superdeluxe

Oh, how I love this album. Agree with everyone else that most people have a B-sides album, and you can tell that the tracks were just not good enough to be on a CD. Many tracks on PI are even superior to tracks that make it onto the albums. Some of my favorite tracks are Frail and Bedazzled, Hello Kitty Kat, the great cover Landslide and of course Starla. The guitar work in Starla (the last 2-3 minute solo guitar riff), is some of the most awesomeist (is that a word?) rockingest stuff that came from the 90s.

Definately belongs in any collection.

DVD Josh

There is nothing on PI that deserved to be on SD or Gish. I LOVE the album, but these are very basic songs, nothing special about any of them, just straight ahead, 4/4 power chord rock songs. The songs on SD were SPECIAL, these are just good songs.

Starla I'll give the exception to, but the rest are just good casual listens. SD commands you listen to the whole thing.

superdeluxe

Does Billy have soundboards of DD shows in 95? (if you know)

brokenhanger

I agree with you on "Siamese Dream" - as I said previously, all the b-sides for the album, while amazing, were definately b-sides and didn't quite hold up to the album proper - but 'Obscured' should have definately been on "Gish"...in place of 'Crush' in my opinion. Would've been a more solid finish to the amazing run of 'I Am One' through 'Bury Me' whereas it is the equal of those four songs instead of a bit of a step down.

But it was not to be...

krazykat72

No love for Plume? One of my favorites on PI and it's a 'less is more type song' with a great solo.

-Paul Jacobi-

auto

While I agree with Josh here I still love this collection. Like most people have mentioned, it really holds together like an album, not a collection of castoffs. Starla may be the real winner but I can listen to this one pretty much straight through. I had such high hopes for Judas O but it didn't approach the quality of this collection. I would also agree that Blew Away is the best Iha song with the Pumpkins.

superdeluxe

I think for me, I didn't have most of the songs off PI, but for Judas O, if youd ownloaded some of the bootlegs (which was easier in 2000), and Machina II, you pretty much had most of Judas O, although having them on a hard cd was very cool as well.

superdeluxe

Treblezine lists Siamese Dream as its best album of 1993:

http://treblezine.com/features/163.html

superdeluxe

For those that collect live show bootlets, what are your favorites from every year they toured?

I'm trying to make a collection of a live boot from every year, but I only have a few years taken care of

2000: United Center
1997: GM Place
1995: Double Door
1994: Avalon

DVD Josh

1) Yes he does

2) He's not the only one

3) No, I'm not one of them

Hixx

Obscured is probably one of my favorite SP tracks of all time.

auto

Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness

Released: 1995

Tracklisting:

Disc One

1. Mellon Collie And The Infinite Sadness
2. Tonight, Tonight
3. Jellybelly
4. Zero
5. Here Is No Why
6. Bullet With Butterfly Wings
7. To Forgive
8. An Ode To No One
9. Love
10. Cupid De Locke
11. Galapogos
12. Muzzle
13. Porcelina Of The Vast Oceans
14. Take Me Down

Disc Two

1. Where Boys Fear To Tread
2. Bodies
3. Thirty-Three
4. In The Arms Of Sleep
5. 1979
6. Tales Of A Scorched Earth
7. Thru The Eyes Of Ruby
8. Stumbleine
9. X.Y.U.
10. We Only Come Out At Night
11. Beautiful
12. Lily (My One And Only)
13. By Starlight
14. Farewell And Goodnight

Credits:

orangecrush

I would say that this is their most ambitious record. I think that if you whittled it down to 1 disk, you would have their best record. The packaging for the 3 disk vinyl set was really awesome.
Their tour for MCIS was the only time I have seen them live. They performed pretty well, but I was hoping they would play a longer set. The show was not too long after that kid died in the mosh pit, so there were seats on the main floor. I had a VHS of the D.C. show where they performed an opening set acoustically. I wish I had seen that show.

chris_sc77

Amazing album. One of the best ever IMO. There are some songs that I'd say could be considered filler but overall it is an amazing accomplishment. Been listening to it this week trying to get into a SP listening frenzy.

UAIOE

There is some filler on the album, which confuses me given that some really good songs were relegated to B-side status. But still my favorite SP album.

If I had to make an Ultimate Edition of this album I'd drop some of the filler, add some b-sides from TAFH, and alter the track list some.

brokenhanger

What happened to "Vieuphoria" and "Earphoria"? Surely if we discussed "Lull" we should discuss them.

Anyways, on to the matter at hand. "Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness" is where it gets tricky. In retrospect, it only made sense for the follow up to "Siamese Dream" to be a double album - especially considering how huge the album had made the band, there was no doubt that Billy would try to one-up himself.

When it came out, I loved loved loved the album. I remember having to buy it on cassette the weekend it came out because the Media Play I went to to pick it up had run out of CDs and there was no way I was waiting any longer to get it...and being 15 at the time, I had to go where my parents would take me. This might have been the last album I bought on cassette and certainly only due to necessity. Anyways, I instantly fell in love with it, though I definately thought it trailed off a bit on side 4. ['X.Y.U.' through the end.] For a very brief period of time - like maybe a week or so - it was my favorite Smashing Pumpkins album.

Within a month of getting the album, it had started to fade. Maybe because I only owned in on cassette and was therefore forced to listen to it straight through and not skip around, I grew very tried of certain parts of the album. Side 4 rarely got a listen, and I grew sick of the singles very fast. They were inescapable at the time and truthfully, I never thought they picked the best tracks as a-sides. Keeping it interesting, however, the b-sides [which were plentiful] were better than most of the tracks on the album proper, as someone else already mentioned....in terms of the 'Bullet With Butterfly Wings', '1979', and 'Zero' singles, anyways. By the time the album had been out a year or so [and I had finally upgraded to CD], I rarely listened to it, opting for either the singles or older Smashing Pumpkins.

The tour finally rolled into Rochester in January 1997 - they had played Buffalo much earlier on the tour but I wasn't able to find a ride - and I finally got to see them, after also missing the "Siamese Dream" tour. Despite the loss of Jimmy at the time and my general malaise towards the album, the show definately did not disappoint....though more because of the back catalogue we got than anything from the album. ['Rhinoceros', 'Siva', 'Drown', 'Cherub Rock'...] That, of course, didn't stop me from spending a small fortune on tour t-shirts, most of which I still own though never wear due to buying XLs at the time for some reason when I really only need a medium.

Anyways, that has nothing to do with the album itself. I hadn't listened to it for a good 5 years when I pulled it out to re-evaluate for this thread...and it hasn't aged well at all. I don't know as to if I'd called it horrible, but it was a chore to get through the whole thing - I purposely saved it for a road trip to Albany when I'd have a solid 4 hours of uninterrupted listening time to get through it and "The Aeroplane Flies High". It starts off well enough - never been a big fan of 'Tonight, Tonight' or 'Zero', especially after they were shoved down our throats a million times a day when it was released as singles - but 'Jellybelly' and 'Here Is No Why' are both pretty fantastic. Awful is a word, however, I'd use for 'Bullet With Butterfly Wings'....good lord, how lyrically embarrassing. Which is unfortunate, as musically it is quite interesting. 'To Forgive', 'Galapogos', and 'Take Me Down' are really pretty, 'Love' is passable, and 'Porcelina of the Vast Oceans' is classic, epic Pumpkins. 'Cupid de Locke' is a waste, 'Muzzle' is too whiny, and 'An Ode to No One' isn't quite as embarrassing as 'Bullet' but it ain't great either.

"Twlight to Starlight" starts out strong again - 'Where Boys Fear To Tread' and especially 'Bodies' are strong rockers and then another pretty pair of 'Thirty-Three' and 'In The Arms of Sleep'. '1979' is one of the few times they successfully branched out of their comfort zone and is still pretty great. 'Tales of a Scorched Earth' is another embarrassment - though an incredibly apt title, and I must admit I do love how it pushes everything into the red - then another classic epic 'Thru The Eyes of Ruby' followed by another pretty one, 'Stumbeline'.

I still can't help think of the back half of "Twilight to Starlight" as the side 4 I never listned to - 'X.Y.U.' is a horrifically embarrassing [I'm using that word a lot, but it is so appropriate for a lot of this album] temper tantrum set to music and is easilly the worst thing here. Seriously. 'We Only Come Out At Night', 'Beautiful', and 'Lily' are more further reaches outside of their norm but none are as successful as '1979'. 'By Starlight' saves things a bit, and then 'Farewell and Goodnight' is admittedly a fun way to end the proceedings.

Overall, "Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness" is hard to judge on its own merits - as someone who was there at the time, it is so hard to look at it now and not see all of the hype around a sub-par Smashing Pumpkins album, the first chinks in the armor of a seemingly invincible band. [We may know now what was going on back then, but at the time most of that was kept pretty quiet.] Billy clearly felt he had to reach high for this one - who can blame him? - and if he doesn't fall flat on his face, his reach far exceeds his grasp. As someone who lived and died by the band at the time, it is so hard to not compare it to what came before it - this is no "Siamese Dream" or even "Gish. Even if you cut out the fat and trimmed it down to a single album, it would still be a disappointment in comparison. Again, though, it's shocking at to how many quality tracks were tucked away on the b-sides when the album was lacking so much - more sad than shocking, really, because the strongest tracks are the most "Siamese Dream"-esque, a sound Billy was very explicitly trying to not repeat. But we'll get to that when we do "The Aeroplane Flies High".

For me today, I really see this as the gateway Smashing Pumpkins album - there's still parts of the old band I loved peeking through, but there's also glimpses of what the band would become in there messing everything up. Mostly, I find it hard to listen to because it signifies the end of a very special band and the beginning of an insufferable one.

Favorite tracks: Jellybelly, Here Is No Way, Take Me Down, Bodies, Porcelina of the Vast Oceans, Thru the Eyes of Ruby

[That was way longer than I meant it to be.]

auto

Another great post. I'm really enjoying your comments in this thread.

Especially this part:
Not sure why I find that so funny.

superdeluxe

Damnit.

superdeluxe

Wasn't the original Earphoria like a promotional album? Then it Came out for purchase much later down the road?

edit: Oh and I am totally with the other guy, I really enjoy your long comments on the pumpkins .

superdeluxe

Oh, and which one of you post at blamo or netphoria.

I know I can not be the only one.

superdeluxe

Ok, Please do that, I would actually really love to see that. I do agree that there is some empty spots on MCIS, and that some of the TAFH songs would do MCIS much more justice than others.

superdeluxe

YARGH.

Now we have the glorious epic album, yes, maybe everything doesn't work like Siamese Dream did, but this would be like faulting a Dog that is speaking english, for mispronouncing the words. Who cares about the words...the DOG is speaking.

Thats what I think of MCIS, yes it has some filler, but even though it has filler, it can not take away from just the awesomeness of the project. 60-70 songs in the MCIS era? And a good 20-28 of them could have been hits on their own right. Seriously, he could have split 3-4 great songs, put in 7-8 filler songs, and have enough material for 4-6 studio albums.

This album is THAT good.

The 'Hits': Tonight, 1979, BWBW, Zero

The softer songs: 33, galapogos, By Starlight

Fierce Rockers: Boys fear to tread, XYU, Bodies, Ode to No one

EPIC track: Porcelina.

I love this album.

When you have those questions of what one album from what one band would you take, I select MCIS over SD. Yeah I think SD works 13 out of 13...and while MCIS doesn't work 28 out of 28. It works about 20 out of 28, so It would be my choice.

PopcornTreeCt

I'm going to see them tomorrow night!!!

My favorite album is Siamese Dream. I listen to it on loop quite a bit.

superdeluxe

Popcorn, I hope you have a great time!!

I am hearing that the band is sounding as good as they have since the arising shows.

brokenhanger

Technically, yes. Around the same time as "Pisces Iscariot" - maybe even the same day? I don't remember exactly - "Vieuphoria" was released on VHS to the general public. At the same time, a promotional CD - "Earphoria", the soundtrack to "Vieuphoria" [their words not mine] - was put out...limited to 2000 copies I believe. Anyways, it quickly became the hottest Smashing Pumpkins bootleg, a bit ironic considering "Vieuphoria" was touted as an official Smashing Pumpkins bootleg on the back of the packaging. Anyways, when "Vieuphoria" finally came out on DVD around the same time as the Greatest Hits album, "Earphoria" got a commercial release.

However, considering it was relatively widely available even as a promo - through trading, bootlegging, or even making a cassette copy of the audio from the VHS as myself and I'm sure many others did - and given how nicely it encapsulates the band leading up to that point in time, I would've put it prior to "MCIS" in the discussion. If we're gonna wait, that's fine too - it'll be a nice palette cleanser after the wreck that was "MACHINA"...but we'll get there.