Which is why I used the term followers.

ITA. I also think it's appropriate to factor in why and how he possibly died as well.

Ok, yeesh, I don't want to derail this thread any further, but:

Westboro not real Christians? I think they're the perfect example, and I can't refrain from saying it forever.

Somebody ask Mike Huckabee what he thinks of Brokeback. Or ask Pat Robertson, or the minister at your typical mega-church. Ask them if Heath and Jake were sinning by starring in this film. Their opinions will be merely a polite version of the same rhetoric: gay "tolerance" is destroying our culture, think of the children, etc...

Westboro is the natural extension of evangelical Christianity's anti-gay scapegoating and hysteria. It's not an isolated island, it's just the visible tip of the iceberg.

As for their motives, sure they're motivated by greed and hate. Greed is an element of most churches, and hate an element of many. To claim WBC's beliefs aren't even sincere, however, is self-serving. You just don't want to believe religion can get this bad. Well, it can.

If anyone needs to respond in disagreement, let's keep it brief, and I'll try not to respond. This should be about Heath.

Wrong!

And this church does not speak for Jesus Christ. If Christ had met Heath Ledger he would have said 'Go, sin no more'. He would not have condemned him to Hell.

Chris

Hank Gathers had a heart condition, so he wasn't totally healthy.

Chris

Not going to put words in your mouth but he sinned by being in "Brokeback Mountain" or am I reading your post wrong?

I agree. As I posted earlier, the silence by other Christian leaders is deafening. How much can they speak up if they don't fully disagree.

(I hope that is brief enough)

I'll keep it very brief. WBC are not Christians just like terrorists are not muslins. They may wear the flag, but they don't practice the ideals.

It's a bit silly to think that if somebody doesn't denounce something, that they are giving it their approval. Sometimes, nothing needs to be said.

For example, I've seen no comment in this forum about the police in Zimbabwe gassing protesters. That must mean that everybody here agrees with their actions!

I would guess some of these crazy Christians would find anyone involved in Hollywood a sinner . . . right down to a PA, Grip or Electric . . .

See, everyone is looking at the small picture. A person is saved by their belief in Jesus Christ. A belief that by trusting in Him, that they will be reconciled with our Creator, His Father.

To say that someone is going to Hell, because they are gay or because they played a gay person is totally wrong. Fred Phelps for all we know could have had sex with other women other than his wife during his marriage, he could have molested his daughter, etc. But according to him, 'homosexuality' is the big sin. It is not.

It is just an easy way for him to feel comfortable with his 'sin', by being 'holier than thou'.

Jesus Christ did not preach hate, he preached love and he preached that the only true happiness in life is a personal relationship with Him. This is pleasing to His Father, our Creator.

I should have said, if Jesus Christ were to meet anyone of us in the street, he would say 'Go, sin no more'.

Hopefully I have made myself clear as to who Jesus Christ is. I know it's hard not to judge Christianity in a negative way based on idiots like Fred Phelps. I too want to give him and his followers a good beatdown (not Christ like, I know )

Chris

A Muslim terrorist is indeed still a Muslim, but not all Muslims are terrorists.

And not all Christians, which I am not by the way, are hate mongers.

As I said, just because you wear the badge doesn't make you a police officer.


Religion requires two things - belief and practice. If you believe in Jesus but practice the opposite of his teachings, then you aren't a Christian.

(Note to self: Terrorists are not finely-woven cotton fabrics. Check.)

Thanks for clearing that up!

Thank you.

It's brief enough. And kinda cute.

Heath and Jake got a lot of criticism from the pulpit for being in this film, and the film continues to be denounced to this day for its "sin" of treating gay love with respect and treating gay persecution as a human tragedy that affects everyone.

Check out the imdb boards: full of ignorant Christian haters, many of them immature kids mocking his death, some adults calming saying it's the wages of sin... In the words of Rogers & Hammerstein, you've got to be carefully taught how to hate like that. I wish I could go onto my usual BBM fan board today to talk about Heath, instead of one so crowded with bigots, but it's been blocked at work as being for "alternate lifestyles." Typical.

Good point. And IMO, the act of sweeping the issue under the rug by trying to say these people are not Christians is just as bad as the silence.

I know it's too much to ask but can we stop talking about the right extremists and gays?

Heath dead is really sad news. I liked him since "10 things I hate about you". I respected him a lot because he didn't go the easy way filming a lot of "easy" movies. Sure, not all of his movies were masterpieces, but they were films that he really believed in.


Rest in peace.

http://www.tmz.com/2008/01/23/the-pe...o-found-heath/

Chris

Hm... do you think she gives "happy endings"?

Exactly. Why would other Christian leaders be commenting on his death? He wasn't a religious figure.

Sure, I'll keep it brief. I find it amazing that you would like to continually pigeon-hole Christianity and Christians the same way you feel they have classified and disparaged you, when almost everyone on this board (and dare I say, the vast, vast majority) of Christians finds them disgusting on every level. If you want to keep slandering Christians and Christianity by judging them and lumping them in the most disgusting lunatic fringe possible then you are performing the exact same disrespect to us that you feel has been directed to you, making your stance horrifically hypocritical. That is the last I will say on this.

As far as Heath goes, may he finally find some peace for himself. The accounts and records I have been reading today sound like he was very troubled and I cannot imagine living with the stresses that he tolerated for so long. I remember stridently defending his selection as The Joker because I thought I saw a really deep dark side in him, and I guess that is unfortunately too true. Rest in Peace sir, I enjoyed your work and hope your family finds peace.

It feels surreal. So young and with such a promising career on the rise.
May he rest in peace.