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New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

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New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Old 01-31-19, 04:34 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
I hope they do. I hope they go even more Left than they are now

Kamala proved how popular her opinions are...even within Democrats.

I pretty much thought Trump couldn't possibly win a second term. But shit, you just made a possibility for him to scoop that candidacy up again.
Running a milquetoast John Kerry type centrist will have the Dems slaughtered. Pushing left, campaigning on single payer, making working class concerns the focus of the campaign, is the only route to victory for the Dems. The more to the middle they go, the more like Republican-lites they look.
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Old 01-31-19, 04:34 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Ghostbuster View Post
Yep. Someone said that if Schultz were a Starbucks drink, he would be a Flat White.
What's a Hillary Clinton Starbucks drink, then.
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Old 01-31-19, 04:38 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post


Running a milquetoast John Kerry type centrist will have the Dems slaughtered. Pushing left, campaigning on single payer, making working class concerns the focus of the campaign, is the only route to victory for the Dems. The more to the middle they go, the more like Republican-lites they look.

You don't have to be "middle" to be a Republican. I'm not sure where this idea came from, but it's seriously wrong and dangerous.

I think some perceive winning as no-capitulation to the other party's issues to get your own, etc. If you don't negotiate with the other half of the country...you'll end up like Trump and few of your own issues and policies passing. If that's what Dems really want...doesn't seem like much of an accomplishment for this nation. I thought Dems were supposed to be better than their competition. Better meaning, getting everyone involved, not just a portion of their own party.

Instead of building walls, the Dems will be constructing special internment camps for those who don't go along with their policies, all in the name of being anti-government, pro-Russia, and committing crimes against the socialist state.

Pretty sure we have enough history to demonstrate it's a bad idea, but who knows, I could be wrong I guess.
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Old 01-31-19, 04:56 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
I hope they do. I hope they go even more Left than they are now, come to think of it.

Kamala proved how popular her opinions are...even within Democrats. Yeah, you people go with that ideology...to go more extreme. Knock, yourselves, out.

I pretty much thought Trump couldn't possibly win a second term. But shit, you just made a possibility for him to scoop that candidacy up again.
You really, honest feel its “extreme” for everyone to have healthcare? Cause thats pretty much as extreme as we are talking about and don’t think that “extreme” at all. I’m honestly surprised anyone would oppose such “ideology”. Especially conservatives who, in general loath entitlements and “free-loaders”. Unless of course your rich, then of course THEY deserve entitlements.
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Old 01-31-19, 04:58 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
You don't have to be "middle" to be a Republican. I'm not sure where this idea came from, but it's seriously wrong and dangerous.

I think some perceive winning as no-capitulation to the other party's issues to get your own, etc. If you don't negotiate with the other half of the country...you'll end up like Trump and few of your own issues and policies passing. If that's what Dems really want...doesn't seem like much of an accomplishment for this nation. I thought Dems were supposed to be better than their competition. Better meaning, getting everyone involved, not just a portion of their own party.

Instead of building walls, the Dems will be constructing special internment camps for those who don't go along with their policies, all in the name of being anti-government, pro-Russia, and committing crimes against the socialist state.

Pretty sure we have enough history to demonstrate it's a bad idea, but who knows, I could be wrong I guess.
What are you even talking about? I don’t know why I bother.
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Old 01-31-19, 05:11 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
Running a milquetoast John Kerry type centrist will have the Dems slaughtered. Pushing left, campaigning on single payer, making working class concerns the focus of the campaign, is the only route to victory for the Dems. The more to the middle they go, the more like Republican-lites they look.
Single payer is a tremendous talking point. The issue will be a comprehensive plan. The talking point may take the nomination but a plan will be needed to solidify the election. Sanders admitted in his debate with Clinton that it would raise taxes on the middle class. The question that needs to be answered is how much? If you can show that your taxes will go up $1000 but you'll save $1000 on insurance payments they are golden. If they go the Cortez route of "just pay for it", it will be hard for the outer circle to believe.

Sanders had some fantastic crowd pleasing talking points. I loved the guy. But unfortunately his tax the wealthy plan only paid for a tiny fraction of all the money he wanted to spend. There is still plenty of time, but if Venezuela is in tatters, or another socialist stronghold is in disarray, a socialist type candidate will have more trouble this time around.

I'm still banking on Joe Biden. I think he can talk border security without spending 6 billion. I think he can appeal to everyone but the far right. He can play the family sympathy card. He has no scandals. He has the experience. His biggest detriment is he's another old white guy. Will he motivate younger, minority and urban voters to the polls better than Hillary?
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Old 01-31-19, 05:24 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

I don’t disagree we need more than “we should have a single payer system”. But I don’t know how much more we really need. Now I haven’t seen all of AOC’s quotes on the topic, but I haven’t heard the one “just pay for it”. I have heard her say “we don’t ask how we are going to pay for X, we just do it” (maybe her quote was “we don’t ask how we pay for X, we just pay for it” and thats what your saying, but left off the first part). And she is right. And it is a valid point. Having said that, again, I think having some detail would be helpful. As you say, if people can see yes taxes go up, but you no longer have to pay premiums that is nice. But it goes beyond that. Remember pre-ACA people were going without insurance, no its not JUST a cost isssue. It’s no longer dealing with a for profit insurance company, its easy of filing (if any filing is needed at all by the individual), its no longer needing to deal with this network or in-network, or maybe-network, its no longer feeling stuck at your job because they pay a chunk of your insurance as a benefit, etc, etc....
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Old 01-31-19, 05:58 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Also if you are going to gut an entire industry and put about a half million people out of work, you should have a plan for them as well. I didn't care for Obama calling the industry the "greedy insurance companies" Yes, there are many things they did we didn't agree with. But by and large the majority of the people that work there are middle class working folks. Not greedy fat cats. The primaries are no place for such detail. But before I were to back a candidate with that platform, I would want answers to those questions. By the time they whittled down to the top three, there should be more than just broad goals.
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Old 01-31-19, 06:07 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

DVDP is just afraid his imaginary millions are going to get taxed more. Leave him alone guys. If he just works a little harder I'm sure one day he'll be in that $10mil tax bracket. Just pull yourself up by your bootstraps, buddy!
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Old 01-31-19, 06:59 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

The forecast for 2020 and Republicans and this is why I don't think Trump is going to win or will be severely hindered within his own party:

1) Abortion is once again going to be one of the major issues (Liberals are killing babies!)

2) We need to deploy our troops worldwide and Trump was wrong, the terrorists are coming!

Democrats will be just the opposite of the extreme spectrum, selling their Armageddon bullshit.

​​​​​​​What a great time we're going to have in 2020.
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Old 01-31-19, 07:00 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post


What are you even talking about? I don’t know why I bother.
Deep down...you know I'm right.
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Old 01-31-19, 07:15 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by JimRochester View Post
Single payer is a tremendous talking point. The issue will be a comprehensive plan. The talking point may take the nomination but a plan will be needed to solidify the election. Sanders admitted in his debate with Clinton that it would raise taxes on the middle class. The question that needs to be answered is how much? If you can show that your taxes will go up $1000 but you'll save $1000 on insurance payments they are golden. If they go the Cortez route of "just pay for it", it will be hard for the outer circle to believe.

Sanders had some fantastic crowd pleasing talking points. I loved the guy. But unfortunately his tax the wealthy plan only paid for a tiny fraction of all the money he wanted to spend. There is still plenty of time, but if Venezuela is in tatters, or another socialist stronghold is in disarray, a socialist type candidate will have more trouble this time around.

I'm still banking on Joe Biden. I think he can talk border security without spending 6 billion. I think he can appeal to everyone but the far right. He can play the family sympathy card. He has no scandals. He has the experience. His biggest detriment is he's another old white guy. Will he motivate younger, minority and urban voters to the polls better than Hillary?
The answer is so obvious, slash the obscene military budget. That’s a budget that never goes down, only up. Or maybe a combined slash to the Pentagon, CIA, and FBI so no one area takes too big of a hit. When it comes to killing people we seem to have an unlimited budget, so let’s start redirecting that to saving people instead.
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Old 01-31-19, 07:21 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post


The answer is so obvious, slash the obscene military budget. That’s a budget that never goes down, only up. Or maybe a combined slash to the Pentagon, CIA, and FBI so no one area takes too big of a hit. When it comes to killing people we seem to have an unlimited budget, so let’s start redirecting that to saving people instead.
This, I will agree 100% with you. Was reading not too long ago that half the US Military budget goes to programs that don't work (a small majority goes to actual military employees). Contractors who just make shit and don't follow-through and the US doesn't recoup the money or take them to court. They just let them have the cash and move on to the next year's budget.
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Old 01-31-19, 08:05 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by JimRochester View Post
Also if you are going to gut an entire industry and put about a half million people out of work, you should have a plan for them as well. I didn't care for Obama calling the industry the "greedy insurance companies" Yes, there are many things they did we didn't agree with. But by and large the majority of the people that work there are middle class working folks. Not greedy fat cats. The primaries are no place for such detail. But before I were to back a candidate with that platform, I would want answers to those questions. By the time they whittled down to the top three, there should be more than just broad goals.
Well it of course depends on the system. Some of the Dems are supporting Medicare for all. That is vastly different than Single Payer. Many seniors eligible for Medicare buy health insurance. They buy “supplemental” insurance. The base Medicare that seniors automatically get is basically a “hospital only” plan. No Dr’s visits, No perscriiption drugs, no nothing else. Basically if your not checked into the hospital it’s not covered. And even then, it is limited. To get a “comprehensive” plan including prescription drugs, seniors buy a supplemental health policy from a private company. Yes, it is subsidized. But there is a huge industry just for that.

If we do that health insurance companies won’t go anywhere. They will just shift. And that might be a good “next step” before Single Payer:

As for “greedy” your comment would apply to any company. Is Apple greedy? Are the workers at Apple
greedy? Remember the basics of stock companies. Their goal is to increase stock value. I’m not saying that’s bad when making TV’s or iPhones or widgets. But on peoples lives? And I mean that as a true question.

Let me say this. It is my strong feeling the health insurance companies could solve this issue. The problem is there is no insentive to do so. And they have shown zero interest in doing so. Hospitals and health care professions could solve this issue. But again, what is the incentive?

Last edited by Sdallnct; 01-31-19 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 01-31-19, 08:47 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition



Jimmy Carter Concerned Desire For Fresh Faces In Democratic Party May Hurt His Chances In 2020

https://politics.theonion.com/jimmy-...ocr-1832200632
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Old 01-31-19, 11:16 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Sean Bagniewski, the Polk County (Iowa) Democrats chair just posted on Facebook that he got a call from a “big” presidential candidate who will be declaring tomorrow.
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Old 01-31-19, 11:23 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Tom Hanks?
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Old 01-31-19, 11:39 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by majorjoe23 View Post
Sean Bagniewski, the Polk County (Iowa) Democrats chair just posted on Facebook that he got a call from a “big” presidential candidate who will be declaring tomorrow.

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Old 02-01-19, 12:44 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

"Big" is fine. We just don't want the "bigly" candidate.
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Old 02-01-19, 04:17 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by majorjoe23 View Post
Sean Bagniewski, the Polk County (Iowa) Democrats chair just posted on Facebook that he got a call from a “big” presidential candidate who will be declaring tomorrow.
Bill Brasky?
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Old 02-01-19, 05:35 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post


The answer is so obvious, slash the obscene military budget. That’s a budget that never goes down, only up. Or maybe a combined slash to the Pentagon, CIA, and FBI so no one area takes too big of a hit. When it comes to killing people we seem to have an unlimited budget, so let’s start redirecting that to saving people instead.
I don't think that the Democratic candidate will need to go into too much detail. Without completely focusing on the Republicans in their response, they certainly could paint a picture with broad strokes of how it will be paid for.

When pressed to offer greater details, they could point to (A) it was the Democrats who worked to get the ACA, the Republicans were against it and campaigned for 8 years that they would repeal it. (B) When they had the opportunity to do just that, they had no plan.

Assuming Trump is running for re-election, Healthcare is the Democrats issues. No need to wring hands over getting into the weeds of the details. There are hours of rally footage of Trump from 2016 talking about the "big, beautiful healthcare plan his experts have created".
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Old 02-01-19, 06:28 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

I'm agreeing with you on almost everything. All I'm saying that the topic itself will be fodder for every candidate. The counter-argument will be how to pay for it. I will support someone with answers before I support someone with the idea of just pay for it. For all the bitching Obama did about GWB's spending he spent more. For all of Trump's complaining about Obama's spending, he is doing nothing to reign it in and continues to spend more.

You are absolutely correct about healthcare. The Republicans had years to work out a competitive plan and did nothing. They needed the Senate, got it and did nothing. They needed the House. Got it and did nothing. Needed the WH. Got it and bickered it into oblivion. The skeptic in me believes Democrats love talking points (like immigration) but when given the chance to do something (had both houses and the WH in Obamas first term) do nothing. The Republicans love to argue every point (health care) but when given the chance do nothing. I think there is more political capital in blaming the other side than accomplishing something. If you accomplish something half the population won't like it anyway so why bother.

Even though my son is in the military, I agree the budget is out of whack. For those confused by an early AOC quote, the military budget did not go up by 700 billion even though they never asked for it. The budget for 2019 is 892b total and goes up almost every year. When my son needs something he is told there is no money, yet they waste zillions on projects that never see the light of day. Think Solyndra type failure over and over.

Local muni's can purchase government surplus for pennies on the dollar. Great for your highway department to be able to buy a pallet of new tools for about $600 valued at about $6000. But why buy them in the first place?
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Old 02-01-19, 06:49 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Cory Booker officially announced he is running.
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...dbAIavsV2uNAh0
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Old 02-01-19, 08:37 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post


You really, honest feel its “extreme” for everyone to have healthcare? Cause thats pretty much as extreme as we are talking about and don’t think that “extreme” at all. I’m honestly surprised anyone would oppose such “ideology”. Especially conservatives who, in general loath entitlements and “free-loaders”. Unless of course your rich, then of course THEY deserve entitlements.
It will cost a lot more than 5.7b...and under current plans, will not possibly work. I will agree and concede to using much of the military budget to make it work. But I have not heard Dems offering even that possibility.
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Old 02-01-19, 08:41 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by dex14 View Post
Cory Booker officially announced he is running.
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...dbAIavsV2uNAh0
Senator Spartacus!

He is ranks up there as one of the biggest grandstanders in the Senate!

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