I don’t want to on another thread, so I thought I’d post it here.

Does the idea of receiving HDTV broadcasts thru rabbit ears (possibly with aluminum foil on the antennae to enhance reception) sound really, really funny?

Let me try to explain this all:

DTV has 3 Satillites in the Air:

Sat {B} 119° Sat[C] 110° Sat[A]

From Left to Right this is the diff satellite each "arm" or Lnb on your dish will pick up

I think Sat C was put up 1-2 yrs ago (Don't quote me on that) Thus increasing their overall bandwidth by 50% (After satellites 3 (-) Before Satellites 2 = 1 (divided) by Before Satellites 2 = 0.5 or 50%) But I think DTV is most concerned with Sat A. Most people have single oval LNB dishes (I was one of them up until 1 month ago) and use that Sat to get locals and "cable" type channels espn, hbo, showtime etc.. I had no reason to upgrade. I don't think most people will upgrade until they get a HDTV.

Note: DTV calls International and HDTV "Specialty" programming and I think they feel that if you want this programming that the consumer should incur the cost of upgrade. ($100 for dish - and be handy enough to install and setup dish or else extra $100 for pro to do it). Specialty programs are on SAT B and C

If I wanted Spanish TV I would have had to buy an elliptical dish with 2lnbs (this would get Sat B&A - See above). If I want all HD channels I have to buy a 3lnb (the middle or Sat C).

Therefore, I have to assume that if DTV wanted to add Lifetime Channel 2 for example they would have to either drop a current channel on SAT A - or do what they do now -- Compress a "non-core" channel to fit the new channel into their bandwidth. I don't see them saying to their customers "We have more channels but you need to upgrade your equipment" however they will say "if you want specialty channels you need to upgrade"

The cable companies would jump all over this and use it to market their digital cable - "We don't make you upgrade equipment to get additional channels ex. Lifetime 2"

Currently there is no HD on Sat A (that is what the CSR told me) so Unless DTV is willing to tell their customers to upgrade to get more "cable" channels, SAT B and SAT C should be reserved for "Specialty" programs.

I'm banking that those Specialty programs are going to be HDTV - I'm hoping that they are not reserved for tons of international programming.

Now here are the Channels available if you have an eliptical dish with 3lnbs:

Total of 4 HD channels: HBO, Showtime, HD NET, Pay-per-View

And all of these:

199,HD,HD NET,HDTV,119° Satellite
374,BYU,BYU,119° satellite
376,NASA,NASA,119° satellite
379,DTV,DTV,119° satellite
403,UNIV,Univisión Oeste,119° Satellite
405,TELE,Telemundo East,119° Satellite
406,TELW,Telemundo West,119° Satellite
407,TVE,TVE Internacional América,119° Satellite
408,TVC,TV Chile,119° Satellite
409,UTIL,Utilísima Satelital,119° Satellite
410,MUN2,Mun 2,119° Satellite
411,TLFI,Telefe Internacional,119° Satellite
413,DSCE,Discovery Español,119° Satellite
416,MTVS,MTV Latino,119° Satellite
417,PUMA,Puma TV,119° Satellite
418,TELI,Telemundo Internacional,119° Satellite
419,CNNE,CNN en Español,119° Satellite
420,SUR,TV Sur,119° Satellite
421,TWCL,The Weather Channel Latin America,119° Satellite
422,EWTN,EWTN Latin America,119° Satellite
423,LAT,Cine Latino,119° Satellite
425,FSWS,Fox Sports World Español,119° Satellite
426,ESPND,ESPN Deportes,119° Satellite
432,FEPPV,Fútbol de España PPV,119° Satellite
438,CLAR,Claravision,119° Satellite
439,ILFE,The Inspirational Life Network,119° Satellite
450,JADE,JADE,110° Satellite
451,JADW,JADW,110° Satellite
452,TVBS,TVBS,110° Satellite
453,CMOV,CMOV,110° Satellite
454,CTV4,CTV4,110° Satellite
509,HBOH,HBOH,HDTV
543,SHOH,SHOH,110° Satellite,HDTV
845,MC,Music Choice Folklórica,119° Satellite
846,MC,Music Choice Boleros,119° Satellite
847,MC,Music Choice Música Latina,119° Satellite
848,MC,Music Choice Canciones de Amor Internacional,119° Satellite
849,MC,Music Choice Tropical,119° Satellite
850,MC,Music Choice Mexicana,119° Satellite
851,MC,Music Choice Tejano,119° Satellite


If you look on fleabay you will see sellers who offer first time subscribers a substantial discount or a "package" on DTV HD boxes, install and dishes.

To me it's worth it. I just sit back and watch the revolution unfold in front of me. I wish DTV would pick up local channels in HD then I would have no gripes..

It just seems ironic that we have to put rabit ears or antenna's back on our houses to get OTA signals. I can't get OTA signals - and I would guess most other people can't either..

Isn't that why we all switched to cable in the first place?

I think cable and DTV will carry HD locals - the question is when??

Comcast is now offering HDTV in some areas. I am in the Boston area and it was rolled out a little over a month ago. They offer local ABC, NBC, a national all HD PBS feed, HBOHD, and SHOHD. I have read they are in negotiations to add HDNET, ESPNHD, and Discovery HD.

Now THAT'S what I'm talkin' 'bout!

Directv CANNOT carry HD locals. A single HD channel takes up as much bandwidth as 6 regular channels, and their ain't enough satellite slots in the sky to contain 6 times the number of birds we have now.

Each transponder on a Directv satellite carries 10 - 12 SD channels, and these same transponders can only carry 2 HD channels. The entire 3-slot system is already full to bursting, carrying 130+ core channels, RSN's, PPV, Para Todos, NFL/MLB/NHL/NBA and locals for 50+ cities (over 400 channels using spot beams). Another satellite is going up at the 119 slot later this year to carry 30+ cites locals and add some more HD capacity.

The only HD locals that might be added would be the NY/LA channels, but under the SHVIA they would be as unavailable to 95% of subscribers as the current NY/LA channels are. Congress would have to re-write the current law to allow everyone access to these channels, but the NAB will make damn sure that never happens.

Bandwidth is at a real premium. Directv will add more HD channels as long as they can make money on them, and there's NO money in adding HD locals. If those are important, buy a good quality OTA antenna and hope for the best.

I may be off track but isn't the qualifer for receiving the national locals from DTV that you can not receive an acceptable OTA signal for a local where you live?

Wouldn't that mean that if you cannot receive adequate HD signals OTA where you live that you would qualify for a national HD NY/LA package?

I would think that would significantly increase that 5% you were referring to ( of which I am currently one BTW).

so wait i am a little lost.

When you see on the "local channels" broadcast in HDTV does that mean if you have like the Hughes E86 reciever on Sat. does that mean you get the broadcast in hd?

It would appear the answer to that would be “no.”

Thank you very much. I’ll be here all week. Don’t forget to tip your server.

I get local HDTV well at least NBC with Rabit ears and the HBO and HDNET from DirecTV.

Could anyone recommend a good indoor antenna to get HD signals? I live in an apartment so I cant stick a huge rod from our space.

No. The qualifier for receiving the distant nets is the ability to not receive a "Grade B" signal at the address given. A Grade B signal is checked using an antenna on a 14' pole placed in the middle of the road in front of the residence. No, I'm not kidding.

Directv uses an address database which checks addresses against contour maps (supplied by the NAB I think). If your address falls inside the Grade B circle on the map, then no NY/LA channels for you. You can appeal this decision to the local broadcaster(s), but good luck with that.

Dish Network currently carries CBSHD NY & LA feeds. They are available only to subscribers who -
(A) live in a city where the local CBS affiliate is owned & operated (O&O) by CBS itself (17 cities - Austin, Baltimore, Boston, Chicago, Dallas, Denver, Detroit, Los Angeles, Marquette, Miami, Minneapolis, New York, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Salt Lake City, San Francisco, and Green Bay)
-OR-
(B) your local CBS affiliate grants you a waiver to receive it. Waivers are granted under the same set of rules as SD OTA channels.

If Directv carried all the networks' NY/LA HD channels under these same guidelines, only subs in cities where EACH network O&O their affiliate would benefit, and many of those wouldn't get all the networks. I doubt all the major networks own their stations in Green Bay, for example, so Green Bay subs might get only CBSHD, or Pittsburgh subs may only get NBCHD, etc. It could nudge that 5% percent up a little, but not much.

BTW, I also get all 8 NY/LA channels (cool, aint they ? ) plus my own locals. I got the distants during the old PT24 days ('96) and educated myself on this stuff out of necessity in order to keep them. I may be the only Directv sub who EVER got a waiver from our local NBC station, and I got it in writing no less

The NY/LA Networks are definitely cool. I watch those instead of my locals almost always. I like the time shifting you can do if you missed something too.

I have waivers in writing from the early days too and one of them is CBS. It sounds like that would qualify me for the Dish Network CBS HD but I can't see buying a receiver just for that.

The NY/LA Networks are definitely cool. I watch those instead of my locals almost always. I like the time shifting you can do if you missed something too.

I have waivers in writing from the early days too and one of them is CBS. It sounds like that would qualify me for the Dish Network CBS HD but I can't see buying a receiver just for that.