Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
04-04-09 | 07:17 PM
#26
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
The real things wouldn't have their memories wiped afterwards. The personalities would also be custom-tailored for each client. For example, a real prostitute would probably not be an expert motorcycle stunt rider.
04-05-09 | 10:40 AM
#27
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Also, they are programmed to like YOU. They aren't pretending. They aren't going through the motions. You don't see why a rich person would love the idea of an extremely attractive girl actually in love with him, rather than his money?
04-05-09 | 02:50 PM
#28
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
And like Spence a few weeks ago, he got to see a genuine look in the Dolls eyes when he would show her the new house. He wasn't going to get that reaction with a common whore.
04-05-09 | 03:18 PM
#29
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
I'm still waiting to hear some of the weirder military phonetic names. Where's my Foxtrot and Yankee?
04-05-09 | 04:05 PM
#30
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Has there been an odder collection of cast names for a tv show?
Eliza Dushku
Harry Lennix
Tahmoh Penikett
Enver Gjokaj
Dichen Lachman
Reed Diamond
Miracle Laurie
Anyway, like Joss Whedon's previous shows, it just gets better and better when given time to grow.
Eliza Dushku
Harry Lennix
Tahmoh Penikett
Enver Gjokaj
Dichen Lachman
Reed Diamond
Miracle Laurie
Anyway, like Joss Whedon's previous shows, it just gets better and better when given time to grow.
04-05-09 | 06:10 PM
#31
Senior Member
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
I notice that every time I see the credits. And I agree with your point, since episode 6 it has been getting really good.
04-05-09 | 06:45 PM
#32
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
I completely agree with your wife. The glasses she wore in the "pop singer" episode really toned down the Roswell-ian facial structure, but other than that, very alien-like.
04-05-09 | 09:06 PM
#34
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
The only reason I'm still watching this is because of Joss Whedon. Every week they tease with "Next week, all is finally revealed and the memories come back..." and it doesn't happen. This is beginning to feel pointless, like Lost.
It's just very hard to build tension, conflict, and empathy with characters who have no memory, personality and lack the ability to make choices or change.
I'm going to stick with it for the rest of the season because I just can't believe that Whedon doesn't have something up his sleeve... but if the season ends with nothing of consequence happening to the characters or the story, I'm out.
It's just very hard to build tension, conflict, and empathy with characters who have no memory, personality and lack the ability to make choices or change.
I'm going to stick with it for the rest of the season because I just can't believe that Whedon doesn't have something up his sleeve... but if the season ends with nothing of consequence happening to the characters or the story, I'm out.
04-05-09 | 11:40 PM
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04-06-09 | 01:50 AM
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
They have some really good characters which they could focus on - the dollhouse heads, the handlers, the agent hunting them, even the doctor (Acker) could be developed much better. The last few episodes seem to have swung in this direction a bit, but in my view the less they focus on the dolls and the more they focus on these other characters and the moral, legal, commercial quandaries around the concept of dolls or even the inception of the whole dollhouse business; the better off the show is. How do people know to hire dolls? Have any of them not been happy and threatened to go to the authorities? How do they recruit dolls? (this was touched upon a bit) Where do they get the character programming from? What's the global dollhouse structure? How do they recruit handlers? How does "attic'ing" (retiring) the dolls work? etc....
While the last few shows have been better, it shows how poor the first few were - sure they had to get the "doll" concept across, but making the entire storylines showing the doll was probably not necessary (with just little bits of overall story arc thrown in).
Last edited by wirefan; 04-06-09 at 01:53 AM.
04-06-09 | 01:57 AM
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04-06-09 | 02:53 AM
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
From Airlock Alpha (formerly known as SyFy Portal):
Fox Leaning Toward 'Dollhouse' Renewal
But news not so good for 'Sarah Connor'
By MICHAEL HINMAN
The Fox network is just a step away from shaking up its Friday lineup for the 2009-10 season, canning one show and considering a move to a new night for a second.
Let's hit the good news first. Airlock Alpha has learned that Fox is looking to give its struggling "Dollhouse" a second season, to see if it can grow some legs on a new night. Fox had originally intended "Dollhouse" to air Mondays with "24," but Fox instead decided to move "House" to that spot to replace "Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles," and to create sort of a genre theme night on Fridays.
The audience for "Dollhouse" are not exactly where Fox had hoped they would be, however, critical reaction to later episodes following its February premiere has grown more positive toward the series as it has had the chance to flesh itself out. Showrunner Joss Whedon had said ahead of its premiere that he had gone back to retool certain aspects of the show, including using a new premiere episode than what was originally planned, eventually canning what would have been the premiere.
The move seems to be an easy one for Fox. While the audience hasn't been as large as expected, it has instead remained stable. It's not a number that Fox uses, but "Dollhouse" carries a BlipNetwork Stability Index Rating of 92.0, better than every other network genre show currently on television outside of "Reaper" on The CW, which has a 94.7. A Stability Index Rating is the comparison of the show's highest overnight rating and its average overnight rating to see how much of its overall audience a show has retained.
Other factors in favor of the show continuing is that it's not as expensive as other Fox shows. Much of its upfront costs, including the construction of the elaborate set that is the dollhouse itself, were covered by funds that normally would've paid for a pilot (no pilot was made for "Dollhouse"). Also, while Whedon's Mutant Enemy Productions and star Eliza Dushku's Boston Diva Productions are tied to the series, 20th Century Fox Television is still the primary production company involved, which means its licensing fee is not as steep as it would be if the show was produced by another studio.
That, along with ratings, is one of the aspects killing "Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles." That show is set to end its second season April 10 after a 22-episode run, but its sophomore season has been nothing but a complete struggle.
After a so-so debut on Mondays and never finding its grip after that with audiences, Fox teetered on canceling the show until surprisingly deciding to give it a full-season pickup and moving it to Fridays as a lead-in to "Dollhouse." Rumors were that Warner Bros. Television, which produces the show, slashed its licensing fee to prompt a pickup as a way to help it promote its upcoming "Terminator: Salvation," which premieres May 21.
Once "Salvation" premieres, it seems Warner Bros. will have little use to keep "Sarah Connor" on the air, and likely will not continue to provide a licensing fee discount for a third season. That almost assuredly will allow Fox to make the move it normally would've done before New Year's, and that's cancel the show.
Last year, "Sarah Connor" had the worst Stability Index Rating of all network genre shows, mostly from its inflated series premiere following the National Football League playoffs. This year, it's Stability Index Rating is stronger, but out of 14 network genre show tracked by Airlock Alpha this season, "Sarah Connor" is ranked 13th. Only "Life On Mars" had a worse Stability Index Rating, mostly from its freefall following its move from Thursdays against "Eleventh Hour" to Wednesdays following "Lost."
Of course, none of this has been confirmed by Fox, so it should be treated as any rumor would, meaning information can change, or could even be wrong.
"Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles" airs Fridays at 8 p.m. ET on Fox. "Dollhouse" airs Fridays at 9 p.m. ET on Fox.
http://www.airlockalpha.com/news426236.html
But news not so good for 'Sarah Connor'
By MICHAEL HINMAN
The Fox network is just a step away from shaking up its Friday lineup for the 2009-10 season, canning one show and considering a move to a new night for a second.
Let's hit the good news first. Airlock Alpha has learned that Fox is looking to give its struggling "Dollhouse" a second season, to see if it can grow some legs on a new night. Fox had originally intended "Dollhouse" to air Mondays with "24," but Fox instead decided to move "House" to that spot to replace "Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles," and to create sort of a genre theme night on Fridays.
The audience for "Dollhouse" are not exactly where Fox had hoped they would be, however, critical reaction to later episodes following its February premiere has grown more positive toward the series as it has had the chance to flesh itself out. Showrunner Joss Whedon had said ahead of its premiere that he had gone back to retool certain aspects of the show, including using a new premiere episode than what was originally planned, eventually canning what would have been the premiere.
The move seems to be an easy one for Fox. While the audience hasn't been as large as expected, it has instead remained stable. It's not a number that Fox uses, but "Dollhouse" carries a BlipNetwork Stability Index Rating of 92.0, better than every other network genre show currently on television outside of "Reaper" on The CW, which has a 94.7. A Stability Index Rating is the comparison of the show's highest overnight rating and its average overnight rating to see how much of its overall audience a show has retained.
Other factors in favor of the show continuing is that it's not as expensive as other Fox shows. Much of its upfront costs, including the construction of the elaborate set that is the dollhouse itself, were covered by funds that normally would've paid for a pilot (no pilot was made for "Dollhouse"). Also, while Whedon's Mutant Enemy Productions and star Eliza Dushku's Boston Diva Productions are tied to the series, 20th Century Fox Television is still the primary production company involved, which means its licensing fee is not as steep as it would be if the show was produced by another studio.
That, along with ratings, is one of the aspects killing "Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles." That show is set to end its second season April 10 after a 22-episode run, but its sophomore season has been nothing but a complete struggle.
After a so-so debut on Mondays and never finding its grip after that with audiences, Fox teetered on canceling the show until surprisingly deciding to give it a full-season pickup and moving it to Fridays as a lead-in to "Dollhouse." Rumors were that Warner Bros. Television, which produces the show, slashed its licensing fee to prompt a pickup as a way to help it promote its upcoming "Terminator: Salvation," which premieres May 21.
Once "Salvation" premieres, it seems Warner Bros. will have little use to keep "Sarah Connor" on the air, and likely will not continue to provide a licensing fee discount for a third season. That almost assuredly will allow Fox to make the move it normally would've done before New Year's, and that's cancel the show.
Last year, "Sarah Connor" had the worst Stability Index Rating of all network genre shows, mostly from its inflated series premiere following the National Football League playoffs. This year, it's Stability Index Rating is stronger, but out of 14 network genre show tracked by Airlock Alpha this season, "Sarah Connor" is ranked 13th. Only "Life On Mars" had a worse Stability Index Rating, mostly from its freefall following its move from Thursdays against "Eleventh Hour" to Wednesdays following "Lost."
Of course, none of this has been confirmed by Fox, so it should be treated as any rumor would, meaning information can change, or could even be wrong.
"Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles" airs Fridays at 8 p.m. ET on Fox. "Dollhouse" airs Fridays at 9 p.m. ET on Fox.
http://www.airlockalpha.com/news426236.html
04-06-09 | 08:04 AM
#40
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
I think this hit the nail on the head - on the "good" episode (ep6); the handlers, the agent, and the dollhouse chiefs took more of a prominent role and the dolls were almost secondary (esp Echo). Which brings me back to it probably would have been better to have a no-name in the "lead" doll role instead of Dushku - I actually like the other 2 doll characters more than Echo. A no-name in that roll would strengthen the concept of the doll (in my view); and avoid making the dolls the star of the show. Unless Echo is going to go rogue or alpha-like, there really is no need to have Echo play such a prominent part - which means either this is poorly written/conceived (which I doubt), or this "twist" is being telegraphed
They have some really good characters which they could focus on - the dollhouse heads, the handlers, the agent hunting them, even the doctor (Acker) could be developed much better. The last few episodes seem to have swung in this direction a bit, but in my view the less they focus on the dolls and the more they focus on these other characters and the moral, legal, commercial quandaries around the concept of dolls or even the inception of the whole dollhouse business; the better off the show is. How do people know to hire dolls? Have any of them not been happy and threatened to go to the authorities? How do they recruit dolls? (this was touched upon a bit) Where do they get the character programming from? What's the global dollhouse structure? How do they recruit handlers? How does "attic'ing" (retiring) the dolls work? etc....
While the last few shows have been better, it shows how poor the first few were - sure they had to get the "doll" concept across, but making the entire storylines showing the doll was probably not necessary (with just little bits of overall story arc thrown in).
They have some really good characters which they could focus on - the dollhouse heads, the handlers, the agent hunting them, even the doctor (Acker) could be developed much better. The last few episodes seem to have swung in this direction a bit, but in my view the less they focus on the dolls and the more they focus on these other characters and the moral, legal, commercial quandaries around the concept of dolls or even the inception of the whole dollhouse business; the better off the show is. How do people know to hire dolls? Have any of them not been happy and threatened to go to the authorities? How do they recruit dolls? (this was touched upon a bit) Where do they get the character programming from? What's the global dollhouse structure? How do they recruit handlers? How does "attic'ing" (retiring) the dolls work? etc....
While the last few shows have been better, it shows how poor the first few were - sure they had to get the "doll" concept across, but making the entire storylines showing the doll was probably not necessary (with just little bits of overall story arc thrown in).
04-06-09 | 08:44 AM
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
I think that Sierra's origin shows how nuts some rich people can be. Some would be more than willing to pay a lot of money for "the real thing."
04-06-09 | 08:49 AM
#42
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
with all of these dolls glitching, and the costs and headaches associated with running the place, it hardly seems worth it. the premise of this show is poop.
04-06-09 | 08:56 AM
#43
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Agreed, unless there's some other purpose for the house which we don't yet know. Some secret military/homeland security application, perhaps.
04-06-09 | 09:00 AM
#44
Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Well, it seems like the glitches have only now become frequent. We don't know how long the dollhouses were successfully running before Alpha. Also, perhaps they make enough money that the glitches basically cost them nothing. If you're pulling in millions per engagement, I doubt they give a shit that every now and then they freak out. I mean how much did it really cost them to let these dolls live out their past memories for closure?
04-06-09 | 11:48 AM
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Brain Researchers Open Door To Editing Memory:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/he...rain.html?_r=1
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/he...ewanted=2&_r=1
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/he...rain.html?_r=1
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/he...ewanted=2&_r=1
04-06-09 | 12:35 PM
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/swnwPLkT88g&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/swnwPLkT88g&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
04-06-09 | 12:50 PM
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Joss Whedon's original pilot script (first draft):
http://leethomson.myzen.co.uk/Dollhouse_1x01_-_Echo.pdf
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/3236356/...se_1x01_-_Echo
Original pilot trailer:
http://www.mutantenemyproductions.co...ler_200805.mp4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDcEKo4V7fA
http://leethomson.myzen.co.uk/Dollhouse_1x01_-_Echo.pdf
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/3236356/...se_1x01_-_Echo
Original pilot trailer:
http://www.mutantenemyproductions.co...ler_200805.mp4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDcEKo4V7fA
Last edited by Barry Woodward; 04-06-09 at 01:22 PM.
04-06-09 | 08:35 PM
#48
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Re: Dollhouse -- "Needs" -- 4/3/09
Where exactly did I (or "people") say they should cover ALL of that in 8 shows? I'm not saying cover it all, but why did they spend so much time early on on the doll missions and not flesh out SOME (or more) of it? If you are running the risk of getting canceled, and Whedon has been around long enough with Fox to know how the game works before the pilot even aired, you actually can't take all the time you want with that stuff - it's not a matter of revealing everything but revealing enough to get people, media, etc on board rather than say... it'll change on Episode 6. Fortunately from the article above it looks like Fox will give it another season, but it was probably a close call (probably not helped by the first 5 episodes)
