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View Poll Results: Of these 9 Republicans, who is your favorite?
Sen. Sam Brownback (Kan.)
1
2.86%
Former Virginia governor Jim Gilmore
0
0%
Former New York City mayor Rudy Giuliani
5
14.29%
Former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee
1
2.86%
Rep. Duncan Hunter (Calif.)
0
0%
Sen. John McCain (Ariz.)
2
5.71%
Rep. Ron Paul (Texas)
12
34.29%
Former Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney
6
17.14%
Former Wisconsin governor Tommy G. Thompson
0
0%
I don't like any of them.
8
22.86%
Voters: 35. You may not vote on this poll

Ru Paul will be on a nationally televised GOP debate! Yippee!

Old 04-03-07, 01:10 PM
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Ru Paul will be on a nationally televised GOP debate! Yippee!

This is great! Ron Paul voted against the Iraq War. I hope the 2008 election is him against pro-war Hillary Clinton.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0407/3390.html

Nine Candidates Agree to GOP Debate

By: David Mark

April 3, 2007 09:17 AM EST

Nine GOP White House hopefuls will participate in a May 3 debate at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library, an event hosted by the Ronald Reagan Presidential Foundation, in conjunction with MSNBC and The Politico.

Accepting former first lady Nancy Reagan's invitation are Sen. Sam Brownback (Kan.), former Virginia governor Jim Gilmore, former New York City mayor Rudy Giuliani, former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee, Rep. Duncan Hunter (Calif.), Sen. John McCain (Ariz.), Rep. Ron Paul (Texas), former Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney and former Wisconsin governor Tommy G. Thompson.

The debate, the first of the cycle for Republican presidential candidates, will air exclusively on cable's MSNBC, with full coverage on MSNBC.com. The Politico will stream the debate live on Politico.com, providing an exclusive and unprecedented opportunity for viewers to ask and vote on questions via the Internet.

This event will be the first of two GOP debates scheduled to take place at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library. The second is to be held Jan. 30, the final GOP debate before the 2008 Super Tuesday primary in California and several other key states.

Located in Simi Valley, Calif., the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library houses more than 55 million pages of gubernatorial, presidential and personal papers; a large collection of photographs and film; and more than 100,000 gifts and artifacts chronicling the lives of Ronald and Nancy Reagan. Home to Reagan's Air Force One (tail No. 27000), it also serves as the final resting place for the 40th president.
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Old 04-03-07, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
grundle, what are Paul's views on foreign policy? Is he an isolationist?

He is an isolationist when it comes to the military.

He is not an isolationist when it comes to trade.

He does want tougher limits against immigration.
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Old 04-03-07, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
Ok, I'm glad he favors trade. Bur does he feel America's hard power has no role to play against threats from terrorism and rogue states? What about Israel? Do we leave her to fend for herself? What about oil - how do we secure its free flow if not by force? Do we remain indifferent if islamists take over Saudi Arabia or Iraq?

I'm not sure a passive foreign policy is feasible at all at this moment.


Here are some of his columns:

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul-arch.html
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Old 04-03-07, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by grundle
He is an isolationist when it comes to the military.

He is not an isolationist when it comes to trade.

I never like using the word 'isolationism' because it makes one think of Japan before it opened itself to trade in the 19th century. The best way to describe him is that he is a non-interventionist as he is a staunch advocate of free trade. He believes in a strong national defense - emphasis on the word 'defense.'
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Old 04-03-07, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
Isolationism refers to the position republicans held during most of the twentieth century - stay the hell out of Europe's wars.
Yes, the Republicans were notoriously opposed to stopping the spread of communism across the globe. Fortunately the Democrats knew better.
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Old 04-03-07, 01:59 PM
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BTW, I obviously chose Dr. Paul in this poll, but I think I'd actually prefer former Massachusetts governor William Weld.

Oh, and grundle, why didn't you include Senator Fred Dalton Thompson in your poll?

Last edited by wendersfan; 04-03-07 at 02:02 PM.
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Old 04-03-07, 02:04 PM
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Old 04-03-07, 02:05 PM
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'I don't like any of them.'

Yeah - what about Fred Thompson - he's at 12% in the Republican voter poll - considerably higher than the candidate who won the money race.
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Old 04-03-07, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Red Dog
I never like using the word 'isolationism' because it makes one think of Japan before it opened itself to trade in the 19th century. The best way to describe him is that he is a non-interventionist as he is a staunch advocate of free trade. He believes in a strong national defense - emphasis on the word 'defense.'
Sounds good to me.

Isn't this guy pretty close to a Libertarian? I like Libertarians except in their own way they are out in left field just as much as the left-wingers and right-wingers.

I'd love a moderate Libertarian candidate.
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Old 04-03-07, 02:51 PM
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1. What's a moderate Libertarian candidate?

2. Ron Paul isn't a moderate (if there such a thing) Libertarian.

Ron Paul believes in a quaint idea about national defense. It didn't apply to the latter half of the 20th Century, and it most assuredly doesn't apply to today.
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Old 04-03-07, 02:57 PM
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I would consider Governor Weld to be moderately libertarian.
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Old 04-03-07, 05:19 PM
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How would a moderate Libertarian stand on the issue of Social Security, for example?

Would a moderate Libertarian support the graduated income tax?

Would a moderate Libertarian support universal health care?

Would a moderate Libertarian be in support of civil rights legislation such as the Public Accomodations Act?

Would a moderate Libertarian sanction the use of force if the vital national interests were threatened; or, would he only sanction the use of force in defending the physical homeland?

Would a moderate Libertarian governor sign hate crimes legislation?

Last edited by classicman2; 04-03-07 at 05:26 PM.
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Old 04-03-07, 05:35 PM
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My guesses:

1. They'd probably want to privatize a good portion of it.
2. Probably not, although they would settle for it if there were tax cuts across the board.
3. No.
4. Yes.
5. Yes, they'd probably use a vital national interest standard although their definition of vital might be different than yours but I would guess that the free flow of oil from the Middle East would probably qualify.
6. No.

A moderate libertarian would be a social liberal/economic conservative but wouldn't be as far to the extremes on the those factors as a pure libertarian.

That would certainly be good enough for me, given the cards we've been dealt by the powers that be over the last half-century.

Last edited by Red Dog; 04-03-07 at 05:43 PM.
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Old 04-03-07, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by wendersfan
Oh, and grundle, why didn't you include Senator Fred Dalton Thompson in your poll?

I just copied the 9 names that were in the article.
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Old 04-03-07, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by GreenMonkey
Sounds good to me.

Isn't this guy pretty close to a Libertarian? I like Libertarians except in their own way they are out in left field just as much as the left-wingers and right-wingers.

I'd love a moderate Libertarian candidate.

He ran for President as a Libertarian in 1988.
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Old 04-03-07, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Red Dog
I never like using the word 'isolationism' because it makes one think of Japan before it opened itself to trade in the 19th century. The best way to describe him is that he is a non-interventionist as he is a staunch advocate of free trade. He believes in a strong national defense - emphasis on the word 'defense.'
That's exactly what I was going to say as I was reading this thread. You only beat me by six hours.

That's what I get for working when I should be posting!
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Old 04-03-07, 08:13 PM
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Do we really want a non-interventionist as president?

I don't.

I do favor a less interventionist policy - a more judicious use of American power.
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Old 04-03-07, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
That only came after Eisenhower. For all the major conflicts of the 20th century, America was sent to war by democrats, with the opposition of republicans.
So I'm assuming that you don't count the first Gulf War as a "major conflict"?

And how many Republicans opposed our entry into any other of the major conflicts? World War I, World War II, the Korean War, the Vietnam War... all of the war declarations passed with flying colors. I don't see the "opposition" you speak about.

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Old 04-03-07, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by NCMojo
So I'm assuming that you don't count the first Gulf War as a "major conflict"?

And how many Republicans opposed our entry into any other of the major conflicts? World War I, World War II, the Korean War, the Vietnam War... all of the war declarations passed with flying colors. I don't see the "opposition" you speak about.


Democrats and Republicans over the decades have both embraced interventionism - a shining example of just how alike they really are.
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Old 04-04-07, 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
That only came after Eisenhower. For all the major conflicts of the 20th century, America was sent to war by democrats, with the opposition of republicans.
To be fair, WWI and WWII both took place during Democratic adiministrations. Had the Republicans been in power, I suspect that the positions would have reversed themselves.

Or are you saying that a Republican president would not have responded to Pearl Harbor?
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Old 04-04-07, 07:56 AM
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Maybe he's saying that if a Republican president had been in the WH, the Japanese wouldn't have felt it necessary to attack Pearl Harbor - agreements would have been reached to 'accomodate' the Japanese before then.

Maybe that's not what he's saying.

The opposition, led by Republicans, to war during that period was their opposition to the European War which Roosesevelt tried mightily to involve us in - and succeeded.
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Old 04-04-07, 09:14 AM
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Wow... half of that list has no chance of getting elected... and the other half has no chance of getting the nomination.

Which way will the GOP go? Will they nominate a guy that goes against the traditional party values, thereby insuring they'll get the White House in '08... or do they stick to their guns and elect someone who may represent fundamentalist Christian values, but has no chance of becoming President?
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Old 04-04-07, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by NCMojo
Wow... half of that list has no chance of getting elected... and the other half has no chance of getting the nomination.

Which way will the GOP go? Will they nominate a guy that goes against the traditional party values, thereby insuring they'll get the White House in '08... or do they stick to their guns and elect someone who may represent fundamentalist Christian values, but has no chance of becoming President?
I think they'll end up picking another Bob Dole and get smoked. Huckabee anyone?
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Old 04-04-07, 05:44 PM
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View Poll Results: Of these 9 Republicans, who is your favorite?

Sen. Sam Brownback (Kan.) 1 5.26%

Former Virginia governor Jim Gilmore 0 0%

Former New York City mayor Rudy Giuliani 3 15.79%

Former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee 1 5.26%

Rep. Duncan Hunter (Calif.) 0 0%

Sen. John McCain (Ariz.) 0 0%

Rep. Ron Paul (Texas) 7 36.84%

Former Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney 3 15.79%

Former Wisconsin governor Tommy G. Thompson 0 0%

I don't like any of them. 4 21.05%

Looks like we know who our next President will be.

I love scientific polls like this.
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Old 04-04-07, 05:51 PM
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Hell - it's been known for quite awhile that 2/3 of the Libertarians in the entire country were members of DVD Talk. What would you expect?
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