Arrested Devlopment to Showtime? - more from Variety
#176
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
As for the Fox deal, you do realize that Fox has plenty to gain from another network taking it. They still retain DVD distribution and are the production company of the show. So if someone else wants to take it into syndication numbers of 88 episodes, they'll be glad to let it get piss poor ratings on another network. Who said Fox was being a dick about it?
FOX, the network, right now has to decide what it wants to do with AD. It can order a 4th season for itself, which really doesn't seem likely. It could cancell the show and let it go to another network. Or, they could act like extreme dicks and sit on the show, not officially cancelling it, but not ordering new episodes, effectively killing it. FOX did that third option with FUTURAMA, so it's not out of the question.
#177
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Jay G.
FOX did that third option with FUTURAMA, so it's not out of the question.
#178
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Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
No but TV guide is reporting that the Office is doing phenomenal on iTunes. Just more evidence that the "Nielsen" model is flawed & outdated.
The Office is a top 20 show amongst Tivo users & generates a ton of d/ls on iTunes where you actually have to pay for it, yet doesn't garner great Nielsen numbers. It just doesn't add up.
The Office is a top 20 show amongst Tivo users & generates a ton of d/ls on iTunes where you actually have to pay for it, yet doesn't garner great Nielsen numbers. It just doesn't add up.
And Nielsen is adding more DVR viewers to its survey sample, up until it matches the same percentage as overall Americans who have DVRs.
The problem isn't with Nielsen, which does its job well, which is to say how many people who are watching it on TV. The problem is whether a Network should just take in consideration those types of viewers. Product placement means that people will see a product even if they skip past the commercials (Chili's references in The Office). Download revenue can offset costs, as can DVD sales and syndication, at least to the production company. Paramount discounted the last season of Enterprise to UPN in anticipation of DVD and syndication sales.
With Arrested Development, it's a strong seller on DVD, but the viewership numbers have never added up. FOX cares mainly about the numbers they can show to the advertisers. If reruns of Prison Break get more viewers, so be it. ABC will be a similar boat, although they might give it a break if it brings in certain viewers or critics awards. Showtime won't care about selling the show to advertisers, but if AD doesn't help their subscription level, it could get the axe.
#179
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From: City of the lakers.. riots.. and drug dealing cops.. los(t) Angel(e)s. ca.
Originally Posted by Jay G.
You have to seperate FOX the network from Fox Television Studios, and even from Fox Home Entertainment. All three are seperate entities, and should be treated as such. Fox TV Studios would definitely benefit from the show continuing, since they produce it. They would also get additional revenue from DVD sales, as would Fox Home Entertainment, which distributes this particular show on DVD. However, once the show leaves FOX, the network, FOX receives no more revenue from in. In fact, if the show is picked up by ABC, and the show is a success on ABC, Arrested Development would then be a competitor to whatever FOX show is on at the same time. Networks usually don't like to give their competitors ammunition.
Fox has attempted to repackage this so many different ways and attempted to sell it to the viewers over the course of three seasons and it's not hitting a target big enough to warrent it being on their own network.
Much like how they offer Buffy, Angel and Tru Calling to other networks and only Buffy got the chance to go to two different ones, I see why the network would mind giving it to another network. Especially when the other two of the three companies benefit. Especially in the aspects they are in. Television gets all that much closer to the magic syndication number and Home Video gets more shows to package into a dvd that is selling in the top 50 no problem.
Buffy got that bump from WB to UPN and because UPN felt the ratings were lackluster they didn't want to take on Angel when WB canceled it (hey, could reunion be a sort of f you?) and Tru Calling was offered to both networks and they shot it down.
Considering how much of a ratings slumper AD is, All three entities have everything to gain from the move. Fox Network doesn't need to worry about low ratings bringing down advertisment rates, 20th Television has a couple more episodes to reach magic number and Home Video has a hot seller to keep selling.
FOX did that third option with FUTURAMA, so it's not out of the question.
Arrested Development is already wanted and they only have four episodes to burn which are already set to air in Feb.
Last edited by Jackskeleton; 01-14-06 at 07:10 PM.
#181
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by uhftv
Tv Guide Channel just announced fox will air the AD 'season' finale in February.
Jeez, is it summer already?
Jeez, is it summer already?
#182
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
Fox has attempted to repackage this so many different ways and attempted to sell it to the viewers over the course of three seasons and it's not hitting a target big enough to warrent it being on their own network.
Much like how they offer Buffy, Angel and Tru Calling to other networks and only Buffy got the chance to go to two different ones, I see why the network would mind giving it to another network.
Much like how they offer Buffy, Angel and Tru Calling to other networks and only Buffy got the chance to go to two different ones, I see why the network would mind giving it to another network.
Televison studios and Television networks must work as seperate, autonomous units, as mandated by Federal Law. As a result, lots of shows produced by Fox Television Studios are made for networks other than FOX, and FOX airs shows produced by studios other than Fox Television.
Especially when the other two of the three companies benefit. Especially in the aspects they are in. Television gets all that much closer to the magic syndication number and Home Video gets more shows to package into a dvd that is selling in the top 50 no problem.
Buffy got that bump from WB to UPN and because UPN felt the ratings were lackluster they didn't want to take on Angel when WB canceled it (hey, could reunion be a sort of f you?)
Considering how much of a ratings slumper AD is, All three entities have everything to gain from the move. Fox Network doesn't need to worry about low ratings bringing down advertisment rates,
Difference... [Futurama was a] 2 million dollar budget cartoon that no one else could afford and Fox had two seasons worth of episodes left to air.
As for other networks, Futurama never had the chance to even try other networks, since it wasn't cancelled until a year and half after the production shut up shop.
Now, I'm not saying Arrested Development will face the same fate. FOX doesn't have the same backlog of episodes to air, so cancellation could be much more imminent. Also, while not directly benefitting from its continuation, FOX's parent company might like to see it continue to the benefit of two of its other divisions, unlike Reunion, which was produced by Warner Bros and would likely be released on video by WHV. It's by no means a slam dunk though that it will be released by FOX to go to another network.
#183
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From: City of the lakers.. riots.. and drug dealing cops.. los(t) Angel(e)s. ca.
Except there's no benefit for FOX, the network, and the ball is in their court. Basically, whenever a show is cancelled and allowed to go to another network, it's at the grace of the original network. Sometimes that network can be nice about it, and sometimes they can be dicks.
You're still confusing three seperate entities as one unit. Buffy and Angel were never developed for FOX the network and then "offered" to another network. They were developed from the ground up for the WB.
Televison studios and Television networks must work as seperate, autonomous units, as mandated by Federal Law. As a result, lots of shows produced by Fox Television Studios are made for networks other than FOX, and FOX airs shows produced by studios other than Fox Television.
Televison studios and Television networks must work as seperate, autonomous units, as mandated by Federal Law. As a result, lots of shows produced by Fox Television Studios are made for networks other than FOX, and FOX airs shows produced by studios other than Fox Television.
As for futurama, even when new episodes weren't ordered and they burned away the episodes that to them would last the two seasons because of how many times football pre-empted them, no other network was interested or even considered it because of the production cost per episode.
Fox Network has the rights of first refusal for the 20th television shows. In this case, they will either have the choice to renew or refuse it. At that point 20th television and imagine go for the first run rights to others. Especially with ABC and showtime expressing great interest and Fox already set for when they will burn off the episodes and wipe their hands clean of it, I don't see why you can't tell that this is a completely different case then.. say Reunion.
This is a different case completely.
while not directly benefitting from its continuation, FOX's parent company might like to see it continue to the benefit of two of its other divisions, unlike Reunion, which was produced by Warner Bros and would likely be released on video by WHV.
#184
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Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
And as many times as it has been said... what has fox done to Arrested Development to show that it's being a dick to it?
Thanks for stating what I already know first hand. The point is, much like tru calling, The over all business has two thirds to benefit from this.
Network may lose a show, but they already have shitty ratings with the show. So it's no loss to lose it or give it up to another network and run it as a first run syndication program to another network.
As for futurama, even when new episodes weren't ordered and they burned away the episodes that to them would last the two seasons because of how many times football pre-empted them,
no other network was interested or even considered it because of the production cost per episode.
Fox Network has the rights of first refusal for the 20th television shows. In this case, they will either have the choice to renew or refuse it.
At that point 20th television and imagine go for the first run rights to others. Especially with ABC and showtime expressing great interest and Fox already set for when they will burn off the episodes and wipe their hands clean of it, I don't see why you can't tell that this is a completely different case then.. say Reunion.
This is a different case completely.
This is a different case completely.
gee, thanks for stating what I already said. Much like how WB canceled Angel because they wanted to go with a potential pilot that failed, WB had no interest in or invested concern for angel since it wasn't there production.
Much the same Fox doesn't give a shit about Reunion. It doesn't benefit the over all investiment of the studio in the other aspects.
....it could get 20th television to have another 88 episode syndicated show. Considering once you hit that number you make free money with your show..
#185
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Originally Posted by Jay G.
I've seen the "magic number" for syndication be as low as 65 episodes, and as high as 100. The truth is that there is no solid "magic number" for a show. More episodes do make a show more appealing to syndication, since it'd repeat itself less often, but I've seen shows like "Sledge Hammer," "Ned and Stacey," and "Get a Life" in syndication, all of which lasted for only 2 seasons. Family Guy was sold into syndication with 49 episodes. Firefly's being re-aired on Sci-Fi with only 14 episodes.
#186
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From: City of the lakers.. riots.. and drug dealing cops.. los(t) Angel(e)s. ca.
Well, so far it hasn't officially cancelled the show, despite shortening the order for new shows this season and now burning through the rest. Productions can't sit on their haunches forever, people need paychecks. When Firefly was over, it was officially cancelled before the last episode aired. Maybe they have a legitimate reason for not officially cancelling AD yet.
If it's no loss, why do they occasionally not let other networks pick up the shows they cancel?
The WB doesn't have any productions, and neither does FOX, or ABC, NBC, CBS, or UPN for that matter.
Fox studio didn't make Reunion. Are you confusing the network with the studio again?
More episodes getting sold into syndication gathers more value when selling it. While there has been cases in the past of highly wanted shows being sold, the model still normally stays the same but has dropped from the 100 episode mark to even 75. It depends on the demand of the show.
#187
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Man, this AD arguement is giving me a headache. I hope the final 4 episodes thread doesn''t get hijacked with this overused arguement. I just want to hear about possible news of the Showtime and ABC developments.
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From: City of the lakers.. riots.. and drug dealing cops.. los(t) Angel(e)s. ca.
The argument about if it benefits fox or doesn't is besides the point and really has gone on longer than it should. We already know that it will be shopped around by the production company to others and others are more than interested. The "what ifs" shouldn't even be factored in because you might as well ask "what if Jason Bateman dies tonight."
We should all be glad that it's going to get a two hour final send off and just wait and see what the possible news on what the future holds for it.
We should all be glad that it's going to get a two hour final send off and just wait and see what the possible news on what the future holds for it.
#189
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More news on the Showtime front (comments from the Showtime president and the Showtime CEO):
http://tv.zap2it.com/tveditorial/tve_main/1,1002,271|99635|1|,00.html
http://tv.zap2it.com/tveditorial/tve_main/1,1002,271|99635|1|,00.html
Showtime Wants to Get 'Arrested'
By Rick Porter
Friday, January 20, 2006
08:56 AM PT
Showtime is certainly not playing coy about its desire to pick up "Arrested Development" if FOX cancels the show. But the cable network doesn't seem to be blind in its ardor either.
Speaking to reporters Thursday (Jan. 19) at the Television Critics Association press tour, Showtime Entertainment president Robert Greenblatt acknowledged that his network and 20th Century Fox TV, which produces "Arrested," have been discussing the show. (ABC has reportedly expressed interest as well.)
"I always thought it was probably a better fit on a cable network than on a broadcast network," Greenblatt says. "And you know, in fact, I think it really does fit in with a lot of the things that we're doing."
Still, several things have to fall into place for the Emmy-winning series to make the move to premium cable. FOX, first of all, has to cancel the show -- which it probably will, given network head Peter Ligouri's statement earlier in the week that it's "highly unlikely" the show will return to FOX next season. And Greenblatt says striking the right deal between network and studio "is complicated and takes longer than you'd ever imagine."
More important, though, Greenblatt says Showtime would only want "Arrested Development" if its creator, Mitch Hurwitz, remains involved.
"I think he's the genius behind it, and he hasn't yet come to that decision to continue the show," Greenblatt says of Hurwitz. "He's been through a lot of sort of emotional roller coaster over the last couple years. So he finished the season for FOX, and he's in that period of, you know, thinking about whether he wants to continue the show."
"Arrested's" audience of about 4.2 million viewers per week is pretty small for a broadcast network. But for Showtime, which is in fewer than 20 million homes, even, say, a quarter of that number would be considered a success. The lure of the show could potentially lead to new subscriptions, meaning a bigger possible audience for Showtime's other series.
"[Picking up 'Arrested'] at a point in time where we're having a good deal of success both critically and commercially makes a really big statement for us," Showtime Chairman and CEO Matthew Blank says. There's a lot of things we could be doing right now. But for me, the prospects of having 'Arrested Development' and [recent Golden Globe honoree] 'Weeds' on this network, you know, at the same time are quite remarkable."
By Rick Porter
Friday, January 20, 2006
08:56 AM PT
Showtime is certainly not playing coy about its desire to pick up "Arrested Development" if FOX cancels the show. But the cable network doesn't seem to be blind in its ardor either.
Speaking to reporters Thursday (Jan. 19) at the Television Critics Association press tour, Showtime Entertainment president Robert Greenblatt acknowledged that his network and 20th Century Fox TV, which produces "Arrested," have been discussing the show. (ABC has reportedly expressed interest as well.)
"I always thought it was probably a better fit on a cable network than on a broadcast network," Greenblatt says. "And you know, in fact, I think it really does fit in with a lot of the things that we're doing."
Still, several things have to fall into place for the Emmy-winning series to make the move to premium cable. FOX, first of all, has to cancel the show -- which it probably will, given network head Peter Ligouri's statement earlier in the week that it's "highly unlikely" the show will return to FOX next season. And Greenblatt says striking the right deal between network and studio "is complicated and takes longer than you'd ever imagine."
More important, though, Greenblatt says Showtime would only want "Arrested Development" if its creator, Mitch Hurwitz, remains involved.
"I think he's the genius behind it, and he hasn't yet come to that decision to continue the show," Greenblatt says of Hurwitz. "He's been through a lot of sort of emotional roller coaster over the last couple years. So he finished the season for FOX, and he's in that period of, you know, thinking about whether he wants to continue the show."
"Arrested's" audience of about 4.2 million viewers per week is pretty small for a broadcast network. But for Showtime, which is in fewer than 20 million homes, even, say, a quarter of that number would be considered a success. The lure of the show could potentially lead to new subscriptions, meaning a bigger possible audience for Showtime's other series.
"[Picking up 'Arrested'] at a point in time where we're having a good deal of success both critically and commercially makes a really big statement for us," Showtime Chairman and CEO Matthew Blank says. There's a lot of things we could be doing right now. But for me, the prospects of having 'Arrested Development' and [recent Golden Globe honoree] 'Weeds' on this network, you know, at the same time are quite remarkable."
#191
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Sure. Film it and add it to the Boy Fight collection.
#193
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I think Jack has a point, and I can't complain about Fox keeping AD on the air as long as it did. Sure some of the night/time changes may not have helped, but at the end it comes down to the American TV viewing Public not watching this show.
birrman54
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#195
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Originally Posted by Nosebleed
He does have a point. It's just tiring to see a lengthy defence of its actions whenever someone makes a negative comment about Fox.
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From: Formerly known as Groucho AND Bandoman/Death Moans, Iowa
Originally Posted by Nosebleed
I've never seen someone so fiercely loyal to an employer than Jack is to Fox. What is your job, exactly? To stick up for them on internet messageboards?
Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
The problem is that after Malcolm hit the syndication mark the network just hasn't really cared about it. Putting it on fridays and also where Futurama was during Football season doesn't help in the slightest bit.
#197
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from zap2it.com (looks like if it is going to happen, its going to be Showtime):
'Arrested Development' a 'Long Shot' for ABC
By Rick Porter Saturday, January 21, 2006 11:29 AM PT
And now, the last "Arrested Development" story from the Television Critics Association midseason press tour.
Speaking to reporters Saturday (Jan. 21) at the Television Critics Association press tour, ABC Entertainment chief Steve McPherson acknowledged his love for the show but also said chances are slim it would land on his network next fall.
"I don't really foresee" a situation in which ABC picks up the Emmy-winning series, which is likely on its last legs at FOX. Earlier in the week, FOX head Peter Ligouri acknowledged it was "highly unlikely" that he'd pick it up for a fourth season, although the network has yet to cancel it outright.
"I just love that show. I believe I can market that show really well," McPherson says. That said, he considers it "a long shot" that "Arrested" will wind up on ABC in the fall.
That would apparently leave Showtime as the show's last, best hope for new life. Thursday, Showtime's Robert Greenblatt said the pay-cable network and "Arrested" producer 20th Century Fox TV have been discussing a deal for the show. He also said he would only want the series if creator Mitch Hurwitz remains in charge, and Hurwitz hasn't made that decision yet.
By Rick Porter Saturday, January 21, 2006 11:29 AM PT
And now, the last "Arrested Development" story from the Television Critics Association midseason press tour.
Speaking to reporters Saturday (Jan. 21) at the Television Critics Association press tour, ABC Entertainment chief Steve McPherson acknowledged his love for the show but also said chances are slim it would land on his network next fall.
"I don't really foresee" a situation in which ABC picks up the Emmy-winning series, which is likely on its last legs at FOX. Earlier in the week, FOX head Peter Ligouri acknowledged it was "highly unlikely" that he'd pick it up for a fourth season, although the network has yet to cancel it outright.
"I just love that show. I believe I can market that show really well," McPherson says. That said, he considers it "a long shot" that "Arrested" will wind up on ABC in the fall.
That would apparently leave Showtime as the show's last, best hope for new life. Thursday, Showtime's Robert Greenblatt said the pay-cable network and "Arrested" producer 20th Century Fox TV have been discussing a deal for the show. He also said he would only want the series if creator Mitch Hurwitz remains in charge, and Hurwitz hasn't made that decision yet.
#198
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From: City of the lakers.. riots.. and drug dealing cops.. los(t) Angel(e)s. ca.
Originally Posted by Nosebleed
He does have a point. It's just tiring to see a lengthy defence of its actions whenever someone makes a negative comment about Fox.
Is it just as tiring as seeing lengthy amounts of people calling me a shill? How about how tiring it is to see most post composed of "FUCK FOX!" or "FOX SUCKS!" without anything more. I try to toss a bit more thought into it.
When Fox does something stupid or that I disagree with I point it out. As quoted already, I have no love and don't justify the networks task on shows like Futurama, Firefly and other series that were canceled for no other reason than Fox didn't try or didn't care. I can see why some things are canceled and I speak as someone who has a good amount of knowledge of the behind the scenes actions and why they are taken in such a fashion.
I think that while it may sound like a shill, I do make a valid point on the majority of "defense" that I provide for the Network, Studio and any other aspect. Hell, take a look at my comments about Fox News. I really am Fair and Balanced when it comes to my comments about Fox.
It's just that in this case, I feel strongly that the network did just about everything they could to get an audience and came up short on all accounts. The public was just not making the show turn a profit and that really makes it suffer. Hey, it pains me to say it since I love the show. It's my bread and butter.
But hey, since you asked. I do lighting and other "below the line" work at the studio lot. I haven't seen a paycheck for "defending the company name on message boards" though.
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Originally Posted by Groucho
According to an LA Times article, Showtime will pick up the show only if Mitch Hurwitz stays on board:
Link to article
Link to article



