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The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Old 04-13-13, 09:55 AM
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The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

This story has two parts...the trial itself and the horrific stuff that went on and the alleged media blackout. If you don't know what I'm talking about, here is a story in the Atlantic that mentions both parts of it. Warning: it is pretty disturbing stuff.

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/...-story/274944/

Another story in USA Today:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinio...olumn/2072577/

It also talks about the lack of media coverage.



My media source is mainly the internet so I haven't really noticed if the "mainstream" media covers it. Have you guys seen this covered in places? It looks like there is stuff on cnn.com about it
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Old 04-13-13, 10:11 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

I heard about it for the first time just last night when it showed up on Facebook. But like you I generally get everything from the net. It is really something certain people wouldn't want you to see.
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Old 04-13-13, 10:48 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

If the "pro-life" crowd has their way (which they never will, thank goodness), there would be "Dr." Gosnell-type "clinics" everywhere. That's how it was before Roe vs. Wade.
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Old 04-13-13, 12:15 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

I think I read about it on Yahoo last night. Absolutely makes my stomach turn, and frankly, I didn't finish reading. "Ghoulish" is the best descriptor I can think of for it. Like shit you would only see in a horror movie.

Oh, and Vibs, that is about like me saying, "This is what the pro-abortion are like, and this is what they ultimately want legalized."

It doesn't help the actual discussion.
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Old 04-13-13, 12:39 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

I don't even need to read the article, I can imagine what it is from the descriptions in the thread, because it's been documented so many times before in abortion clinics. That's the reality of the mainstream abortion clinics. This isn't 'back alley', 'pre Roe vs Wade' stuff.

A number of nurses and staff that worked for that millionaire abortion doctor who was murdered a few years back had left his office telling these types of horror stories, that were going on all the time in his office. He was an authority on how 'humane' and 'medical' abortion was, and was running one of the 'best' clinics in the country.

But people debate ideology, religion, and propaganda, not the reality of what killing babies actually is in the practice of abortion.

It's horrible, "ghastly" is a good word, stuff for most of those later term abortions.
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Old 04-13-13, 12:42 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

This just a story about a doctor who was severely negligent with his patients and procedures.

Babies got nothing to do with it. Not sure why the media is being accused of not reporting. It's just not a big fucking deal. If he killed maybe a few dozen patients or more, then the media would probably start reporting it.

Here's the reason for the story even making headlines on some "Fair And Balanced" news agencies:

Planned Parenthood recently claimed that the possibility of infants surviving late-term abortions was "highly unusual." The Gosnell case suggests otherwise.
Yep, because Gosnell is the typical abortion doctor in Teh United States.

Oh noze.

What are we going to do.

Anyway, I hear Best Buy is going to have the Upgrade & Save promotion again. Any favorite Blu-rays you're getting. I'm still trying to decide on which ones to get.
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Old 04-13-13, 02:19 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

One of the more disturbing stories I've read and it really is fairly shocking it's not being reported more. Beyond the delivering of viable babies and severing their spinal cords, there's just an incredible amount of shit going on. Milk cartons and other food containers full of fetuses, 15-year-old employees doping up patients, rusty medical tools, delivering babies into toilets, dark-skinned girls getting different treatment than white girls... it's like reading the script to a torture porn movie. Not to mention the rundown of all the times the place should have been shut down, but was given a pass by the gov't or other medical facilities. It's rather staggering.

That said, I'm pro-choice up to the point of viability and find both sides' spin on this to be fairly disgusting. I've said it before, but if I based my stance solely on how I feel about the leading spokespeople for both sides, I'd be pro-abortion and anti-choice.
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Old 04-13-13, 02:37 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Vibiana View Post
If the "pro-life" crowd has their way (which they never will, thank goodness), there would be "Dr." Gosnell-type "clinics" everywhere. That's how it was before Roe vs. Wade.
The grand jury report has testimony from state health department officials that said the state inspected abortion clinics regularly until pro-choice Gov Tom Ridge took over after Pro-life Gov Rob Casey left office. Ridge's administration ended routine inspections because they felt it restricted access to abortion. The health department considered resuming the practice at one point, but decided against it because they suspected a number of clinics would fail and it would reduce the number of operating clinics in the state. Several pro-choice witnesses testified that they did not share this view.

According to the report, the state was very lax in its enforcement for the entire history of the clinic. The clinic only received 4 "annual" inspections between it's opening in 1979 and the end of "annual" inspections in 1993. Each follow up inspection found major deficiencies, but allowed the clinic to keep operating after promising corrective action. There was no documentation, or indications from later inspections, that the violations were corrected.

After 1993 the new policy was to only inspect after a patient complaint, but despite two deaths and several complaints the Health department never inspected the facility until after it was raided in 2010. One doctor testified that he hand delivered a complaint to the Health Secretary in 1997. He and his colleagues found that a number of their patients acquired sexually transmitted parasites after being referred to Gosnell. He sent a social worker to discuss the issue with Gosnell's staff and after she reported back to him about the conditions at the clinic he stopped referring patients and delivered the complaint. No record of his complaint or any action taken could be found.

There was also testimony from a National Abortion Federation inspector that rejected Gosnell's 2009 application for admittance. The NAF is a private organization that inspects and certifies abortion facilities, basically doing what the state should have done. Despite testimony that Gosnell tried to cheat his way past the inspection, the inspector said the clinic was the worst she had ever seen and out of roughly 100 inspections it was the only time she knew of where NAF outright rejected an applicant instead of issuing a list of issues needing correction for admittance. Despite witnessing and documenting illegal practices neither the inspector nor the NAF itself contacted the state health department.

Shortly after the grand jury issued their report in 2011 pro-life Gov. Tom Corbett fired several Health department lawyers and officials over the issue. He announced that the state will resume annual inspections, make the results publicly available, and overhaul it's complaint investigation procedures.


Also from the report:
Let us say right up front that we realize this case will be used by those on both sides of the abortion debate. We ourselves cover a spectrum of personal beliefs about the morality of abortion. For us as a criminal grand jury, however, the case is not about that controversy; it is about disregard of the law and disdain for the lives and health of mothers and infants. We find common ground in exposing what happened here, and in recommending measures to prevent anything like this from ever happening again.
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Old 04-13-13, 03:00 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
I don't even need to read the article, I can imagine what it is from the descriptions in the thread, because it's been documented so many times before in abortion clinics. That's the reality of the mainstream abortion clinics.
Oh, horseshit.
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Old 04-13-13, 03:24 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Wow, lot of horseshit being spewed about from the pro-lifers. SMH
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Old 04-13-13, 09:42 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Rockmjd23 View Post
Feel free to point it out.
It's only a baby if and when I want it to be! At all other times it is a parasite! Science! Sexism! Keep your rosaries off my ovaries!
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Old 04-13-13, 09:55 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Look at the picture of the baby girl in the Atlantic story. Does anyone really think its ok to abort at that term in the pregnancy? Anyone want to argue that is not a viable life? If you do, at what point is it not ok?
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Old 04-13-13, 09:55 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Why So Blu? View Post
Wow, lot of horseshit being spewed about from the pro-lifers. SMH
As oppose to the other side with their "killing children that have already been born is absolutely not the norm, so let's not act like this is some big dea...it shouldn't even be newsl" logic.
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Old 04-13-13, 09:55 PM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

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Old 04-14-13, 06:32 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
As oppose to the other side with their "killing children that have already been born is absolutely not the norm,
it isn't and you know it, but nothings going to keep you from saying it.
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Old 04-14-13, 07:01 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Jason View Post
it is
No man, it really isn't.
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Old 04-14-13, 09:19 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

One of Gosnell's employees is claiming to have killed more than 100 live babies, and says that this was considered "standard procedure" at the clinic:


http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?se...ime&id=8417220

Steven Massof, 49, of Pittsburgh, pleaded guilty to two counts of third-degree murder, murder conspiracy and other charges.

Massof testified to a grand jury that he snipped the spines of more than 100 babies after seeing them breathe, move or show other signs of life.

"Severing the spinal cords of moving, breathing babies outside their mothers' wombs was, according to Massof, `standard procedure,"' the grand jury report centered on Dr. Kermit Gosnell's clinic charged.

"Gosnell encouraged his staff to kill babies born alive; Lynda Williams, Adrienne Moton and Steven Massof all followed his barbaric example," said the nearly 300-page report, issued in January.
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Old 04-14-13, 09:21 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by printerati View Post
It's only a baby if and when I want it to be! At all other times it is a parasite! Science! Sexism! Keep your rosaries off my ovaries!
I am guessing you are being sarcastic. If not, is it not a baby in the 9th month of the pregnancy if you decide its not?
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Old 04-14-13, 09:24 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

I'm pro-choice. But I'm a Libertarian, not a Democrat.

Democrats are always saying that they want abortion to be "safe."

But even though lots of people knew about the horrible things that kept repeatedly happening at this clinic for many years, Democrat governor Ed Rendell did nothing about it.

Only when there was a new Republican governor (Tom Corbett) did the state start taking steps to make sure that abortion is "safe."


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/23/us/23doctor.html?_r=1

January 22, 2011

Squalid Abortion Clinic Escaped State Oversight

By SABRINA TAVERNISE

PHILADELPHIA — For years, state health officials missed some unsettling patterns at the three-story brick abortion clinic on Lancaster Avenue.

It was always open late, way past the time the pizza place next door closed at midnight. The women who emerged from it — often poor blacks and Hispanics — appeared dazed and in pain, and sometimes left in ambulances. The doctor who ran the clinic, Kermit Gosnell, had been sued at least 15 times for malpractice. Two women died while under his care.

But the dangerous practices went unnoticed, except by the women who experienced them. They were discovered entirely by accident, during a prescription drug raid by federal agents last February.

The clinic — now closed, with dead plants in its windows and old mail on its front desk — stands as a grim reminder of how degrading it was for the women who went there and how long state officials ignored their complaints.

On Wednesday, the Philadelphia district attorney, Seth Williams, indicted Dr. Gosnell on eight counts of murder in the deaths of seven infants and a Bhutanese refugee who died after a late-term abortion in 2009.

A grand jury report issued on the same day offered its own theory on why so little happened for so long.

We think the reason no one acted is because the women in question were poor and of color,” the report said, “and because the victims were infants without identities, and because the subject was the political football of abortion.”

Kevin Harley, a spokesman for Gov. Tom Corbett, said Friday that the governor “was appalled at the inaction on the part of the Health Department and the Department of State,” the two agencies that were responsible for overseeing the clinic.

Mr. Corbett has ordered an investigation into what happened, Mr. Harley said, and was awaiting recommendations. He said he did not know whether any of the officials named in the report would be fired.

It was raw anxiety that propelled Sherry Thomas to Dr. Gosnell’s clinic in the summer of 1999. She was 38, she already had three children, and with her partner working as a machinist, she knew they could not afford the fourth child she was pregnant with. She left the problem alone for a while, fretting, and then decided to have an abortion. She was five months pregnant by the time she had saved enough to afford it.

She chose Dr. Gosnell’s clinic because that was where women she knew went. But when she was led into a waiting room, she started having second thoughts.

“It was like walking into a nightmare,” she said. “Everyone was sedated, no one was making sense. People were slumped over and waiting in line like they were going into a soup kitchen.”

The clinic was smelly, in part from a dirty turtle tank in the lobby, but also from generally squalid conditions. The grand jury report said the clinic had blood on the floor, a stench of urine in the air and cat feces on the stairs when agents raided it.

Semiconscious women scheduled for abortions were moaning in the waiting room or the recovery room, where they sat on dirty recliners covered with blood-stained blankets,” the report said.

Confusion was a standard reaction to the conditions, women said in interviews last week, but many of the patients were young and lacked confidence and simply sat in silence.

“It was the first time for me, and I didn’t know if that’s how women usually are,” said a young woman who had an abortion at the clinic in 1999 shortly after graduating from college.

The clinic had as little regard for the patients’ dignity as it had for their safety. The doctor would arrive late, often after 8 p.m., leaving the untrained staff, including Dr. Gosnell’s wife, Pearl, a cosmetologist, to sedate the women and administer labor-inducing drugs, the report said.

If labor began, the woman was asked to sit on a toilet, and the fetus would drop. It would be fished out later so as not to clog the plumbing, the report said. The remains of 45 fetuses were found at the clinic during the raid, according to the report. Some were stored in the staff’s refrigerator.

Ms. Thomas remembers waking up, soaked in her own blood and feeling scared. People were moving around her, trying to put her in an ambulance. Her uterus had been punctured. She was rushed to the hospital, where she was given a partial hysterectomy.

“When I woke up I thought, ‘I might die today,’ ” Ms. Thomas said. Dr. Gosnell offered her $500, she said, possibly in an effort to avert a lawsuit. She had paid $800 for the abortion.

Complaints against Dr. Gosnell date back to 1983, according to the grand jury report, but none moved state regulators to action. Some malpractice suits produced settlements that were paid by Dr. Gosnell’s insurance company, including nearly $1 million paid to the family of Semika Shaw, a 22-year-old mother of two who died from an infection in 2002 after an abortion at the clinic.

The report details a sweeping pattern of negligence, with no inspector stepping foot inside the clinic for more than 16 years. Even the death of Karnamaya Mongar, a Bhutanese refugee who died after a procedure in 2009, was ignored.

Janice Staloski, a Health Department official, declined to investigate the death, saying the department had no authority to do so, the report said. The department’s chief counsel, Christine Dutton, defended the agency’s actions to the grand jury, stating bluntly, “People die.”

Ms. Thomas tries to forget what happened. She felt helpless and disposable in Dr. Gosnell’s clinic, and she wants him to feel the same. She recalls him joking with her when she lay down on the operating table. “You’ll be fine,” he told her. “This is just like a walk in the park.
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Old 04-14-13, 09:49 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Let me clarify what I said in my earlier comment, please.

If abortion is illegal, it will not be regulated. Clinics that are not required to meet standards of safety, hygiene, and certification of providers will spring up everywhere because whether or not abortion is legal, women will seek it and providers, some of them unscrupulous, will respond to that need.
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Old 04-14-13, 10:07 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Vibiana View Post
Let me clarify what I said in my earlier comment, please.

If abortion is illegal, it will not be regulated. Clinics that are not required to meet standards of safety, hygiene, and certification of providers will spring up everywhere because whether or not abortion is legal, women will seek it and providers, some of them unscrupulous, will respond to that need.
You're wasting your time and breath. This criminal and his illegal operation is now the face of every Planned Parenthood clinic in the country as far as the pro pre-life crowd is concerned, and no appeal to logic, fact or statistics will change this.
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Old 04-14-13, 10:10 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by grundle View Post
Complaints against Dr. Gosnell date back to 1983, according to the grand jury report, but none moved state regulators to action.
That's 4 Republican & 2 Democrat governors. Not to mention the non-partisan parties that totally fucked the pooch on this. I don't think there's much reason to bring political parties into it. There's no way anyone on either side wants a human shitstain like this in business for three decades. It's just a massive failing of the system that he wasn't shut down and prosecuted sooner.
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Old 04-14-13, 10:22 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

This is some nasty abortion clinic that kept doing shit on the download hidden from government oversight for many years and some of the pro-lifers here keep on playing the "see, I told you abortion is bad" card.

Yeah, because what went on at this place is standard procedure at every abortion clinic in the country.
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Old 04-14-13, 10:35 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by Jason View Post
You're wasting your time and breath. This criminal and his illegal operation is now the face of every Planned Parenthood clinic in the country as far as the pro pre-life crowd is concerned, and no appeal to logic, fact or statistics will change this.
Almost like pedophile priests being the face of the Catholic Church or the Movie Theater shooter being the face of the NRA? That's the way it goes. Just happens that the shoe is on the other foot of what you support, most likely.

Is this the norm? Nah, but neither are those two other things. And this isn't as rare as you think either.
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Old 04-14-13, 10:37 AM
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Re: The Gosnell trial...and the media "blackout"

Originally Posted by maxfisher View Post
That's 4 Republican & 2 Democrat governors. Not to mention the non-partisan parties that totally fucked the pooch on this. I don't think there's much reason to bring political parties into it. There's no way anyone on either side wants a human shitstain like this in business for three decades. It's just a massive failing of the system that he wasn't shut down and prosecuted sooner.
Good point.


.



http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2013...speed=noscript

Empty ‘Reserved MEDIA Seats’ at Abortion Gosnell Murder Trial

April 12, 2013

This photo of empty ‘Reserved media’ seats at the Dr. Kermit Gosnell trial needs to be made viral. Needs to reach the low information voters.

Anyone following this case and the horrific details—the magnitude of horrors that happened daily at the hands of Gosnell—should outrage everyone to see the empty media seats.




.



From one of the articles in the original post:


http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinio...olumn/2072577/

April 11, 2013

A Lexis-Nexis search shows none of the news shows on the three major national television networks has mentioned the Gosnell trial in the last three months. The exception is when Wall Street Journal columnist Peggy Noonan hijacked a segment on Meet the Press meant to foment outrage over an anti-abortion rights law in some backward red state.

The Washington Post has not published original reporting on this during the trial and The New York Times saw fit to run one original story on A-17 on the trial's first day. They've been silent ever since, despite headline-worthy testimony.
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