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Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

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Old 11-18-19 | 02:32 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Yep Disney gets culture right, loved the chancla in Coco, while not Mexican I am Hispanic and got a kick out of all the little touches.
Old 11-18-19 | 09:25 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

For those that liked this film how can you look past the horrible story dynamics? It takes FOREVER for Moana to finally leave the island. Twice the narrative is completely restated through dialogue. It’s the clunkiest narrative I’ve ever seen.

It’s funny and has good songs but the story, the manner in which it’s told, flat out sucks.
Old 11-18-19 | 04:32 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by Mabuse
For those that liked this film how can you look past the horrible story dynamics? It takes FOREVER for Moana to finally leave the island. Twice the narrative is completely restated through dialogue. It’s the clunkiest narrative I’ve ever seen.

It’s funny and has good songs but the story, the manner in which it’s told, flat out sucks.
Maybe I don't notice things like that. And taking a while to leave the island is part of the story. They've isolated themselves for generations, it's not like they have taxi boats leaving out on a regular basis. Her trying to figure out what to do and how to do it is part of her story. Learning to be more than what she's been so far.
Old 11-18-19 | 06:15 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

My biggest issue is that Moana has one animal sidekick that was completely abandoned for another animal sidekick about 1/3 of the way into the movie.
Old 11-18-19 | 07:08 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

I want a the copy of this that's done in Hawaiian. I'll have to order it from somewhere.
Old 11-18-19 | 07:34 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by GoldenJCJ
My biggest issue is that Moana has one animal sidekick that was completely abandoned for another animal sidekick about 1/3 of the way into the movie.
That was a shame cause the pig was adorable and the roost just annoying.
Old 11-18-19 | 07:59 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by milo bloom
Maybe I don't notice things like that. And taking a while to leave the island is part of the story. They've isolated themselves for generations, it's not like they have taxi boats leaving out on a regular basis. Her trying to figure out what to do and how to do it is part of her story. Learning to be more than what she's been so far.
No, you don’t get it. We all know she’s going to leave. The audience knows. More than that we know she’s going to leave in a boat. There’s literally nothing else that could happen. So having multiple false starts just belabors the already understood premise. Get the show on the road. It’s crap writing.

And things like the Kooko Mora. They are brilliantly designed. I like the way they look and their boat and everything. But that’s it. They pop up once and then never return to the story again. It’s a completely unnecessary story digression.
Old 11-18-19 | 09:29 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

i still love this movie and it definitely ranks up there. The Rock and girl who voiced Moana were great. this was just a sublime Disney adventure. Had a lot of fun. And the 3D Blu is great...
Old 11-18-19 | 11:06 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by tanman
Wow yeah you've been missing out. Disney+?

I think the main thing that separates Disney from it's competition is the research that goes into their movies. Since the very beginning when Disney was bringing in live animals for his animators to study they've gone above and beyond to portray their stories in a background of realism and in this case culture. They just nail polynesian culture from the essence of the story to the environments. The music is incredible as well and they don't shy away from using different languages along side English. Just an incredible movie from beginning to end.
Yep. This is the first Disney film I've seen since Inside Out. I went through a 3-4 year period of not watching movies so I'm just now catching up.
Old 11-19-19 | 03:02 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

I just want to chime in to say that I love that this thread becoming active again is a positive side effect of Disney+ being available. I wholeheartedly approve of other threads becoming active again as people get around to discovering or rewatching certain films that they have not seen in a long time on Disney+. Disney+ might bring a bit more active energy to this board and this thread bump beats the creation of another junk have you ever left a message board thread that got shut down a short while ago.

Taking my own advice later this morning I may search out and bump a Boy Meets World thread (if such a thread exists, maybe I will just bump the Girl Meets World thread) as I am rewatching the series from the beginning and had forgot how wonderful it is.

ETA: It turns out there are a lot of BMW threads to choose from, cool. Will get around to bumping one of them soon.
Old 11-19-19 | 10:43 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by Mabuse
No, you don’t get it. We all know she’s going to leave. The audience knows. More than that we know she’s going to leave in a boat. There’s literally nothing else that could happen. So having multiple false starts just belabors the already understood premise. Get the show on the road. It’s crap writing.
So it's the same as sports films... or most superhero films... or WWII films... or biopics. The outcome is inevitable. Does it still make the journey any less entertaining knowing the outcome?
Old 11-19-19 | 11:28 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Yes, but in the case of Moana the journey doesn’t get going soon enough. The script doesn’t get the show on the road.

It’s not what the story is, it’s how you go about it. Sure a WWII film, we all know there’s going to be a battle, but how do you go about it? There are effective ways and ineffective ways.
Old 11-19-19 | 11:30 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by devilshalo
So it's the same as sports films... or most superhero films... or WWII films... or biopics. The outcome is inevitable. Does it still make the journey any less entertaining knowing the outcome?
Yeah, I don't get the complaint, other than it didn't resonate with him this time. Personally, I liked seeing the dynamic between her and her island, prior to leaving everything she's ever known and going on a wild adventure.
Old 11-19-19 | 11:35 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by GoldenJCJ
My biggest issue is that Moana has one animal sidekick that was completely abandoned for another animal sidekick about 1/3 of the way into the movie.
Even the rooster doesn't really play a big part. Both are there to sell merchandise and for the princess joke.

I am curious what Mabuse holds as the gold standard of great plot movement in terms of Disney animated movies. You could probably make the same complaint about most of them, Miyazaki movies as well, if you just want constant plot movement.
Old 11-19-19 | 11:40 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Another weakness: The movie has to tell us everything. Everything is explained through dialogue. Name one thing that we learn visually or infer from a gesture. It starts with all this complicated exposition about the gods and Maui and Tefiti and everything, then we’re told repeatedly (way more times than is necessary) that they are forbidden to leave the island. At the end of the second act when Moana has her crisis and believes she can’t go on we are treated to a long dialogue scene with the ghost of grandma where all the themes are restated AGAIN. Everything Maui does is accompanied by constant explanation of what he’s doing. There’s way too much dialogue.
Old 11-19-19 | 11:47 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by fujishig
Even the rooster doesn't really play a big part. Both are there to sell merchandise and for the princess joke.

I am curious what Mabuse holds as the gold standard of great plot movement in terms of Disney animated movies. You could probably make the same complaint about most of them, Miyazaki movies as well, if you just want constant plot movement.

I’d say Finding Nemo is a pretty near perfect script. You know the title so you know what’s going to happen. Nemo gets lost and Marlin immediately begins his quest to find him. We don’t see scenes where he hesitates and expresses his fear of leaving the reef. We get to that despondent and hesitant stuff later in the midst of the journey. Deal with your issues while you’re on the road. Get going.

And since you bring it up, yeah Miyazaki’s Spirited Away is not one of my favorites of his because it suffers from the same thing I said about Moana; an over abundance of explanation. Every character she meets is constantly explaining itself. Contrast that with Totorro which never explains anything and is magical.
Old 11-19-19 | 11:49 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by Mabuse



I’d say Finding Nemo is a pretty near perfect script. You know the title so you know what’s going to happen. Nemo gets lost and Marlin immediately begins his quest to find him. We don’t see scenes where he expresses his fear of leaving the reef. We get to that despondent and hesitant stuff later in the midst of the journey. Deal with your issues while you’re on the road. Get going.

And since you bring it up, yeah Miyazaki’s Spirited Away is not one of my favorites of his because it suffers from the same thing I said about Moana; an over abundance of explanation. Every character she meets is constantly explaining itself. Contrast that with Totorro which never explains anything and is magical.
Actually I was thinking of Totoro... you could argue that very little plot-wise happens in that movie, but as you say it's full of charm/magic.
Old 11-19-19 | 11:54 AM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Something new is constantly happening in Totorro. They’re just smaller things because the film’s scope is less epic. But the girls keep making amazing discoveries and there’s little moments of suspense and mystery that keep you engaged.
Old 11-19-19 | 12:02 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

So I think part of the problem is the development hell most Disney animated films go through... IIRC they had to bring on like story consultants to work on some problems almost at the end of production.

That being said, I never thought the movie was too wordy. Granted, I haven't rewatched it recently so I don't remember all the details. The exposition at the beginning is a lot but they had to get that backstory in there. Being trapped on the island made sense, she tries multiple times to leave on her own and can't, and then Grandma reveals the true history of their people, which provides the boat, and then both the blight and the death of grandma gives her the impetus to finally leave. Her second crisis is similar, everything has gone wrong, Maui is gone, and she needs to find the courage to fulfill her destiny and not wait for someone else to do it.

I do think the musical aspect of it, as well as the need to feature the Rock's character, takes a lot of time in the movie, so I can understand why plot-wise it's probably not the strongest movie, but it was still enjoyable to me (and my kids, who were never bored).
Old 11-19-19 | 01:06 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Her second crisis is similar, everything has gone wrong, Maui is gone, and she needs to find the courage to fulfill her destiny and not wait for someone else to do it.
That could be accomplished with her simply looking at the stars, or the ocean, or the stars reflected in the ocean. Perhaps a single whispered word. Instead the grandma physically appears and a whole summation of the plot occurs.

And yeah, the movie had 5 credited story writers and 1 credited screenwriter, and almost certainly many more who didn’t get credit. It’s ridiculous.
Old 11-19-19 | 02:32 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

I'll take Moana over Finding Nemo any day of the week.
Old 11-19-19 | 02:34 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Old 11-19-19 | 03:31 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Other than maybe Cars 2 Finding Nemo is my least favorite Pixar film I've seen.
Old 11-19-19 | 03:54 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

It’s 99% on rotten tomatoes. It’s a very good movie.

I hope your not confusing it with the sequel.
Old 11-19-19 | 04:18 PM
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Re: Disney's Moana (2016 - Musker & Clement)

Originally Posted by Mabuse
It’s 99% on rotten tomatoes. It’s a very good movie.

I hope your not confusing it with the sequel.
I've never seen the sequel.


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