Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

The character was a navel officer and British Secret Service agent. At that time in England those people were white men. The character was written as it was because anything else would have been a flight of fantasy.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

One thing to consider in some of the cultural arguments is that as time progresses (and the time period of the Bond movies does also), the period where Bond was in the navy and such will also advance, making diversity more feasible. The ancestral estate aspect could be jettisoned without too much backlash, I'd suppose.

I don't want to see them force diversity into the equation just for the sake of political correctness, but if someone fits the bill but isn't strictly Caucasian, I don't have a problem with stretching the character a bit. To me, it's worth the risk of triggering a bunch of bigots if you have a good actor to put forth, but not if you're just trying to shove it in people's faces.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

The reality is that a black Bond with the exact same background wouldn't be believable for probabaly another 50 years. In 2020 or even 2030 there won't be anyone of that background in the black community in the UK. Not the exact background. There would still be significant cultural differences that such a person would experience in their lifetime, making it a different character with different attitudes than what has been written on the page and put on the movie screen.

Again, it's not fair and it's not right, but it is the way it is. Bond isn't supposed to be some social justice fantasy. It's supposed to have some basis in reality, and then stretched from there. If the whole thing is a fantasy then the movies won't have the same weight.

Like I said, in 40 or 50 years it probably will be a moot point and a black Bond will probably work then. But we're not there yet and we can't change reality to force the issue, no matter what filmmakers and movie fans may wish.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

And Elba fits that defintion.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

If you're willing to change the background and life experiences of Bond.

At this point in history, that's the reality. It sucks, but that's the way it is.

I prefer continuity. At this point, with so many great actors who look he part, casting someone like Elba would either be a move to be politically correct, or a bit of stunt casting. Or maybe a little of both.

But it wouldn't be the same Bond, and that would be a shame. This has been a series with a tremendous history, and it would be a shame to blow that up going forward.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Is your position that the James Bond origin story has been consistent and unchanged? :lol: :lol:

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Given we're talking about the movies it's even funnier. :lol:

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

The basics? Yes.

Bond was largely unchanged from 1962 through 1989. It was CLEARLY the same character. Why I have to keep re-posting this to prove that point, I don't know, but a lot of the anti-continuity people seem to ignore the facts...

George Lazenby's Bond got married to Tracy. She was killed at the end of that movie. Sean Connery's Bond was still hurting and enraged by her death, and went after Blofeld for revenge. Roger Moore's Bond visited Tracy's gravesite, clearly still saddened by her loss. Timothy Dalton's Bond STILL wasn't completely over her loss when Felix Leiter got married in Licence To Kill.

Same guy, obviously.

Now, soft reboot in 1995 when Pierce Brosnan took over. He was too young to have done that Bond stuff in the 1960's or 1970's, so they kept the character, and just shifted him forward to a new era. Same basic character, but before he was married.

The hard reboot came when Daniel Craig took over. He was clearly too young to have been fighting the Cold War, so they went back and portrayed a James Bond at the beginning of his 00 career, but just shifted the timeline forward again. Same basic character, same basic background, different era.

Now if you recast with Elba or any black actor it can't be the same basic character with the same basic background. Sure, he could have some of those things in common, but ask any black man in the UK if they live the same life as an upper class white family and they'll tell you, "No."

Someone previously posted how Bond reeks of white privilege. While I think the, "White privilege," tag is overused (sometimes it fits, sometimes it doesn't), it definitely fits with Bond. A black man cannot have experienced white privilege, so that part of Bond's character would be long gone (just part of what would make him a different character).

Like I said, in another 40 or 50 years society will likely have gotten to a point where you could have a black man play Bond and have life experiences close enough to what classic Bond experienced to make such casting work. But not now. It isn't fair, it isn't right, but it is what it is.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

I brought up the white privilege. I won't go as far as saying Bond is a snob, but he does have an attitude. Bond would never buy a suit off the rack, drink wine that wasn't the best, eat at a chain restaurant, etc. because to him it is socially unacceptable. "It just isn't done".
Bond is just a civil servant. He affords his lifestyle by supplementing his income with gambling. If you observe his interactions with waiters, valets, hotel and casino employees, it's not your average customer/business relationship, to Bond it's a superior to an inferior relationship. This comes from his upbringing not his current status, he's just a civil servant.

In THE MAN WITH THE GOLDEN GUN after the gold bullet arrives at MI-6, Bond and M are discussing who would pay a $1,000,000 to Scaramanga to have Bond killed.
Can't remember the exact line but M says, "Insulted tailors, abused waiters and jealous husbands."

It's a type of social bigotry based on class instead of economics. Paul McCartney could be ten times wealthier than the Duke of Whatever, the second cousin of the Earl of Whatis, board members of the Bank of England, and still socially inferior because of his origins.
In Bond's past he acquired an attitude of "the person who prepares the food is inferior to the person who eats it."

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

I agree. I always reflect on a story Terry Gilliam tells about how Nike insisted he put black baseball players into a tv commercial that was themed around 1920’s baseball. He was like, “That is blatantly misrepresenting history.” Nike won.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

One of my concerns is the potential staleness if they just go with another white guy. That might be overreacting given that I felt Daniel Craig injected a bit of fresh air into the series, but part of that was also the reboot aspect that took us back to the beginning of Bond's spy career.

Part of it also is that most of the white guy names put forth tend to bore me when imagining them as Bond. One good thing about the series is how they changed up the actors well, going from suave and buff Connery to campier and slimmer Moore, then to more rugged Dalton, then to slim and suave Brosnan, and finally to tougher and rougher Craig. Some of that was catering to the changing culture and taste, of course (e.g. Craig's Bond years roughly coinciding with the Bourne movies), but that alternating history implies the next Bond would likely be less physical and more cerebral.

I always took Bond's swagger to be more about machismo than white privilege, a projection and exaggeration of male confidence in the face of potential danger.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

It was white privilege. Bond is, for example, a wine expert, knowledgeable in most of the snooty, snobby stuff that the upper crust obsesses on as signs of their superiority to everyone else. Bond shares those attitudes.

Changing the essence of who Bond is would be a mistake. It would turn the Bond series into just another spy/action series.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

He’s a gentleman spy. In the ‘60s “gentleman” meant knowledge and mastery of many skills. He’s a wine connoisseur, but also a skilled driver, horseman, and skier. It’s what helps him go undercover with all the wealthy mega-criminals.

These days you’d be shocked how many wealthy gentlemen don’t know how to ski, or aren’t certified to dive; they can’t even pilot their own yacht.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

There was a time when the concern about James Bond was that he was a political dinosaur. That after the Cold War ended the reality of a British Secret agent fighting international boogie men was no longer necessary or believable. The Brosnan era found some smart ways to keep him relevant during this period.

Now it seems that James Bond is becoming a dinosaur for social reasons. Society once regarded the virtues of a gentleman as a good thing. Fine dress and impeccable tastes, as well as diverse skills, were good things. Now people view it as “snobbish”. You see that word right here in this thread. That is the problem at the root of this I think. All the things that made Bond cool are now things we generally count as negatives. Drinking, smoking, conspicuous consumption, a strong golf game, skiing, sport diving; the finer things are all scorned these days.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

I'd rather the Bond films be set in the 1950s/60s, keep them as smart period pieces with moments of fantastical flourish, and call it a day.

A knife in a shoe was novelty in 1963.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Why not go off book and introduce other diverse 00's in these recent films and then they can choose to pass the mantle to one of them?

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Without those upper crust, high society aspects of his character he's no different than Ethan Hunt or Jason Bourne and has no reason to exist.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

It would make far more sense than the current day settings and having a bunch of fans think they should continue to act like the character can have the same early 20th century backstory.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Bring back Pierce Brosnan and call it a day. Why can't a man in his 60s be James Bond?

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

So in your opinion the series has only lasted and is still going because Bond is an upper class white guy and no other reason? Take away the white and he's "just another spy"?

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Michael B Jordan

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

I've seen Jordan mentioned a couple times. Has he ever done work with an English accent?

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

No, take away the class snobbery and privilege and he's just another spy.

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Now here's a casting that I think everyone can get behind.

https://thehardtimes.net/harddrive/s...ck-james-bond/

:lol:

Re: Who would you like to see become the next James Bond?
 

Does anyone else want to see a Bond film epilogue that ignores the events of SPECTRE and instead shows a toxic, irradiated, superpower Blofeld emerge from the nuclear plant he was dumped into by Bond at the opening of "For Your Eyes Only"?

No? Oh...

(You could even cut to Bond running a delicatessen on the Lower East Side...)