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Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

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Old 07-14-11, 09:14 AM   #101
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by pedagogue View Post
He has mostly ignored the majority of Americans who have asked for stricter enforcement of existing laws about illegal immigrations. He is allowing too much "discretion" to the prosecution (or lack there of) for court cases involving illegal immigrants. Why is he doing this...because he wants to convert the 20+ million illegal immigrants into legalized votes.....err....citizens.

This move is just the next step towards granting compete amnesty and a super-fast track to citizenship. His rationale is that they are already going to school, working jobs, etc.
Where do you get this stuff?
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Old 07-18-11, 09:24 PM   #102
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by pedagogue View Post
Plethora =/= once.

An illegal immigrant violates multiple laws breaking into the country, breaks more laws by staying, and their activities here break even more laws. Running 1 stop light does not equate to ID theft, tax evasion, forging legal documents, etc.



Citations to prove otherwise?
You want me to disprove your uncited opinion?
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Old 07-18-11, 10:11 PM   #103
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Red Dog View Post
Where do you get this stuff?
You'd think with those kinds of precognitive powers, he would know the lotto numbers.
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Old 07-18-11, 10:49 PM   #104
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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You want me to disprove your uncited opinion?
Are you really asking me to prove that illegals....are here illegally?
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Old 07-27-11, 09:57 AM   #105
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Gov. Brewer with a textbook example of conservative hypocrisy. Federalism and State rights rabble rabble rabble -- preemption does not apply to illegal immigration and federally mandated insurance, but medical marijuana??!! Oh, well, the feds preempt the states there.

http://reason.com/archives/2011/07/2...s-capitulation

Quote:
Cannabis Capitulation
The marijuana exception to Jan Brewer's federalism

Jacob Sullum | July 27, 2011

New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, a Republican and former U.S. attorney, has never been keen on his state's Compassionate Use of Medical Marijuana Act, which his predecessor, Jon Corzine, signed into law on the last day of his administration. But last week Christie announced that New Jersey will proceed with plans to let six nonprofit organizations distribute marijuana to patients with "debilitating medical conditions" such as cancer, AIDS, and multiple sclerosis, despite the risk of federal prosecution.

In Arizona, meanwhile, the Medical Marijuana Act approved by voters last November remains on hold thanks to Gov. Jan Brewer, who worries that it conflicts with the federal Controlled Substances Act. Brewer, a Republican who proudly advocates a "new federalism" that "protects the States and [their] citizens against an over-reaching federal government," in this case seems happy to let the Obama administration override the will of Arizona's voters.

Although President Obama has repeatedly said he opposes "using Justice Department resources to try to circumvent state laws on this issue," several U.S. attorneys warned last spring that compliance with state law offers no protection against federal prosecution for growing or distributing marijuana. That position was confirmed by a June 29 memo from Deputy Attorney General James Cole.

Citing this reversal, Brewer has asked a federal judge to decide whether the Arizona Medical Marijuana Act, which she opposed before the election, "complies with federal law" or is "preempted in whole or in part because of an irreconcilable conflict with federal law." Oddly, Brewer expresses no preference between those two diametrically opposed choices, which reinforces the impression that her suit is a veiled attempt to overturn Arizona's law without antagonizing its supporters.

Brewer claims to be concerned about the legal exposure of state employees who license and regulate dispensaries. But Dennis Burke, the U.S. attorney for Arizona, says he has "no intention of targeting or going after people who are implementing…state law."

In any case, all state regulators would be doing is determining who qualifies for a medical exemption from state drug penalties. As the American Civil Liberties Union notes in a motion to dismiss Brewer's suit, performing that function does not conflict with the Controlled Substances Act or prevent the federal government from enforcing it.

The ACLU argues that there are no plausible grounds for charging state employees with a federal crime, since licensing and regulating dispensaries does not involve growing or distributing marijuana and does not meet the intent and knowledge requirements for convicting someone of conspiracy, aiding and abetting, acting as an accessory, or money laundering. The group adds that regulators could not be prosecuted simply for failing to rat out licensees to the feds, since "respecting confidentiality does not constitute an affirmative act," which is required to convict someone of concealing a felony.

Although Vermont, Delaware, and New Jersey have proceeded with plans for state-licensed dispensaries despite the prosecution threats, Brewer is not the only governor who has capitulated to federal pressure. Washington Gov. Christine Gregoire, a Democrat who had supported a bill that would have authorized dispensaries, decided to veto it after receiving a threatening letter from U.S. attorneys. Rhode Island Gov. Lincoln Chafee, an independent, likewise has halted plans for dispensaries.

But Brewer's timidity is especially striking in light of her devotion to state autonomy in areas such as health care, where she has challenged federally mandated insurance, and immigration, where she has sought to pick up the slack from an administration she perceives as insufficiently committed to enforcing the law. "The United States has a federal government, not a national government," she declared in a speech last March, promising to "pursue a policy of renewed federalism" and complaining that "never during our nearly 100 years of statehood has federal interference...been more blatant."

Two months later, Brewer surrendered to federal interference by suspending her state's medical marijuana program. Legal scholars often bemoan "the drug exception to the Fourth Amendment." Apparently there is also a drug exception to the 10th Amendment.
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Old 07-27-11, 10:01 AM   #106
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Let's stop the medical use of marijuana nonsense (back door) & legalize marijuana.
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Old 07-27-11, 10:43 AM   #107
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Let's stop the medical use of marijuana nonsense (back door) & legalize marijuana.
That would be the sensible thing to do, thus it will never happen.
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Old 07-27-11, 11:12 AM   #108
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Exactly, there is no (good) reason why pot should not be legal.
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Old 07-27-11, 11:29 AM   #109
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

While we're at it - legalize cocaine, heroin, meth, & especially mushrooms.

I'm certain some enterprising person can find some medical reason for their use - as they have for medical marijuana.
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Old 07-27-11, 11:29 AM   #110
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Exactly, there is no (good) reason why pot should not be legal.
There are plenty of good reasons why we shouldn't legalize drugs. It's because we would probably have to release the entirety of the prison population, because it would be unfair to incarcerate someone when a law they've broken has been overturned. And to do that would be extremely costly and hazardous to society. What a nice little corner we've painted ourselves into.
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Old 07-27-11, 11:36 AM   #111
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
While we're at it - legalize cocaine, heroin, meth, & especially mushrooms.

I'm certain some enterprising person can find some medical reason for their use - as they have for medical marijuana.
Cocaine is actually very useful for medicinal purposes and is widely found in almost all hospitals. It's an extremely effective topical analgesic with little to no side effects and the dosage is extremely easy to control within a very large range with no possibility of permanent nerve damage.

Methamphetamines are prescribed for people with severe cases of ADD, some forms of OCD, and is also used to treat suicidally/psychotically depressed patients who don't respond to other therapies as well as the morbidly obese. I've taken it to treat my ADD and in small doses it did wonders. I felt like I was waking up from a dream and I could finally focus on tasks in front of me without my mind wandering constantly.

Heroin is for all intents and purposes equivalent to morphine.

As for 'shrooms... well, you got me there. But I suppose it could go into the category of drugs used for religious experiences/rituals. And I don't think society should bar anyone from the practice of spirituality, no matter how superficial it might seem to other established religions.
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Old 07-27-11, 11:54 AM   #112
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Many people use small amounts of shrooms for the treatment of chronic migraines.

Regardless, shrooms are very much non-addictive and I don't think their legalization presents much of a threat to anyone. The biggest danger is a bad trip.
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Old 07-27-11, 12:24 PM   #113
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Cocaine is actually very useful for medicinal purposes and is widely found in almost all hospitals. It's an extremely effective topical analgesic with little to no side effects and the dosage is extremely easy to control within a very large range with no possibility of permanent nerve damage.

Methamphetamines are prescribed for people with severe cases of ADD, some forms of OCD, and is also used to treat suicidally/psychotically depressed patients who don't respond to other therapies as well as the morbidly obese. I've taken it to treat my ADD and in small doses it did wonders. I felt like I was waking up from a dream and I could finally focus on tasks in front of me without my mind wandering constantly.

Heroin is for all intents and purposes equivalent to morphine.

As for 'shrooms... well, you got me there. But I suppose it could go into the category of drugs used for religious experiences/rituals. And I don't think society should bar anyone from the practice of spirituality, no matter how superficial it might seem to other established religions.
'Shrooms' are often eaten with nuts. We all know that nuts are good for the heart.

btw: I think you'll get a challenge about heroin.
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Old 07-27-11, 12:26 PM   #114
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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'Shrooms' are often eaten with nuts. We all know that nuts are good for the heart.

btw: I think you'll get a challenge about heroin.
When you're talking street drugs, of course there's going to be a difference. But when you're talking something of pharmaceutical grade, there really is no difference. The only reason heroin provides the rush that it does is that users mainline it.

I should say though, the point of my post was that there are definitely medicinal uses of street drugs, but they're not used as justifications for legalization. They're put to good use quite often actually, and legalization issues don't hinder it in the slightest. Even LSD appears to have medicinal uses in the treatment of cluster headaches in ongoing trials, and maybe have other good applications in the future.

But with regards to the overall issue... yeah, we should just legalize marijuana for recreational purposes. I mean, that's what the whole medicinal movement was really about. Especially since there are tons of drugs already available that already provide all the benefits of THC. There's even a synthetic version of THC available.
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Old 07-27-11, 01:25 PM   #115
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

The only thing the medical aspect of this is doing is opening up a market for quack doctors to give a referral for $75 .. they should allow people to open shops like liquor stores and/or let people grow reasonably amounts at home (outside so they do not need to use a trillion kw of electricity) ... maybe require that the are in the back yard behind a fence.
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Old 07-27-11, 02:19 PM   #116
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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There are plenty of good reasons why we shouldn't legalize drugs. It's because we would probably have to release the entirety of the prison population, because it would be unfair to incarcerate someone when a law they've broken has been overturned. And to do that would be extremely costly and hazardous to society. What a nice little corner we've painted ourselves into.
After Miranda v. Arizona did we release all the people who wasn't read their Miranda warning? Did any of them even get a new trial? I know it's not the same thing, but when sold/used/etc. drugs it was illegal, thus they broke the law. If we change the law it only affects what happens in the future not what happened in the past. I don't think we have painted ourselves into a corner at all. I also don't think that is unfair, but I'm a cold hearted bastard.
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Old 08-05-11, 12:38 AM   #117
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

http://enews.earthlink.net/article/t...e-e80549557c9b

Quote:
Mexico town's police force quits after attack

CIUDAD JUAREZ, Mexico (AP) — An entire 20-man police force resigned in a northern Mexican town after a series of attacks that killed the police chief and five officers over the last three months, state officials said Thursday.

The officers' resignation Thursday left the 13,000 people of Ascension without local police services, Chihuahua state chief prosecutor Carlos Manuel Salas said. State and federal police have moved in to take over police work, he said.

The mass resignation appeared to be connected to a Tuesday attack by gunmen that killed three of the town's officers, Salas said.

But it wasn't the first deadly attack on the police department this year.

In mid-May, police chief Manuel Martinez, who had been in office just seven months, was gunned down with two other officers on a nearby highway. The three had been kidnapped a day before police found their bodies riddled with bullets in the back seat of a sedan.

The town's police force was relatively new.

Angry residents had led authorities to replace the entire force last September after the mob killings of two teenagers who had allegedly kidnapped a girl from a seafood restaurant. People claimed police officers were aiding drug gangs.

Martinez, with his new police force, had said he wanted to end the kidnappings and extortions that have terrorized the town where people grow green chili and cotton.

The new police in Ascension had installed a telescopic camera in the town's plaza that rotated, giving officers at the station the ability to zoom on a site as far as the outskirts of town.

In addition, townspeople helped police dig a broad ditch around the town to prevent criminals from escaping on back roads.

Ascension is southwest of Ciudad Juarez, the border city across from El Paso, Texas, that is one of Mexico's most violent cities. The state of Chihuahua has had the most homicides blamed on organized crime and drug trafficking since the government's anti-drug offensive began in December 2006.

Elsewhere, the Defense Department announced that a 19-day offensive in northern states against the Zetas drug cartel had resulted in the shooting deaths of 30 alleged criminals and a soldier.

The army said that among those killed was Jorge Luis de la Pena, the Zetas boss for Nuevo Laredo, the city across the Rio Grande from Laredo, Texas.

Troops also detained 196 people in different cities during operation "North Lynx."

The Zetas gang, known for its viciousness, has been fighting its former ally, the Gulf cartel, in Mexico's north since early 2010.

Near the northern industrial hub of Monterrey, police found the bodies of two men each hanging by an ankle from a pedestrian bridge. Officers said a witness reported that gunmen strung up the men alive and then shot them.

Such grisly displays at bridges have become common in and around Monterrey as well as in other Mexican cities torn by drug violence.
With unemployment so bad in the U.S. maybe it's time for U.S. citizens to sneak down into Mexico and do the jobs that Mexicans won't do.
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Old 08-05-11, 11:59 AM   #118
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Franchot View Post
http://enews.earthlink.net/article/t...e-e80549557c9b



With unemployment so bad in the U.S. maybe it's time for U.S. citizens to sneak down into Mexico and do the jobs that Mexicans won't do.
C'mon, you know that Mexico has a much stricter immigration/work visa law. Plus, if you show up there and protest to the government about it, you'll have committed a felony, so no luck changing the policies.

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Originally Posted by Superboy View Post
Why do you always ask so many questions, but give so few answers?

You already know the answer to your question: They leave, and they take their money with them. The same goes for the legal students studying here too. Apparently America has decided that we should train people at the best colleges in the world, and then turn around and tell them to leave.
Missed this earlier, but I wasn't being facetious. Is this actually what happens? We allow illegal aliens to get in-state tuition, then they go back to Mexico or wherever, despite having been here for a long time (which was the argument for giving them in-state tuition)?
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Old 08-07-11, 01:45 PM   #119
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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C'mon, you know that Mexico has a much stricter immigration/work visa law. Plus, if you show up there and protest to the government about it, you'll have committed a felony, so no luck changing the policies.
And that's why we're a much better country to live in.
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Old 08-07-11, 06:38 PM   #120
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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With unemployment so bad in the U.S. maybe it's time for U.S. citizens to sneak down into Mexico and do the jobs that Mexicans won't do.
Our police depts have plenty of para-military SWAT gear that they can send down. That is a true warzone where they can do No Knock Warrant/Raids and shoot-up random houses.
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Old 08-09-11, 11:58 PM   #121
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Abandon all hope Anti-Illegal Immigration Folks. You are losing the uphill battle worse than you think.

Click for story:

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/440737.../#.TkICo2F5fKs

Illegal Immigrant Interns at State Capitol

Quote:
"For example, when I was working with Assembly Member Mendoza or Assembly Member Block's office, I was actually advising the member on how to vote on certain things by collecting information, by analyzing bills, by doing things that other people are not able to do."
Wow.
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Old 08-10-11, 01:02 PM   #122
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

It's a shame a Mexican who is that bright isn't living in Mexico where he could possibly make a great difference instead of rooting around with a bunch of worthless state senators in California. What hope does Mexico have if not only their retched manual laborers but also their best and brightest would rather take the risks up here than stay there?
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Old 08-17-11, 11:17 AM   #123
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

(Reuters) - Latino activists held a protest outside President Barack Obama's 2012 campaign headquarters on Tuesday to ask him to end a criminal deportation program they say is snaring large number of illegal immigrants who have not committed crimes

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...77G00320110817
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Old 08-18-11, 05:37 PM   #124
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Cannot pass the Dream Act .. just do it anyway.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/19/us/19immig.html

Quote:
Deportation Halted for Younger Immigrants

By ROBERT PEAR


WASHINGTON — The Obama administration announced on Thursday that it would generally not deport or expel illegal immigrants who had come to the United States as young children and graduated from high school or served in the armed forces.

White House and immigration officials said they would exercise “prosecutorial discretion” to allow these people to stay in the country while the government focused its enforcement efforts on higher-priority cases involving criminals and people who had flagrantly violated immigration laws.

President Obama is, in effect, doing administratively what he could not persuade Congress to do — allowing the secretary of homeland security to provide relief to a select group of students who are here illegally but show great promise.

Senator Richard J. Durbin of Illinois, the No. 2 Senate Democrat, has argued for a decade that “these young people should not be punished for their parents’ mistakes.”

White House officials emphasized that they were not granting relief to a whole class of people, but would review cases one by one, using new standards meant to distinguish between low- and high-priority cases.

“The president has said on numerous occasions that it makes no sense to expend our enforcement resources on low-priority cases, such as individuals” who were brought to this country as young children and know no other home, the secretary of homeland security, Janet Napolitano, said in a letter to Mr. Durbin.

Ms. Napolitano said that low-priority cases were “clogging immigration court dockets and diverting enforcement resources away from individuals who pose a threat to public safety.”

Mr. Durbin said he believed the new policy would halt the deportation of most people who would qualify for relief under a bill, known as the Dream Act, that he has repeatedly introduced in the last 10 years.

Under the new policy, the government will review 300,000 cases of people in deportation proceedings to identify those who might qualify for relief and those who should be expelled as soon as possible.

White House officials said the new policy would help illegal immigrants with family members in the United States. The White House is interpreting “family” to include partners of gay and bisexual people.
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Old 08-18-11, 06:00 PM   #125
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Under the new policy, the government will review 300,000 cases of people in deportation proceedings to identify those who might qualify for relief and those who should be expelled as soon as possible.
Qualify for relief? OK just so I make sure I got this straight.. With unemployment at record highs the message is to ignore our laws and sneak in. If you can beat an American citizen out of a job or have a baby then we will reward you by letting you stay and giving you gov't assistance? That's just fantastic.
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