his outright dying when Jacob threw him in the pool. So a Smoke Monster isn't a natural occurrence but a freak accident.

As for the Sideways Universe, I believe it's one of two steps before the light. I believe Michael and the other Whisper People are those that simply cannot let go because they're punishing themselves for what they did/didn't do. They're restless spirits that cannot find peace. The Sideways spirits are those that can let go but for whatever reason (subconsciously) choose not to. It seems they are unfulfilled in some way. Like Claire feeling she can't be a mother to Aaron, Locke feeling unworthy of being loved, Linus wanting to have been there for Alex no matter the cost to himself, etc. They still have issues but they're not as far gone as the likes of Michael.

As for their creating that Sideways Universe, I believe they all did collectively but not consciously. So they were ina waking dream? How could they do that? Because they all possessed a portion of the Light (some more than others), just as the Fake Mother explained to Jacob and the MiB. Together they all subconsciously conspired to create a world where they could seek one another out. And since time has no place there, they could be there for figurative centuries but still eventually find one another.

When Whidmore put Desmond in the machine, he propelled him to an instance when he became aware in the Sideways Universe. However, Island Desmond misinterpreted what he experienced. Once Sideways Desmond set everything into motion, he accelerated the Losties process of recollection and helped them let go.

So had Jacob let the Smoke Monster off the Island, he would have eventually led mankind into chaos given his disdain for them. It was his nature because of how fractured and corrupt he'd become. The only way to let the MiB out is to pull the Cork. Doing that snuffs out the Light. Without the Light there is no Real World or Sideways Universe given both exist because of said Light. So we're screwed either way.

Anyhoo, that's how I interpreted things.

Quapil

Ok, Desmond makes some sense, but I still can't buy that some can't let go in the sideways universe and some can't let go off the island. In the end it would have made way more sense if it all didn't happen in reality but was just some kind of test to sort out the good and the bad....but that's just me.

What makes me more and more sad is, that after six years, all what's left of lost is when they died and how many kind of sideway universes you can get stuck if you don't let go.........questions, that never bugged anyone before the finaly and questions I don't want to think about at all.....but it's a good distraction to avoid the real questions.

HE Pennypacker

thebunk

Agreed 110%. LOL @ LOST being a character driven show.

hardercore

It appears HE Pennypacker is a long, long way from cooling his jets. Will check back around post #2400.

Aegean2007

I just spent a few hours going over all the posts here!

My thoughts on the finale:

I wasn't too pleased with the spiritual ending when I first watched it, but after reading the posts here I have come to like it a little more.

Overall, I would rate the finale an 8/10 or so, with "The Constant" being a 10/10 and "Across the Sea" being around a 3/10.

I agree with the - Sideways = "purgatory," Island = real - interpretation.

I believe that Sideways Aaron is not real, just like Jack's son, David - they were both tools used for the characters to work out their unresolved issues. The real Aaron would then have his own Sideways "purgatory" of his happiest stage of life, probably as an adult.

I do have to say that the logic of the Sideways universe really makes no sense to me at all. If David is not real, who else is not real? Is Pierre Chang real? Christian Shephard? Locke's girlfriend Helen?

ATX

does it really make sense to analyze and disect the sideways world?

i mean desmond conciousness time travels and after the finale we realize that not only could he time travel but apparently he can move freely between aliveworld and the afterlife

so at some point you gotta just accept these plots and move around