Hellraiser question
10-30-06 | 10:56 AM
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From: The Janitor's closet in Kinnick Stadium
Hellraiser question
I saw Hellraiser I and II on AMC last week and have a question. Was uncle Frank a vampire? He stands in the door way when he meets Julia and keeps asking her if she will invite him in and doesn't come in until she says ok. And then the whole falling in love with him scenes kinda seemed like Julia was under his "spell" so to speak. I find it hard to believe that she falls in love with him and totally despises her husband so quickly after meeting him and goes to all the trouble of killing people so he will come back to life. Of course this could all be the result of really crappy writing like the rest of the movie.
Also if the Cenobites aren't from Hell where are they from? If they are from another deminsion how can they control someone coming back from the dead? Like in the whole floorboard/matress scenes?
Also if the Cenobites aren't from Hell where are they from? If they are from another deminsion how can they control someone coming back from the dead? Like in the whole floorboard/matress scenes?
10-30-06 | 01:32 PM
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Frank may have been a sick hedonistic bastard looking for the "next level" of pleasure/pain but he was not a vampire. Didn't Julia simply have her "dark side" awakened by Frank's presence?
The Cenobites -may- have little or no control of that...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellraiser
The Cenobites -may- have little or no control of that...
Originally Posted by wikipedia
Frank Cotton, an impulsive and violent man who has grown weary of the many pleasures available to him on Earth, searches for the legendary box, which he has heard can lead him to pleasure beyond any that Earth can provide. But too late, he realizes that the Cenobites' idea of sensuality may not be perfectly aligned with that of mortals, and that he has instead condemned himself to an eternity of torture. The only remnant of himself in the "real" world is the residue of his blood and flesh on the floorboards in his parent's house (which he took over).
Some time after Frank's disappearance, his brother Larry and his family move into his parent's old abandoned house, and a drop of blood from an accident causes Frank's body to begin regenerating from the residue in the floor boards. His heart reforms and begins beating, and the bone and organs of his body return, but he lacks skin and flesh. Julia, who became Frank's lover while engaged to the mild-mannered Larry, takes pity on him and agrees to help restore him. Tempted by the promise of having her old lover again, she seduces men in bars, lures them up to the empty attic room where Frank hides, and kills them; thus providing the blood needed for his body to regenerate and his spirit to escape from the Cenobites. Frank consumes their bodies, regenerating more of his own flesh each time
Some time after Frank's disappearance, his brother Larry and his family move into his parent's old abandoned house, and a drop of blood from an accident causes Frank's body to begin regenerating from the residue in the floor boards. His heart reforms and begins beating, and the bone and organs of his body return, but he lacks skin and flesh. Julia, who became Frank's lover while engaged to the mild-mannered Larry, takes pity on him and agrees to help restore him. Tempted by the promise of having her old lover again, she seduces men in bars, lures them up to the empty attic room where Frank hides, and kills them; thus providing the blood needed for his body to regenerate and his spirit to escape from the Cenobites. Frank consumes their bodies, regenerating more of his own flesh each time
Last edited by Giantrobo; 10-31-06 at 03:52 PM. Reason: spellin'
10-30-06 | 01:58 PM
#3
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also from wikipedia:
Term
The term "cenobite" is an archaic Latin word meaning simply "a member of a communal religious order"; for information on historical cenobites, see cenobitic. Indeed, the original novel mentions the Cenobites as "Theologians of the Order of the Gash;" they are also referred to as "Hierophants". They can reach reality only through a rupture in time and space which is opened and closed using a puzzle box. This box shutting them off from reality/sending them back plays a key role in each movie.
Description:
Chatterer is an example of a Cenobite.The Cenobites all have horrific mutilations or body piercings. The best known of the Cenobites in the Hellraiser films is Pinhead, who appears in all eight films and is played by actor Doug Bradley. Pinhead's mutilation consists of pins that have been hammered through his flesh into his skull in a grid pattern and six open wounds on his lower torso with the flesh peeled back. Other Cenobites have much more severe mutilations.
Originally enforcers for Leviathan, Lord of Hell, Cenobites were charged with retrieving anyone who solved the Lament Configuration, also known as the Lemarchand Box, a 3"x3"x3" puzzle box, which if solved opens a gateway between our world and Hell, highly sought after by the greatest of hedonists for its promise of unparalleled pleasures. They were then directly responsible for the pleasure/pain torture of said individual.
Originally believed to have always been Cenobites since the creation of Hell, it was revealed that some Cenobites had once been human, the first four seen who had unlocked the Lament Configuration and others "recruited" by Pinhead. The rest, such as Angelique, the daughter of Leviathan, were never human at the start.
[edit] Differences between film and written descriptions
The leader of the Cenobites, who does not appear until the end of the novella, is the mysterious Engineer. In the film series, the leader of the Cenobites (later known as "Pinhead") appears at the beginning during Frank's initial encounter with them. The title of Engineer does not appear in the film series until Hellraiser: Inferno, in which it is used for an unidentified serial killer who turns out to be the lead character's own dark-side. (A non-Cenobite inhabitant of the Cenobites' realm is seen in the first film chasing Kirsty out of Hell. Although not identified within the film, the film's credits refer to this creature as "the Engineer".)
Pinhead's head is gridded with incisions, but his counterpart in the novella has a grid tattooed on his head. This counterpart is not the leader of the four initial Cenobites. The leader in the novella is a character whose wounded eyelids and lips are held open by hooks on chains that are woven through the bones of its skull.
Term
The term "cenobite" is an archaic Latin word meaning simply "a member of a communal religious order"; for information on historical cenobites, see cenobitic. Indeed, the original novel mentions the Cenobites as "Theologians of the Order of the Gash;" they are also referred to as "Hierophants". They can reach reality only through a rupture in time and space which is opened and closed using a puzzle box. This box shutting them off from reality/sending them back plays a key role in each movie.
Description:
Chatterer is an example of a Cenobite.The Cenobites all have horrific mutilations or body piercings. The best known of the Cenobites in the Hellraiser films is Pinhead, who appears in all eight films and is played by actor Doug Bradley. Pinhead's mutilation consists of pins that have been hammered through his flesh into his skull in a grid pattern and six open wounds on his lower torso with the flesh peeled back. Other Cenobites have much more severe mutilations.
Originally enforcers for Leviathan, Lord of Hell, Cenobites were charged with retrieving anyone who solved the Lament Configuration, also known as the Lemarchand Box, a 3"x3"x3" puzzle box, which if solved opens a gateway between our world and Hell, highly sought after by the greatest of hedonists for its promise of unparalleled pleasures. They were then directly responsible for the pleasure/pain torture of said individual.
Originally believed to have always been Cenobites since the creation of Hell, it was revealed that some Cenobites had once been human, the first four seen who had unlocked the Lament Configuration and others "recruited" by Pinhead. The rest, such as Angelique, the daughter of Leviathan, were never human at the start.
[edit] Differences between film and written descriptions
The leader of the Cenobites, who does not appear until the end of the novella, is the mysterious Engineer. In the film series, the leader of the Cenobites (later known as "Pinhead") appears at the beginning during Frank's initial encounter with them. The title of Engineer does not appear in the film series until Hellraiser: Inferno, in which it is used for an unidentified serial killer who turns out to be the lead character's own dark-side. (A non-Cenobite inhabitant of the Cenobites' realm is seen in the first film chasing Kirsty out of Hell. Although not identified within the film, the film's credits refer to this creature as "the Engineer".)
Pinhead's head is gridded with incisions, but his counterpart in the novella has a grid tattooed on his head. This counterpart is not the leader of the four initial Cenobites. The leader in the novella is a character whose wounded eyelids and lips are held open by hooks on chains that are woven through the bones of its skull.
10-30-06 | 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Mopower
Of course this could all be the result of really crappy writing like the rest of the movie.
Uhhh, riiiiiight.
"Hellraiser" was, and remains, one of the most interesting and well-written films/concepts of the genre.
10-30-06 | 04:49 PM
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From: The Janitor's closet in Kinnick Stadium
Still doesn't make sense. If the flesh in the floorboards thing doesn't have anything to do with the Cenobites why does it happen? And the matress. Or are they trying to say that when anyone dies just to where they died and sprinkle blood on it and they will come back? The movie didn't explain the Cenobites at all. All of a sudden the room started shaking the light started coming thru the wall and they were there.
10-30-06 | 09:10 PM
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^^That's the exact reason why I didn't like the Texas Chainsaw Massacre "prequal"....I don't NEED to know the origins. To me it's creepier NOT knowing why things are happening.
10-31-06 | 03:54 PM
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From: Gateway Cities/Harbor Region
Originally Posted by zombiezilla
"Hellraiser" was, and remains, one of the most interesting and well-written films/concepts of the genre.
10-31-06 | 04:08 PM
#8
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i saw the whole movie for the first time last night on amc too. thought it was ok, all the actors were great.
wondered about the cenobites thing too. i'm just assuming that they're from another dimension and nothing more.
were the other hellraiser movies good?
wondered about the cenobites thing too. i'm just assuming that they're from another dimension and nothing more.
were the other hellraiser movies good?
10-31-06 | 09:51 PM
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From: Gateway Cities/Harbor Region
Originally Posted by Ranger
were the other hellraiser movies good?
It's kinda like the Superman movies. I and II were good but the rest are aquired tastes. Most hate them(3 and on) but they all have their good and bad parts.
10-31-06 | 11:04 PM
#10
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Originally Posted by Ranger
were the other hellraiser movies good?
After that it's a crap shoot. I remember kinda liking Hellraiser: Bloodlines, but that was mainly for the impressive kills, and it's been about 9 years since I've seen it and they may not be that impressive anymore. Inferno and Hellseeker were totally forgettable. I only got suckered into Hellseeker because it had Ashley Laurence, and her return to the franchise was totally not worth the $3.50 I spent on the rental. After that I swore off any future DTV sequels, so you're on your own with Deader and Hellworld.
12-05-06 | 01:11 PM
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DVD Talk Special Edition
Originally Posted by matome
I loved the first three. The following DTV sequels are pretty shitty (I still own them all)
Many people think that 2 was better than the original. I disagree but i can see their point.
12-19-06 | 02:48 AM
#17
DVD Talk Legend
I spent a while on Netflix renting every one of the series, minus one, which wasn't out yet. I seem to recall enjoying almost all of them, or at least parts of them. After 3, the stories kinda go haywire, which is to be expected with that many sequels.
There was one with a detective, as a main character, and that one was easily the worst.
There was one with a detective, as a main character, and that one was easily the worst.
