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CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Old 10-04-10, 11:25 AM
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CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

http://money.cnn.com/news/economy/st...uts/index.html

Interesting flow chart comparing different proposals. Also, has an ongoing poll. Check it out when you get a minute.
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Old 10-04-10, 02:23 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

$70B A YEAR!!! REPUBLICANS DON'T CARE ABOUT THE DEFICIT!

What were we talking about again?
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Old 10-04-10, 02:46 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

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Old 10-04-10, 02:53 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Greenspan is hardcore!
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Old 10-04-10, 02:56 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by Birrman54 View Post
$70B A YEAR!!! REPUBLICANS DON'T CARE ABOUT THE DEFICIT!

What were we talking about again?
If you're talking about the difference between the White House plan and the Republican plan, you're off by an order of magnitude.
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Old 10-04-10, 03:08 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
If you're talking about the difference between the White House plan and the Republican plan, you're off by an order of magnitude.
The "costs" are estimated lies over ten years. That is why the Republican and "some Democrats" plans are radically different. For the (two??) years the proposals are the same, the costs are the same. Inflation assumptions drive up the "cost of tax cuts" (lack of revenue from not increasing taxes) in the out years, so the cost is probably around $50 billion in the first year growing to $90 billion in 10 years and totalling $700 billion over the ten year span.

This is why it is "cheaper" to fix AMT one year at a time vs fixing it permanently. (Each year it is "fixed" the cost is really the same. Figures don't lie but budget statisticians do, quite well, in fact. I would hate to face one in liar's poker.)

If "some Democrats" get their way, what are the odds they would man up and raise taxes in two years when they are afraid to now. (Answer: They will most likely be out of office).
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Old 10-04-10, 03:15 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

I voted for the guy with glasses. I almost voted for the dark skinned fellow but his expression was creepier than Obama's.

I'm not sure I understood the game though.
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Old 10-04-10, 04:01 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Why didn't the Democrats just vote to extend all the Bush tax cuts for one year?

I'm not saying I would be for it, but it's the wise political thing to do.

It can't be because the Democrats have a problem with ballooning the deficit. They haven't had that problem since they gained control of the House & the Senate.

btw, the Repubs aren't afflicted with that problem either.

Last edited by classicman2; 10-04-10 at 04:22 PM.
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Old 10-04-10, 04:17 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
If you're talking about the difference between the White House plan and the Republican plan, you're off by an order of magnitude.
I believe there are 10 years in a decade. I'll double check though.

They mean to say that it will add $700B to the DEBT over a 10 year period, it will not increase the budget DEFICIT by that amount at all. So yes, if the Republicans have their way we will have increased our annual budget shortfall by $70B which is $700B over 10 years. Or to put it another way, they will have increased the annual deficit by ~26% rather than ~21%.

They could actually decide to find areas to meaningfully reduce spending - but I guess it'd be easier to talk about whose policies would lose money the slower.

Last edited by Birrman54; 10-04-10 at 04:28 PM.
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Old 10-04-10, 04:25 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Maybe you should have included the phrase "a year" in your post. Maybe you should even have put it in all-caps so people might notice it.

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Old 10-04-10, 04:29 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Maybe you should have included the phrase "a year" in your post. Maybe you should even have put it in all-caps so people might notice it.

My response was kinda snarky, so I'll apologize for the tone. It's been a long, coffee-free day.
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Old 10-04-10, 04:58 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

I like how Democrats say we can't afford to hold the lower rate for the "rich" because it will "cost" $700 billion over 10 years. But we can afford to hold the lower rate for the middle class because it will only "cost" $3 trillion.
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Old 10-04-10, 05:08 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by Birrman54 View Post
My response was kinda snarky, so I'll apologize for the tone. It's been a long, coffee-free day.
No worries. I didn't read your original post carefully, so it's my own damned fault and I deserve whatever snark you want to hand out.
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Old 10-04-10, 05:40 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Even though he's largely responsible for a lot of the economic damage we've sustained over the last 20 years, I support the Greenspan solution. You can't clean up debt by throwing less money at it.
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Old 10-04-10, 05:57 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

I would like to see a similar poll covering spending less. I don't think the president, republicans, or democrats actually have a plan for that, so I don't know where they would get the options, but I'd like to see it.
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Old 10-04-10, 06:06 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Spending cuts are for the next administration. Not the present one. Nobody likes actually making cuts, just talking about it without specifics.
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Old 10-04-10, 06:24 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

There will not be any serious spending cuts by this administration or the next one - even if the Repubs gain the WH.

Chris Matthews in his closing argument segment on Crossfire said that if the Repubs gain the House they will do all these dastardly things - I can't remember them all. One was minimum wage.

Chris worked for the Democrats in The House a number of years ago. He knows, or he should know, that there is another chamber that has to approve all of the Repub cuts. And, there is a Democratic president with a veto pen.

Obviously Matthews was simply attempting to scare the Democratic base with all of the evil things a Republican House would do.
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Old 10-04-10, 07:01 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Minimum wage is probably beyond the reach of a Republican House majority. But there is a lot of mischief they can do by declining to appropriate money for various things.
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Old 10-04-10, 07:33 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

What is it your president says? Elections have consequences.
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Old 10-04-10, 09:17 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
What is it your president says? Elections have consequences.
That's actually a George W. Bush quote, and it would mean more coming from you if you hadn't just made a post deriding Chris Matthews for suggesting that elections do have consequences.
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Old 10-04-10, 10:05 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
That's actually a George W. Bush quote, and it would mean more coming from you if you hadn't just made a post deriding Chris Matthews for suggesting that elections do have consequences.
Obama has said it also.
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Old 10-04-10, 10:09 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
Obama has said it also.
He's not even that statesman-like about it.

President Obama listened to Republican gripes about his stimulus package during a meeting with congressional leaders Friday morning -- but he also left no doubt about who's in charge of these negotiations. "I won," Obama noted matter-of-factly, according to sources familiar with the conversation.
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Old 10-04-10, 10:14 PM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
Why didn't the Democrats just vote to extend all the Bush tax cuts for one year?
I don't think Democrats view taxes as much of a way to raise revenue as a way to take money out of certain people's pockets.
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Old 10-05-10, 12:53 AM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Minimum wage is probably beyond the reach of a Republican House majority. But there is a lot of mischief they can do by declining to appropriate money for various things.
I just hope they can keep Obama's mischief from continuing. I can't believe anyone who remember Enron would think that Cap and Trade would be a good idea. Or anyone who understands what derivitives did to the market/economy.
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Old 10-05-10, 01:46 AM
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Re: CNN: Bush Tax Cuts: The Cheat Sheet

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
I just hope they can keep Obama's mischief from continuing. I can't believe anyone who remember Enron would think that Cap and Trade would be a good idea. Or anyone who understands what derivitives did to the market/economy.
All of a sudden you're against markets?

Cap and trade worked like a charm in the early 90s under President Bush when it solved our acid rain problem, by the way. Any time you commodotize something, there's a potential for disaster and a potential for a good outcome. I don't know enough about the specifics of the proposed carbon cap and trade to know which this is, so I'm not going to say we should adopt it or that we shouldn't. But the concept is a sound one, and one small government proponents should be rushing to embrace.
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