Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

If anything, that song's a clear confirmation that neither money nor fame can replace inner peace. Joe abused most (if not all) of his sons, and Michael got it worse because he dared to fight back. He lived vicariously through his children, and regularly cheated on Katherine for years. Any child growing up around that would carry tons of emotional and mental damage throughout their life...especially without anyone to truly relate with them. Lisa Marie tried, but Michael's defensiveness stressed her out.

Michael originally played games on the paparazzi, making up stories like the infamous "hyperbaric chamber" piece. The trouble started when tabloids used his own tactics against him, and he lost control. Once they realized that lies sold better than the truth, they stuck with it...and every attempt Michael made for honesty fueled their determination to ruin him.

Its called common decency, which isn't unreasonable to expect in a civilized discussion.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

If Jackson was the one who first spread disinformation, then he shouldn't have been surprised when other people did it too. Does it matter if the lie comes from the artist or from the tabloids in that case?

First, that would be "it's" because it's a contraction of "it is" and not a possessive. Second, you don't get to set the terms of discussions. Discussions are organic things, and the only bounds are the forum rules. Sorry if that's a problem for you, but that's how it is.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Expecting a civilized discussion in here is like asking tigers to eat with forks. The subject of Michael Jackson is a zebra carcass...what the fuck do you think we're gonna do with it?

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Zebra carcass? Well, you can grill it, eat it, wear it, fuck it...

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

There is no one artist that smokes 99% of an entire music industry. I don't care how great he is. Prince ain't that great. If he was he'd still be smoking today and he isn't.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Sounds like a workable song lyric to me. Write it up, boys!

Spoken like a man who hasn't seen Prince live.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I have seen him live twice actually. I'm not denying his greatness but 99%, please.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

[MJ] It don't matter how we eat it 'cause that zebra skin is black and white! [/MJ]

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Watching him walk from room to room in his house through binoculars doesn't count.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

-rolleyes- You have to be speaking from personal experience to think of something like that.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Prince is great. Wonderful music.

But Michael Jackson made better worldwide embracing music.

Indians, Ethiopians, even roaches knew who Michael Jackson was.

When has a man ever fainted at a Prince concert? lol

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Lying is always wrong, but the tabloids did it maliciously, and that's worse. Mischief is very different from deliberately harmful intent.

I've seen it spelled both ways, and that topic is still debated today...much like starting a sentence with the words "and" or "but".

Well, the existing rules aren't strict enough. People cussing worse than sailors, treating women like property, using personal attacks instead of having respectful debates...that stuff doesn't express any degree of intelligence or courtesy.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

It is not up for debate. "It's" is a contraction of "it is". "Its" is a possessive pronoun. Period.

And baba booey to you all. :mad:

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

The only people debating it are the people who are using the wrong one...which doesn't make the use of it any more correct, but does make the people debating it look even stupider. Use the correct one...

...for MJ...

...he'd want it that way.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Lying is always wrong, unless the guy you hero worship does it. Got it.

You've seen it spelled both ways because both "its" and "it's" are words. But as I said, the former is for possession, while the latter is a contraction. There is no debate about that.

Then you can start a thread about the rules in the Feedback forum. What you can't do is impose your standards of decorum on the whole forum. You can try and get the rules changed, or you can go to a forum whose rules are more in line with your standards.

And personal attacks ARE against forum rules. However, personal attacks are not the same thing as disagreeing with a person and/or their beliefs.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I never said MJ lying was a good thing, but here's another example of a moral dilemma. Let's say you're protecting someone from a murderer who's looking for them, and they ask you where they are. Do you have a bigger obligation to tell the truth, or keep your charge safe? This doesn't negate the absolute nature of truth, but it demonstrates that such choices aren't always easy.

You and I had a similar discussion about this on PM not long ago, and as a moderator, I'm fairly sure you'd fight tooth and nail against any more restrictions. Unless there's other mods who'd feel the opposite, its a moot point.

Oh, you mean like the PC crowd, who cuss like crazy and insult everyone who gets in their way? Every standard, by definition, is imposed on someone else.

True, but many in this forum have taken to calling names and such, instead of discussing the purpose behind each thread. I've reported a few posts, but they've been ignored.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I'm sorry, did you just compare MJ leaking fake stories to the press with hiding someone from a murderer? You do know how ridiculous that sounds, right?

Yes, I am against more restrictions. However, you're still free to start a dialogue about it, and the Feedback forum is the place to do it. If you choose not to, don't cry when people choose to post as the forum rules allow them to.

Cussing like crazy and insulting everyone doesn't sound very PC to me. Or do you mean that in a PC vs. Mac kind of way?

And I'm not saying that standards aren't imposed on this forum. I'm saying that YOUR standards aren't going to be imposed on this forum just because you ask people to at the start of your thread. The standards of this forum ARE imposed on you because you agreed to abide by them when you signed up to post here.

My guess is that the reason such posts were ignored is because the moderating team did not agree with you that such posts were personal attacks. But then I can't speak for every moderator, nor have I seen every post you reported.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

On the surface, it sounds unreasonable, but I was just pointing out the differences regarding intent.

Well, the politically-correct crowd is known for a huge double standard. They don't think twice about personally condemning those who disagree with them, but if others throw it back, they cry wolf to the ACLU and Supreme Court.

The only thing I was required to acknowledge during registration was the V-Bulletin terms, not the rules of this particular forum. I do recall one of those terms prohibiting vulgar discussions, but that doesn't appear to deter many around here.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

You should have been made to look over and agree to the forum rules. If you didn't, then here they are: http://forum.dvdtalk.com/rules.php

The only limits on profanity are in thread titles. A few words are censored automatically. Everything else is fair game.

Again, if you have an issue with the rules, then start a thread in Feedback. Asking people to refrain from posting any particular way is the fastest way to ensure that they post exactly how you don't want them to. I'm not saying that to taunt you, that's simply the culture of this forum.

As far as the ACLU and the SCOTUS goes, I think that's a little beyond our little message board, wouldn't you agree?

Now, please, tell me, if this town is just an apple, then why can't I take a bite?

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Thanks for the link; I'll check it out.

Not in the "information age", with multiple governments trying to censor even the slightest bit of free speech. I try my best never to deliberately offend someone, but their reactions aren't my fault nor responsibility.

You might want to make sure its not poisoned first. ;)

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Multiple governments may be trying to censor free speech, but that isn't what's happening on this board. And it's bizarre that you'd argue for free speech while trying to limit people's use of it here. :confused:

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I'm simply saying that freedom, in order to be most effective, needs tempering with responsibility. Here's just a few things I've seen people do here, which are described as against the forum rules from your link.

1) Attempting to get around the forum censor by modifying words

2) Using DVD Talk Forum to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law.

3) No threads of an explicit sexual nature.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Feel free to report those posts.

And, for the record, you should report yourself for posting the Dinesh D'Souza video, which was false, defamatory, and inaccurate.

And we do temper freedom with responsibility, hence the forum rules and moderator system.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I'm taking this to PM, so the MJ thread doesn't go any more off the rails.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

To get this back on track, what are some of your favorite songs from Michael's later years? I really love "Blood on the Dance Floor".

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Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Blood On The Dance Floor, Scream, and Stranger In Moscow are three of his better tracks from the later days.

I couldn't make it through Invincible, though. Anything that had made Jackson unique or interesting was dried up and dead by then.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I really want to see the MJ Cirque show in Vegas. :)

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I really love "Unbreakable", "Butterflies", "You Rock My World", "You Are My Life", and "Privacy" from that album. "Threatened" also serves as a pseudo-sequel to "Thriller", with an excellently-constructed intro from Rod Serling.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Always been a fan of his music. It was around growing up since my parents had the albums and he always had catch songs.

I never much paid any attention to price while I do have all of Michael's work.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

The only album of Prince's music I've ever had was the 1989 "Batman" soundtrack, but that was years ago. "When Doves Cry" is a classic, though.

On a slightly related note, I'd long thought that Michael named his sons Prince as a reference to his "King of Pop" moniker, but it turns out Joe's grandfather was named Prince.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

And it wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that Michael dubbed himself the "King of Pop", thereby making his first son a "Prince".

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I'm not sure, but I read his younger son's given name is Michael Joseph Jackson, Jr.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Reading through this thread, I forgot for a good five minutes that it was about Wacko Jacko.

Good musician, made some great records. What a fucked up crazy dude though. R.I.P, you crazy son of a bitch.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

So for you Prince aficionados, what's the best album to start with? I'm obviously familiar with Purple Rain as you couldn't escape it when it was out. I liked it a lot back then. I have the movie too but haven't seen it in ages.

I don't want to do a greatest hits thing - I'd rather listen to a full album as intended.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Get Sign O' The Times ASAP. Phenomenal piece of work.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

:clap:

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

I really like 1999. And Sign O' The Times.

Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

Cool - I was already thinking about that one since Steven Wilson has a pretty cool cover of the track Sign O' The Times:

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Re: MICHAEL JACKSON - Unofficial Discussion Thread
 

That was a cruel name invented by the tabloids, because they didn't care about him as a person.

Some of his choices were very unusual, but how different would ours be if we'd lived his life? I truly hope he's in heaven with God now, because thinking of the alternative breaks my heart.