Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
#101
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Yep Disney gets culture right, loved the chancla in Coco, while not Mexican I am Hispanic and got a kick out of all the little touches.
#102
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
For those that liked this film how can you look past the horrible story dynamics? It takes FOREVER for Moana to finally leave the island. Twice the narrative is completely restated through dialogue. It’s the clunkiest narrative I’ve ever seen.
It’s funny and has good songs but the story, the manner in which it’s told, flat out sucks.
It’s funny and has good songs but the story, the manner in which it’s told, flat out sucks.
#103
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
For those that liked this film how can you look past the horrible story dynamics? It takes FOREVER for Moana to finally leave the island. Twice the narrative is completely restated through dialogue. It’s the clunkiest narrative I’ve ever seen.
It’s funny and has good songs but the story, the manner in which it’s told, flat out sucks.
It’s funny and has good songs but the story, the manner in which it’s told, flat out sucks.
#104
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
My biggest issue is that Moana has one animal sidekick that was completely abandoned for another animal sidekick about 1/3 of the way into the movie.
#105
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From: Somewhere between Heaven and Hell
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
I want a the copy of this that's done in Hawaiian. I'll have to order it from somewhere.
#106
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Maybe I don't notice things like that. And taking a while to leave the island is part of the story. They've isolated themselves for generations, it's not like they have taxi boats leaving out on a regular basis. Her trying to figure out what to do and how to do it is part of her story. Learning to be more than what she's been so far.
And things like the Kooko Mora. They are brilliantly designed. I like the way they look and their boat and everything. But that’s it. They pop up once and then never return to the story again. It’s a completely unnecessary story digression.
#108
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From: "Are any of us really anywhere?"
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
i still love this movie and it definitely ranks up there. The Rock and girl who voiced Moana were great. this was just a sublime Disney adventure. Had a lot of fun. And the 3D Blu is great...
#109
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Wow yeah you've been missing out. Disney+?
I think the main thing that separates Disney from it's competition is the research that goes into their movies. Since the very beginning when Disney was bringing in live animals for his animators to study they've gone above and beyond to portray their stories in a background of realism and in this case culture. They just nail polynesian culture from the essence of the story to the environments. The music is incredible as well and they don't shy away from using different languages along side English. Just an incredible movie from beginning to end.
I think the main thing that separates Disney from it's competition is the research that goes into their movies. Since the very beginning when Disney was bringing in live animals for his animators to study they've gone above and beyond to portray their stories in a background of realism and in this case culture. They just nail polynesian culture from the essence of the story to the environments. The music is incredible as well and they don't shy away from using different languages along side English. Just an incredible movie from beginning to end.
#110
DVD Talk God
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
I just want to chime in to say that I love that this thread becoming active again is a positive side effect of Disney+ being available. I wholeheartedly approve of other threads becoming active again as people get around to discovering or rewatching certain films that they have not seen in a long time on Disney+. Disney+ might bring a bit more active energy to this board and this thread bump beats the creation of another junk have you ever left a message board thread that got shut down a short while ago.
Taking my own advice later this morning I may search out and bump a Boy Meets World thread (if such a thread exists, maybe I will just bump the Girl Meets World thread) as I am rewatching the series from the beginning and had forgot how wonderful it is.
ETA: It turns out there are a lot of BMW threads to choose from, cool. Will get around to bumping one of them soon.
Taking my own advice later this morning I may search out and bump a Boy Meets World thread (if such a thread exists, maybe I will just bump the Girl Meets World thread) as I am rewatching the series from the beginning and had forgot how wonderful it is.
ETA: It turns out there are a lot of BMW threads to choose from, cool. Will get around to bumping one of them soon.
#111
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From: Somewhere between Heaven and Hell
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
No, you don’t get it. We all know she’s going to leave. The audience knows. More than that we know she’s going to leave in a boat. There’s literally nothing else that could happen. So having multiple false starts just belabors the already understood premise. Get the show on the road. It’s crap writing.
#112
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Yes, but in the case of Moana the journey doesn’t get going soon enough. The script doesn’t get the show on the road.
It’s not what the story is, it’s how you go about it. Sure a WWII film, we all know there’s going to be a battle, but how do you go about it? There are effective ways and ineffective ways.
It’s not what the story is, it’s how you go about it. Sure a WWII film, we all know there’s going to be a battle, but how do you go about it? There are effective ways and ineffective ways.
#113
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Yeah, I don't get the complaint, other than it didn't resonate with him this time. Personally, I liked seeing the dynamic between her and her island, prior to leaving everything she's ever known and going on a wild adventure.
#114
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
I am curious what Mabuse holds as the gold standard of great plot movement in terms of Disney animated movies. You could probably make the same complaint about most of them, Miyazaki movies as well, if you just want constant plot movement.
#115
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Another weakness: The movie has to tell us everything. Everything is explained through dialogue. Name one thing that we learn visually or infer from a gesture. It starts with all this complicated exposition about the gods and Maui and Tefiti and everything, then we’re told repeatedly (way more times than is necessary) that they are forbidden to leave the island. At the end of the second act when Moana has her crisis and believes she can’t go on we are treated to a long dialogue scene with the ghost of grandma where all the themes are restated AGAIN. Everything Maui does is accompanied by constant explanation of what he’s doing. There’s way too much dialogue.
#116
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Even the rooster doesn't really play a big part. Both are there to sell merchandise and for the princess joke.
I am curious what Mabuse holds as the gold standard of great plot movement in terms of Disney animated movies. You could probably make the same complaint about most of them, Miyazaki movies as well, if you just want constant plot movement.
I am curious what Mabuse holds as the gold standard of great plot movement in terms of Disney animated movies. You could probably make the same complaint about most of them, Miyazaki movies as well, if you just want constant plot movement.
I’d say Finding Nemo is a pretty near perfect script. You know the title so you know what’s going to happen. Nemo gets lost and Marlin immediately begins his quest to find him. We don’t see scenes where he hesitates and expresses his fear of leaving the reef. We get to that despondent and hesitant stuff later in the midst of the journey. Deal with your issues while you’re on the road. Get going.
And since you bring it up, yeah Miyazaki’s Spirited Away is not one of my favorites of his because it suffers from the same thing I said about Moana; an over abundance of explanation. Every character she meets is constantly explaining itself. Contrast that with Totorro which never explains anything and is magical.
#117
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
I’d say Finding Nemo is a pretty near perfect script. You know the title so you know what’s going to happen. Nemo gets lost and Marlin immediately begins his quest to find him. We don’t see scenes where he expresses his fear of leaving the reef. We get to that despondent and hesitant stuff later in the midst of the journey. Deal with your issues while you’re on the road. Get going.
And since you bring it up, yeah Miyazaki’s Spirited Away is not one of my favorites of his because it suffers from the same thing I said about Moana; an over abundance of explanation. Every character she meets is constantly explaining itself. Contrast that with Totorro which never explains anything and is magical.
#118
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Something new is constantly happening in Totorro. They’re just smaller things because the film’s scope is less epic. But the girls keep making amazing discoveries and there’s little moments of suspense and mystery that keep you engaged.
#119
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
So I think part of the problem is the development hell most Disney animated films go through... IIRC they had to bring on like story consultants to work on some problems almost at the end of production.
That being said, I never thought the movie was too wordy. Granted, I haven't rewatched it recently so I don't remember all the details. The exposition at the beginning is a lot but they had to get that backstory in there. Being trapped on the island made sense, she tries multiple times to leave on her own and can't, and then Grandma reveals the true history of their people, which provides the boat, and then both the blight and the death of grandma gives her the impetus to finally leave. Her second crisis is similar, everything has gone wrong, Maui is gone, and she needs to find the courage to fulfill her destiny and not wait for someone else to do it.
I do think the musical aspect of it, as well as the need to feature the Rock's character, takes a lot of time in the movie, so I can understand why plot-wise it's probably not the strongest movie, but it was still enjoyable to me (and my kids, who were never bored).
That being said, I never thought the movie was too wordy. Granted, I haven't rewatched it recently so I don't remember all the details. The exposition at the beginning is a lot but they had to get that backstory in there. Being trapped on the island made sense, she tries multiple times to leave on her own and can't, and then Grandma reveals the true history of their people, which provides the boat, and then both the blight and the death of grandma gives her the impetus to finally leave. Her second crisis is similar, everything has gone wrong, Maui is gone, and she needs to find the courage to fulfill her destiny and not wait for someone else to do it.
I do think the musical aspect of it, as well as the need to feature the Rock's character, takes a lot of time in the movie, so I can understand why plot-wise it's probably not the strongest movie, but it was still enjoyable to me (and my kids, who were never bored).
#120
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From: Conducting miss-aisle drills and listening to their rock n roll
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Her second crisis is similar, everything has gone wrong, Maui is gone, and she needs to find the courage to fulfill her destiny and not wait for someone else to do it.
And yeah, the movie had 5 credited story writers and 1 credited screenwriter, and almost certainly many more who didn’t get credit. It’s ridiculous.
#121
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
I'll take Moana over Finding Nemo any day of the week.
#123
Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)
Other than maybe Cars 2 Finding Nemo is my least favorite Pixar film I've seen.
#125




