TripWire

Billy's not over it, so why should we be..we want the pumpkins back and so does he. I think he does better when he has something to prove to other band members, pumpkins was really him soloing and being in command also, but the pressure of other band members i think brought the best out of him.

I listen to the solo album off and on, and I like a good amount of songs, I guess I don't like the sonic direction of it really with the guitars...rather than riffs it's more just like chord noise..but whatever...the solo album does have its merits, and I didn't get why he didn't use more live drumming, just cause it's a solo album doesn't mean you always have to resort to a drum machine.

SpaceBoy

On the boston news up here, they just had Corgan in the Red Sox players locker rooms. He was playing guitar and Bronson Arroyo was singing Disarm. Man Arroyo had a terrible voice, Corgan was just joking around in town for the show tomorrow it appears.

Grimfarrow

Why do you want the Pumpkins back? When they disbanded, their sales were slumping, fars were becoming disinterested, and members within the band wanted to move on to other things (especially Melissa and James). It was obvious the band had to end.

Face it - even if they reform, it will still be a shade of itself back in the 90's. And the last thing I want them to be is like the Rolling Stones - continuously touring while playing the same old songs, over and over.

The band died when it had to end. To start resurrecting it now is just plain voodoo exorcism, because it will never be like it was before.

cdollaz

Have you heard the solo album? The answer lies within.

Grimfarrow

Ahemmm.... Just a few posts above:

"Glad *someone* is talking about the solo album! I really don't understand why people are so negative toward it. While it isn't "Adore" or "Siamese Dream", it still is a perfectly good album. Both Mina Loy and The Camera eye are fantastic, and I also like DIA, Walking Shade and Now and Then.

Frankly, I'd rather hear more of Billy's solo direction rather than a Pumpkins reunion. The Pumpkins are over. Get on with it."

TripWire

I think because the later Pumpkins stuff he was trying to bring in the more electronic digital guitar sound towards the end that he is implementing into his solo stuff, more straightforward, less art rock. I think he wants to get back to that in some way. Pumpkins were getting more and more his solo vision over time. I would want them to come back with James and D'arcy though, but I doubt that would happen.

I watched Corgan on Letterman, and I saw he was dressed up in some black militant uniform with a beret, and then with the video he is wearing a top hat, tonight tonight getup..I thought he wanted to get away from costumes and image

[QUOTE=Grimfarrow]Why do you want the Pumpkins back? When they disbanded, their sales were slumping, fars were becoming disinterested, and members within the band wanted to move on to other things (especially Melissa and James). It was obvious the band had to end.

cdollaz

OK, I'll translate...

The new stuff sound like shit. We want some good music from Corgan again.

Flashback

That should have been funny. When I met Corgan a few years ago David Wells (NYY's at the time) was with him in Chicago. Cool to see that they may still hang together.

Grimfarrow

Translate this:

A. The new stuff sound like shit...TO YOU. Not to everyone.
B. You think that if he reforms to Pumpkins, the music will be magically "better"?! Hah! Good luck.

SpaceBoy

Just got back from the corgan @ avalon show. I must say I'm way letdown.

I actually like the album a bit, not my favorite disc, but think there are a few solid songs and the rest are "ok", and only a few clunkers.

I got there an hour after the showtime and the 2nd, YES 2nd opening band was still going. Who knew there were 2 openers, I was glad to have got there so late, because the one I caught sounded like a college band. The opener ended and Corgan came out promptly about 30 minutes later.. Not to bad I figure, most artists make you wait and expected him to come out at 9, instead of 8:30.

From there, Corgan stood mid-stage with Strawberry in the background, some electric drummer, and some keyboard guy I take it. I couldn't really tell if he was playing keyboard or not, he had a 20" imac next to him, and joked that he was simply playing the songs off itunes or something.

Played the entire album, and a few covers, yet the show only went a little over an hour by my guessestimate. After each song, Corgan quickly switched guitars, without even a blink, or gesture to the crowd. He only spoke to the crowd at one point, and that was to say he had nothing to say. WTF. There were a few times he waved or whatever to the crowd but overall seemed quite bored, and going through the motions. The audience seemed to be doing the same. Only the first 2 rows had any energy, and most of that was people fumbling with their cell phone cameras to take pictures. Saw maybe a handfull actually singing to the music, and many more standing at the bar with the back to the band.

The computer screen part was pretty cool, and there was a little extra guitar added here and there, but overall a very dull show. The most exciting part, and most energy of the whole show was when during one song, mid song he switched and he played the opening riff to Today, the whole crowd went nuts... until he quickly switched back out of it, and people faded back away.

I recommend skipping this one if you haven't gotten your tix yet, or if your'e really into Corgan, as I was, go. I will say I saw several people trying to dump tix at 15 a piece instead of the 30 something they cost, unsuccessfully, so might be possible to pick up tix to the show on the cheap.

Take my review for what it's worth, I hope you have a better time, or show then I had. I'm happy I went, but wouldn't prob do it again, unless I got free tix.

cdollaz

1. Not to everyone, but to most.
2. Yes, it will be magically better.

lostatmidnight

You're allowing nostalgia to taint reality, creating this idyllic notion of the past and what the Pumpkins represented. I have no idea how old you were then and now, but this was not a band with a great personal dynamic, this band for the most part was a vanity project for the megalomaniac Corgan, a man who simply surrounded himself with other hack musicians (Iha, D'Arcy) to displace blame for his failures...

The Pumpkins are dead, have been for a long time, Corgan himself and all his other blinded devotees need to get on with their lives and understand they left a great musical and artistic legacy...

I enjoy this solo album, I think its quite good, nothing great, nothing as profound as Siamese or Mellon Collie, because as a solo artist, I don't think Corgan has the defenses of a band to strip himself away, to fully explore his creativity, to risk his own failures because he has no one to hide behind and blame...A band for him seems to be a drug, brings out great creativity but acts also as a safety blanket.

Just like the Pumpkins, Zwan itself was an utter failure in band dynamics, all this ego-indie guys/gals with an equally big ego and successful leader in Corgan...In a way, a micro-cosmo of the Pumpkins.

Simply put, Get over it.

cdollaz

God, where to begin. I'll leave it at this: Corgan obviously isnt' "over it" and doesn't consider SP dead based on his recent statements, SO WHY THE HELL SHOULD WE??????????? Damn, is it that hard to understand.

Grimfarrow

To steer the convo back a bit, I just came back from the Billy Corgan concert in Toronto. Unlike SpaceBoy's experience, I really enjoyed the show. Billy has NEVER sounded better - he was totally on-key on every song, which is really impressive. Also the space-agey backdrop was very cool!

In fact, he was much better than the first Pumpkins concert I went to, in which he couldn't sing on-key to save his life and spent too much time with overly long, incoherent guitar jams that went on ad infinitum. But that was the only bad concert of the Pumpkins I went to - the rest were fantastic.

Highlights were the brilliant "The Camera Eye", "Mina Loy" and "A100". Those just plain rocked! So did the guitar solos during "To Love Somebody". Great stuff. Plus, Billy seemed to be in a good mood - so much so that he couldn't stop laughing for at least 2 minutes during a song. At the end he even stayed behind to shake people's hands and thanked us all for being a fantastic crowd.

The low-point - "Pretty, Pretty STAR". The worst song on the album, even worse live. There was an utter deadening effect during this song. And the cheesy "star" effect at the back was just plain wrong.

So a very good show overall, but not without its fault. Kinda like the album, really. 7/10.

mdc3000

I saw him live and agree with the poster a few posts up, big letdown... although Corgan was a bit more talkative "this is the part where you yell stupid stuff out" and everyone shouts their favourite pumpkins song, to no avail, and then in a guitar solo during the encore, he teased us all with the first bar of "Today" and then proceeded to play the song he was in the middle of... just a dull show, but the girl was smoking hot!

MATT