Buffy 5-20-03 "The Chosen"
05-22-03, 01:27 PM
#101
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I will add one last thing about Anya's death. If you look at how the series has played, her death was very much in the vein of the way other long term characters die. Buffy's Mom, Ms. Calendar, and Tara are all great examples. One thing I have to give credit to Whedon for is portraying the fact that once someone dies, they are nothing more than a body. (as was addressed in the episode of the same name) Whedon has a tendency to really build characters and then kill them when they really start to sink in, thus giving their death more impact. This is not just true of Buffy, but Angel as well , like Doyle in the first season.
05-22-03, 02:47 PM
#102
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Originally posted by slaughter22
1. Xander not showing more grief toward Anya's death.
1. Xander not showing more grief toward Anya's death.
05-22-03, 02:53 PM
#103
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Why stop at Anya? The entire town of Sunnydale had just been wiped out, and yet they all reacted like they had just seen a minor fender bender. I'm chalking it up to not getting caught up in everything that just happened and just ending the series.
05-22-03, 03:41 PM
#104
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The whole town of Sunnydale left! Remember the previous episode that showed Buffy talking with Clem, who was in a car on his way out of town, along with everyone else? There should not have been too many casualties on that front.
05-23-03, 01:08 AM
#106
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Originally posted by Arcade
Why in the hell did Buffy and the slayerettes have to go down in the hellmouth before willow cast the spell!!!
Why not just do the spell first and see if it worked.
If there is somthing I missed explaining this, please let me know.
Why in the hell did Buffy and the slayerettes have to go down in the hellmouth before willow cast the spell!!!
Why not just do the spell first and see if it worked.
If there is somthing I missed explaining this, please let me know.
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
05-23-03, 02:35 AM
#107
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Too late - I already asked myself that question about how the "flimsy little cage in the library" was able to hold werewolves and vampires several years ago. 
Of course, I came to the conclusion that asking quesitons like that in regards to BTVS was counterproductive and basically only amounted to nit-picking.
I'm really gonna miss this show....
Of course, I came to the conclusion that asking quesitons like that in regards to BTVS was counterproductive and basically only amounted to nit-picking.
I'm really gonna miss this show....
Last edited by B5Erik; 05-23-03 at 02:38 AM.
05-23-03, 06:29 AM
#108
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I really enjoyed the final episode and for some reason it's nice to see that most of you did too. 
Andrew really made the show for me this season, he was sooo funny!
The one thing I really wanted and didn't get was a moment between Buffy and Giles where she told him something cheesy like how he was the father she never had. I just think it would have been a powerful scene. I know they've come close a couple of times but they always just drop it when it's getting good. Kind of like when Spike and Buffy we're expressing how they felt about one another.
Didn't care for the multiple slayers thing. Would have been better if Buffy's power were dilluted equally amongst all the girls instead of them becoming full-fledged slayers and I really didn't like the fact that there were so many potentials to begin with. Makes it seem less special.
All the while I kept having Seinfeld flashbacks.
I fully expected to be let down and while this season certainly could have been better, the last 15 seconds made it all worth it.
Andrew really made the show for me this season, he was sooo funny!The one thing I really wanted and didn't get was a moment between Buffy and Giles where she told him something cheesy like how he was the father she never had. I just think it would have been a powerful scene. I know they've come close a couple of times but they always just drop it when it's getting good. Kind of like when Spike and Buffy we're expressing how they felt about one another.
Didn't care for the multiple slayers thing. Would have been better if Buffy's power were dilluted equally amongst all the girls instead of them becoming full-fledged slayers and I really didn't like the fact that there were so many potentials to begin with. Makes it seem less special.
All the while I kept having Seinfeld flashbacks.
I fully expected to be let down and while this season certainly could have been better, the last 15 seconds made it all worth it.
05-23-03, 08:03 AM
#109
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I'm sorry guys, but I thought the last BUFFY was a horrible episode. If you re-watch it, you'll see that it's little more than one-liners and action. It has no depth whatsoever.
But that doesn't mean I think any less of the show. Lets face it, not too many series have great last episodes. In fact, only THE NEXT GENERATION and CHEERS really delivered "great" final shows. Great shows like SEINFELD, X-FILES, MASH, QUANTUM LEAP and others, all ended with less-than-thrilling finales.
But that doesn't mean I think any less of the show. Lets face it, not too many series have great last episodes. In fact, only THE NEXT GENERATION and CHEERS really delivered "great" final shows. Great shows like SEINFELD, X-FILES, MASH, QUANTUM LEAP and others, all ended with less-than-thrilling finales.
05-23-03, 09:01 AM
#110
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Originally posted by Josh-da-man
It's best not to try to apply too much logic to BTVS.
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
It's best not to try to apply too much logic to BTVS.
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
05-23-03, 09:43 AM
#111
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Originally posted by Josh-da-man
It's best not to try to apply too much logic to BTVS.
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
It's best not to try to apply too much logic to BTVS.
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
Correct. I just thought maybe something was mentioned about why they did not just cast the spell first and I missed it.
The show is so full of holes that you really just have to shrug it off and enjoy it for what it is. The best damn escapist television around.
05-23-03, 09:44 AM
#112
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Originally posted by Spooky
[B]I'm sorry guys, but I thought the last BUFFY was a horrible episode. If you re-watch it, you'll see that it's little more than one-liners and action. It has no depth whatsoever.
[B]I'm sorry guys, but I thought the last BUFFY was a horrible episode. If you re-watch it, you'll see that it's little more than one-liners and action. It has no depth whatsoever.
05-23-03, 02:15 PM
#114
DVD Talk Legend
Originally posted by Josh-da-man
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
Otherwise, you might start asking yourself questions like how that flimsy little cage in the library was able to securely hold vampires and werewolves.
Yeah, that's it. Do I get a No-Prize?
05-24-03, 01:35 AM
#115
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I'm trying to refrain but I can't help myself.
Anyone sick of reading about anya, skip to the next post.
You make a good point. I'm starting to warm up.
But I think Jenny Calendar's death was handled much much better than Anya's (don't know about the others). The abruptness felt like it came out of necessity - it crystallized the characterization of the killer, it stayed true to the emotional core of the series, and it played a crucial role in the season.
What was the necessity of the way Anya died?
Storytelling efficiency, perhaps? (Andrew was beside her, falling all over himself, just waiting to be saved. We all know he's a bumbling weakling, why include all that if there's not going to a payoff?)
Or maybe it was simply a whim on Joss Whedon's part? (If so, then heck, he created the show, he can do whatever the hell he wants. Plus he's proven himself to be a freakin genius.)
I just feel like Anya deserved her hero's moment. If there were more casualties in the core gang, then I'd understand not giving it to her - her death would've been less important. But there were only TWO casualties. Spike got his moment. Why not Anya?
Weird thing is, I'm not even a big fan of this character.
Anyone sick of reading about anya, skip to the next post.
Originally posted by Dr. DVD
I will add one last thing about Anya's death. If you look at how the series has played, her death was very much in the vein of the way other long term characters die. Buffy's Mom, Ms. Calendar, and Tara are all great examples. One thing I have to give credit to Whedon for is portraying the fact that once someone dies, they are nothing more than a body. (as was addressed in the episode of the same name) Whedon has a tendency to really build characters and then kill them when they really start to sink in, thus giving their death more impact. This is not just true of Buffy, but Angel as well , like Doyle in the first season.
I will add one last thing about Anya's death. If you look at how the series has played, her death was very much in the vein of the way other long term characters die. Buffy's Mom, Ms. Calendar, and Tara are all great examples. One thing I have to give credit to Whedon for is portraying the fact that once someone dies, they are nothing more than a body. (as was addressed in the episode of the same name) Whedon has a tendency to really build characters and then kill them when they really start to sink in, thus giving their death more impact. This is not just true of Buffy, but Angel as well , like Doyle in the first season.
But I think Jenny Calendar's death was handled much much better than Anya's (don't know about the others). The abruptness felt like it came out of necessity - it crystallized the characterization of the killer, it stayed true to the emotional core of the series, and it played a crucial role in the season.
What was the necessity of the way Anya died?
Storytelling efficiency, perhaps? (Andrew was beside her, falling all over himself, just waiting to be saved. We all know he's a bumbling weakling, why include all that if there's not going to a payoff?)
Or maybe it was simply a whim on Joss Whedon's part? (If so, then heck, he created the show, he can do whatever the hell he wants. Plus he's proven himself to be a freakin genius.)
I just feel like Anya deserved her hero's moment. If there were more casualties in the core gang, then I'd understand not giving it to her - her death would've been less important. But there were only TWO casualties. Spike got his moment. Why not Anya?
Weird thing is, I'm not even a big fan of this character.
05-24-03, 03:18 AM
#116
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Originally posted by minguy
What was the necessity of the way Anya died?
Storytelling efficiency, perhaps? (Andrew was beside her, falling all over himself, just waiting to be saved. We all know he's a bumbling weakling, why include all that if there's not going to a payoff?)
Or maybe it was simply a whim on Joss Whedon's part? (If so, then heck, he created the show, he can do whatever the hell he wants. Plus he's proven himself to be a freakin genius.)
I just feel like Anya deserved her hero's moment. If there were more casualties in the core gang, then I'd understand not giving it to her - her death would've been less important. But there were only TWO casualties. Spike got his moment. Why not Anya?
Weird thing is, I'm not even a big fan of this character.
What was the necessity of the way Anya died?
Storytelling efficiency, perhaps? (Andrew was beside her, falling all over himself, just waiting to be saved. We all know he's a bumbling weakling, why include all that if there's not going to a payoff?)
Or maybe it was simply a whim on Joss Whedon's part? (If so, then heck, he created the show, he can do whatever the hell he wants. Plus he's proven himself to be a freakin genius.)
I just feel like Anya deserved her hero's moment. If there were more casualties in the core gang, then I'd understand not giving it to her - her death would've been less important. But there were only TWO casualties. Spike got his moment. Why not Anya?
Weird thing is, I'm not even a big fan of this character.
TVGO: Why was Anya marked for death?
Whedon: I wanted to kill somebody, and I wanted to do it brutally and suddenly and never really pay it off. I wanted a death that was a real middle-of-the-battle death — the opposite of the Spike death, [which was] perfect, noble. And Emma had made it clear that she really was not interested in coming back. I think things with Fox weren't great and she felt ill-used — not by the show. She had a good time making the show, I think. But she was ready to move on. But it was tough [killing her off]. The last shot before we wrapped her was that shot where she gets sliced. And it's very weird to play your death and go, "Okay, I'm done."
TVGO: No one seemed to be too broken up about it.
Whedon: I had a lot to wrap up, so I let Xander (Nicholas Brendon) have a moment of closure about her, just enough to get him to the point where he could rejoin the group for a moment of, well, "We won." You have to get yourself to a good place if you want the show to go out on an uplifting moment, which I did. So I used shorthand.
Whedon: I wanted to kill somebody, and I wanted to do it brutally and suddenly and never really pay it off. I wanted a death that was a real middle-of-the-battle death — the opposite of the Spike death, [which was] perfect, noble. And Emma had made it clear that she really was not interested in coming back. I think things with Fox weren't great and she felt ill-used — not by the show. She had a good time making the show, I think. But she was ready to move on. But it was tough [killing her off]. The last shot before we wrapped her was that shot where she gets sliced. And it's very weird to play your death and go, "Okay, I'm done."
TVGO: No one seemed to be too broken up about it.
Whedon: I had a lot to wrap up, so I let Xander (Nicholas Brendon) have a moment of closure about her, just enough to get him to the point where he could rejoin the group for a moment of, well, "We won." You have to get yourself to a good place if you want the show to go out on an uplifting moment, which I did. So I used shorthand.
05-24-03, 04:44 PM
#118
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I enjoyed the finale, but like the last two seasons it suffered from a lack of focus in the plotting and uncompelling new characters. Wood and Kennedy added nothing, in fact, they mostly got in the way of interesting interaction between the main cast. I do have to eat my words about Andrew, he was a breath of fresh air. I am not sorry I watched season six and seven, but will only buy season four and five on DVD. I already own seasons 1-3.
I think this lets the writers off way too easy. Good fantasy should have consistent (not necessarily logical) rules and these rules should be obeyed by the writers. These last two seasons have an escalation of not only changing the rules but ignoring them. Maybe I am alone in this but that's how I feel. The practice interfered with my enjoyment of the show. Magic has been the culprit more often than not. The writers made Magic almost omnipotent and worse free. Willow payed no price for her deeds last year, beyond emotional pain, and all the Slayer potentials were given their powers at no cost to anyone or anything. This is too Deus ex Machina for a show which in the beginning made everyone earn their growth with blood, sweat, and tears.
It's best not to try to apply too much logic to BTVS.
05-25-03, 07:50 AM
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Overall, I enjoyed the finale and thought that it brought the series to a mostly fitting conclusion (without it being the end of the whole story). The imbuement of the other Potentials was just a clever enough mix of hokiness and girl power to work.
I was both disappointed and saddened by Anya’s death, as she’s become my favorite character as of late, but I won’t argue with the way Whedon pulled it off, which I felt was appropriate to the Buffyverse. Her quick and realistic end without fanfare was reminiscent of Tasha Yar’s demise on Star Trek: The Next Generation.
However, I was deeply upset by Xander’s throwaway reaction. It was too much like the Seinfeld episode with George’s quick dismissal of his fiancée’s death. Larry David also repeated this tiresome (and painfully unfunny) gag in Curb Your Enthusiasm with the death of his character’s mother.
I was both disappointed and saddened by Anya’s death, as she’s become my favorite character as of late, but I won’t argue with the way Whedon pulled it off, which I felt was appropriate to the Buffyverse. Her quick and realistic end without fanfare was reminiscent of Tasha Yar’s demise on Star Trek: The Next Generation.
However, I was deeply upset by Xander’s throwaway reaction. It was too much like the Seinfeld episode with George’s quick dismissal of his fiancée’s death. Larry David also repeated this tiresome (and painfully unfunny) gag in Curb Your Enthusiasm with the death of his character’s mother.
05-25-03, 04:10 PM
#121
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Holy crap ...
OK, so anyone who posts here with any regularity knows that I'm quite sensitive to spoilers, so much in fact that I avoided all related threads, all UPN shows of any kind in the months leading up to the finale, and even downloaded the wildfeeds to avoid any remnant of UPN ads.
So today I'm catching up on a couple month's worth of Enterprise eps (God knows why), and I run across a preview for the finale. My God, that's a lot of spoilers. I don't know how others put up with it.
das
OK, so anyone who posts here with any regularity knows that I'm quite sensitive to spoilers, so much in fact that I avoided all related threads, all UPN shows of any kind in the months leading up to the finale, and even downloaded the wildfeeds to avoid any remnant of UPN ads.
So today I'm catching up on a couple month's worth of Enterprise eps (God knows why), and I run across a preview for the finale. My God, that's a lot of spoilers. I don't know how others put up with it.
das
05-25-03, 06:42 PM
#122
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Originally posted by das Monkey
So today I'm catching up on a couple month's worth of Enterprise eps (God knows why),...
So today I'm catching up on a couple month's worth of Enterprise eps (God knows why),...
05-25-03, 06:44 PM
#123
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• Quoth Rogue588 •<HR SIZE=1>Not enough pain & suffering in your life...? <HR SIZE=1>
You'd be surprised.
Perhaps I should expand my avoidance of spoilers to include an avoidance of crappy TV shows ... naaaahhh ...das
06-02-03, 02:41 PM
#125
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Originally posted by minguy
But she was MORTAL for only 5 years.
But she was MORTAL for only 5 years.