Happy Birthday George Lucas!
05-14-06, 01:12 PM
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Happy Birthday George Lucas!
05-15-06, 08:27 AM
#8
I believe there are two George Lucas's, so I don't know how old the one celebrating his birthday is.
I would ask anyone: Watch the Original Star Wars and then watch The Phantom Menace, and ask yourself if this is the same person who directed and wrote both films? The Original is an utter classic that didn't involve Kasdan's writing or Kershner's direction, this movie was all Lucas, just as TPM.
It boggles my mind when I watch the Prequels, but TPM is such a piece of crap with awful Jar Jar humor, bad drama, boring characters. I swear someone jumped in his body in the mid 90's and took him over, cause this is not the George Lucas from American Graffitti, Star Wars, and Indiana Jones.
I would ask anyone: Watch the Original Star Wars and then watch The Phantom Menace, and ask yourself if this is the same person who directed and wrote both films? The Original is an utter classic that didn't involve Kasdan's writing or Kershner's direction, this movie was all Lucas, just as TPM.
It boggles my mind when I watch the Prequels, but TPM is such a piece of crap with awful Jar Jar humor, bad drama, boring characters. I swear someone jumped in his body in the mid 90's and took him over, cause this is not the George Lucas from American Graffitti, Star Wars, and Indiana Jones.
05-15-06, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by coli
I would ask anyone: Watch the Original Star Wars and then watch The Phantom Menace, and ask yourself if this is the same person who directed and wrote both films? The Original is an utter classic that didn't involve Kasdan's writing or Kershner's direction, this movie was all Lucas, just as TPM.
By the time 'Phantom Menace' came around, Lucas still had the same problems; bad dialogue, bad with actors, awkwardly telling a story ... but by then, everybody already believed the hype which stated that he had created 'Star Wars' singlehandedly. Thus, they deferred to him, allowed him to actually create a 'Star Wars' trilogy singlehandedly, and it's horrible.
Film is extremely collaborative, and it can work fantastically well that way. But Lucas is, and has always been, a credit hog. Check out the way he took credit for the 'Star Wars' novelization; even way back in 1977, Lucas really wanted to push the idea that it was all him making it up (or, at least, knowing what to steal from; he's often been quite open about inspirations and such).
05-16-06, 01:18 PM
#11
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
I would argue that the true difference is that, when making 'Star Wars', nobody bought into the bullshit line that Lucas had singlehandedly created anything. I'm sure Alec Guinness was doing his own thing; there are wonderful stories about Ford making sure he was able to do what he wanted. Numerous people assisted Lucas in the editing and the script (even uncredited as they'd be for the latter). Hell, he was married to a great great editor, at that point.
By the time 'Phantom Menace' came around, Lucas still had the same problems; bad dialogue, bad with actors, awkwardly telling a story ... but by then, everybody already believed the hype which stated that he had created 'Star Wars' singlehandedly. Thus, they deferred to him, allowed him to actually create a 'Star Wars' trilogy singlehandedly, and it's horrible.
Film is extremely collaborative, and it can work fantastically well that way. But Lucas is, and has always been, a credit hog. Check out the way he took credit for the 'Star Wars' novelization; even way back in 1977, Lucas really wanted to push the idea that it was all him making it up (or, at least, knowing what to steal from; he's often been quite open about inspirations and such).
By the time 'Phantom Menace' came around, Lucas still had the same problems; bad dialogue, bad with actors, awkwardly telling a story ... but by then, everybody already believed the hype which stated that he had created 'Star Wars' singlehandedly. Thus, they deferred to him, allowed him to actually create a 'Star Wars' trilogy singlehandedly, and it's horrible.
Film is extremely collaborative, and it can work fantastically well that way. But Lucas is, and has always been, a credit hog. Check out the way he took credit for the 'Star Wars' novelization; even way back in 1977, Lucas really wanted to push the idea that it was all him making it up (or, at least, knowing what to steal from; he's often been quite open about inspirations and such).
I love how some people do their best to discredit Lucas when discussing his great films. But any other director gets all the credit in the world for making a great film. Lucas made 3 great films and had a sizeable hand in many others. I know it pains you to admit that. Just deal with it and move on.As for the "credit hog" statement, that is just another load of crap. If anything, Lucas is the exact opposite. Lucas has gone to bat for other filmmakers refusing to put his name on many projects for fear that he'd get the credit. I'd suggest you read a book about Lucas, because it's clear you don't know much about the man's film career.
Last edited by Terrell; 05-16-06 at 01:44 PM.
05-16-06, 01:49 PM
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Actually, a lot of people won Academy Awards for Star Wars, except George Lucas.
Film Editing - Paul Hirsch, Marcia Lucas and Richard Chew, Star Wars
Costume Design - John Mollo
Visual Effects - John Stears, John Dykstra, Richard Edlund, Grant McCune and Robert Blalack, Star Wars
Special Achievement Awards - Benjamin Burtt, Jr. for the creation of the alien, creature and robot voices in Star Wars
Score - John Williams
Sound - Don MacDougall, Ray West, Bob Minkler and Derek Ball, Star Wars
Art Direction - John Barry, Norman Reynolds and Leslie Dilley, art direction; Roger Christian,
But thats OK, because in the "Cult of Lucas" headed by Terrell. George Lucas is the only thing that matters.
Happy Birthday, Imperious Leader!
Film Editing - Paul Hirsch, Marcia Lucas and Richard Chew, Star Wars
Costume Design - John Mollo
Visual Effects - John Stears, John Dykstra, Richard Edlund, Grant McCune and Robert Blalack, Star Wars
Special Achievement Awards - Benjamin Burtt, Jr. for the creation of the alien, creature and robot voices in Star Wars
Score - John Williams
Sound - Don MacDougall, Ray West, Bob Minkler and Derek Ball, Star Wars
Art Direction - John Barry, Norman Reynolds and Leslie Dilley, art direction; Roger Christian,
But thats OK, because in the "Cult of Lucas" headed by Terrell. George Lucas is the only thing that matters.
Happy Birthday, Imperious Leader!
05-16-06, 01:59 PM
#13
Originally Posted by Terrell
I love how some people do their best to discredit Lucas when discussing his great films. But any other director gets all the credit in the world for making a great film. Lucas made 3 great films and had a sizeable hand in many others. I know it pains you to admit that. Just deal with it and move on.As for the "credit hog" statement, that is just another load of crap. If anything, Lucas is the exact opposite. Lucas has gone to bat for other filmmakers refusing to put his name on many projects for fear that he'd get the credit. I'd suggest you read a book about Lucas, because it's clear you don't know much about the man's film career.
The difference is that Lucas was dealing with the same series of movies that he started off with, and that gives a great comparison. OK, lets throw away TXH-1138 and American Graffiti, and just compare SW movies.
I agree that all great directors do some duds in their careers: Brian Depalma = Snake Eyes, Scorcese = Bringing out the Dead, and Rob Reiner did some bad romantic comedy last year.
But atleast with the SW movies, Lucas was dealing with the same subject, so it wasn't like other directors, where they just got a bad script or the project was doomed for whoever directed. Lucas wrote & directed the Prequels, just like he wrote & directed the original SW. And when I compare TPM & AOTC, and even parts of ROTS to the original SW, it astounds me what happened to him in 20 years.
05-16-06, 02:38 PM
#14
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
chanster, I have no desire to argue with you on anything, much less Star Wars or Lucas. Go beat your "I hate George Lucas" drum somehwere else.
As great as Star Wars is, both of those films are superior.
I don't think it's all that astounding. Not directing for almost 20 years is bound to have an enormous impact on any filmmaker. 20 years is a long time. Most of us know why Lucas stopped directing. Let's not forget to mention that Lucas was never a good screenwriter. There's you're two biggest reasons right there why the prequels didn't live up to the ridiculous expectations. I think we also need to mention that Lucas never really had a plan for these films, and never really had a desire to tell these stories. He did with the originals, and it showed. Big difference. Sure he made a few things up in the originals. But for the most part, it's easy to see those films were planned out much better than the prequels were. A great screenwriter and editor, and a more carefully planned out story by Lucas would have solved the vast majority of the problems of the prequels. Lucas just tried to do too much.
But the films are over. Either you enjoyed them or not. Arguing about them now will change nothing. I still think ROTS is a fine film, and I can see parts of the film where the Lucas talents of old shines through. I just find it funny that the people who continually slam Lucas can't bear the thought that Lucas is a big reason that Star Wars was great to begin with. He's the main reason their Star Wars fans.
I think Lucas needs to get away from Star Wars. Go back to his THX roots. But he almost seems trapped by it, never allowing himself to let go of it. I think we'll see Lucas start to do good work again when he allows other to write his screenplays and edit his films.
By the way, Brian DePalma has made many bad to mediocre films, and made many good to great ones. He's about the most inconsistent filmmaker I've ever seen.
Mission to Mars
Snake Eyes
Bonfire of the Vanities
Raising Cain
Body Double(no, I don't think that's a good film)
Wise Guys
Truth be told, neither Depalma, Scorsese, or Coppola are anywhere near as good as they were in their younger days. Some people peak early. The biggest mistake Lucas made was going on a 16 year hiatus.
OK, lets throw away TXH-1138 and American Graffiti, and just compare SW movies.
But atleast with the SW movies, Lucas was dealing with the same subject, so it wasn't like other directors, where they just got a bad script or the project was doomed for whoever directed. Lucas wrote & directed the Prequels, just like he wrote & directed the original SW. And when I compare TPM & AOTC, and even parts of ROTS to the original SW, it astounds me what happened to him in 20 years.
But the films are over. Either you enjoyed them or not. Arguing about them now will change nothing. I still think ROTS is a fine film, and I can see parts of the film where the Lucas talents of old shines through. I just find it funny that the people who continually slam Lucas can't bear the thought that Lucas is a big reason that Star Wars was great to begin with. He's the main reason their Star Wars fans.
I think Lucas needs to get away from Star Wars. Go back to his THX roots. But he almost seems trapped by it, never allowing himself to let go of it. I think we'll see Lucas start to do good work again when he allows other to write his screenplays and edit his films.
By the way, Brian DePalma has made many bad to mediocre films, and made many good to great ones. He's about the most inconsistent filmmaker I've ever seen.
Mission to Mars
Snake Eyes
Bonfire of the Vanities
Raising Cain
Body Double(no, I don't think that's a good film)
Wise Guys
Truth be told, neither Depalma, Scorsese, or Coppola are anywhere near as good as they were in their younger days. Some people peak early. The biggest mistake Lucas made was going on a 16 year hiatus.
Last edited by Terrell; 05-16-06 at 02:49 PM.
05-16-06, 07:37 PM
#15
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by coli
I believe there are two George Lucas's, so I don't know how old the one celebrating his birthday is.
I would ask anyone: Watch the Original Star Wars and then watch The Phantom Menace, and ask yourself if this is the same person who directed and wrote both films? The Original is an utter classic that didn't involve Kasdan's writing or Kershner's direction, this movie was all Lucas, just as TPM.
It boggles my mind when I watch the Prequels, but TPM is such a piece of crap with awful Jar Jar humor, bad drama, boring characters. I swear someone jumped in his body in the mid 90's and took him over, cause this is not the George Lucas from American Graffitti, Star Wars, and Indiana Jones.
I would ask anyone: Watch the Original Star Wars and then watch The Phantom Menace, and ask yourself if this is the same person who directed and wrote both films? The Original is an utter classic that didn't involve Kasdan's writing or Kershner's direction, this movie was all Lucas, just as TPM.
It boggles my mind when I watch the Prequels, but TPM is such a piece of crap with awful Jar Jar humor, bad drama, boring characters. I swear someone jumped in his body in the mid 90's and took him over, cause this is not the George Lucas from American Graffitti, Star Wars, and Indiana Jones.
What is the Dark Side? Greed. It's what caused him to switch from making Star Wars movies to fulfill some sort of artistic vision, but instead as a businessman to simply make money, quality be damned. While making the first film, George Lucas was the rebel, going against the Hollywood establishment to make a dream project that so one else believed in. After the success of the films, he had his own Empire by the early '80s and could do what he wanted because he was the Emperor. He had the power to do the movies well, but because money-making merchandise came first, the quality of the actual movies declined.
05-17-06, 09:29 AM
#16
[QUOTE=Terrell]
As great as Star Wars is, both of those films are superior.
We'll agree to disagree, but Star Wars to me is his best film, and I never expected any of the prequels to be of that quality, cause movies like that come once a generation, I did expect them to resemble the good qualities of it more. Star Wars is one of those rare movies that has that true movie magic when you're watching it. I can't explain it, but you feel you are watching something great, and if the newer fans would stop seeing it as a part of the saga and just watch it as the standalone movie it is, they would love it just as much as the older fans.
I don't think it's all that astounding. Not directing for almost 20 years is bound to have an enormous impact on any filmmaker. 20 years is a long time. Most of us know why Lucas stopped directing. Let's not forget to mention that Lucas was never a good screenwriter. There's you're two biggest reasons right there why the prequels didn't live up to the ridiculous expectations. I think we also need to mention that Lucas never really had a plan for these films, and never really had a desire to tell these stories. He did with the originals, and it showed. Big difference. Sure he made a few things up in the originals. But for the most part, it's easy to see those films were planned out much better than the prequels were. A great screenwriter and editor, and a more carefully planned out story by Lucas would have solved the vast majority of the problems of the prequels. Lucas just tried to do too much.
But the films are over. Either you enjoyed them or not. Arguing about them now will change nothing. I still think ROTS is a fine film, and I can see parts of the film where the Lucas talents of old shines through. I just find it funny that the people who continually slam Lucas can't bear the thought that Lucas is a big reason that Star Wars was great to begin with. He's the main reason their Star Wars fans.
I think Lucas needs to get away from Star Wars. Go back to his THX roots. But he almost seems trapped by it, never allowing himself to let go of it. I think we'll see Lucas start to do good work again when he allows other to write his screenplays and edit his films.
Thats a fair critique, and I respect that you are willing to defend Lucas and notice his flaws in the same breath.
I do agree with you that Lucas was past his prime when doing the PT. I do agree that he probably didn't have the drive to make it as great as the OT, mostly being older and rich and more at peace as a father now.
But I think a huge reason Lucas has never been the same as a director, is he is now a businessman. To me his last great effort as a director/producer was Raiders of the Lost Ark. He was still building Skywalker ranch and wasn't totally focused on the mighty buck yet, also he didn't finance it like ESB & ROTJ.
I tend to see Lucas's decline right at ROTJ. It is still great to me cause it is SW, but it pales in comparison to SW & ESB. ROTJ resembles the PT in many ways, really good scenes and really bad scenes.
It had the ewoks for merchandising, and recycled Death Star cause I believe he just ran out of ideas. I never bought that he had this huge plan for all these movies, when it looks like ESB is the last original SW movie in the saga. After that, there are so many recycled things in ROTJ & the PT, now some are done intentionally to parallel trilogies, but ROTJ is a blantant rip off of the Original SW in so many ways, except for the Emperor scenes.
In the end, Lucas will be married to Star Wars forever because of one thing: $$$$$$$$$$$$$. In some ways how can you fault a man for making money? He will keep putting out boxset of SW movies, the O-OT, updated SE, the TV series. If I were him, I would stop tampering with the OT and just make this O-OT set the last. But Lucas knows he can make a boatload of money for the supposed 2007 saga boxset with more changes.
But in other ways if you look at what he did as director/producer from 1971-1981, Spielberg & Lucas were the kings of fantasy movies that weren't dumbed down like many summer blockbuster today:
THX-1138 (1971)
American Graffiti (1973)
Jaws (1975)
Star Wars (1977)
Close Encounters of the Third King (1977)
The Empire Strikes Back (1980)
Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981)
E.T. (1982)
That is a pretty good run for those two friends. Those movies will not be forgotten years from now.
As great as Star Wars is, both of those films are superior.
We'll agree to disagree, but Star Wars to me is his best film, and I never expected any of the prequels to be of that quality, cause movies like that come once a generation, I did expect them to resemble the good qualities of it more. Star Wars is one of those rare movies that has that true movie magic when you're watching it. I can't explain it, but you feel you are watching something great, and if the newer fans would stop seeing it as a part of the saga and just watch it as the standalone movie it is, they would love it just as much as the older fans.
I don't think it's all that astounding. Not directing for almost 20 years is bound to have an enormous impact on any filmmaker. 20 years is a long time. Most of us know why Lucas stopped directing. Let's not forget to mention that Lucas was never a good screenwriter. There's you're two biggest reasons right there why the prequels didn't live up to the ridiculous expectations. I think we also need to mention that Lucas never really had a plan for these films, and never really had a desire to tell these stories. He did with the originals, and it showed. Big difference. Sure he made a few things up in the originals. But for the most part, it's easy to see those films were planned out much better than the prequels were. A great screenwriter and editor, and a more carefully planned out story by Lucas would have solved the vast majority of the problems of the prequels. Lucas just tried to do too much.
But the films are over. Either you enjoyed them or not. Arguing about them now will change nothing. I still think ROTS is a fine film, and I can see parts of the film where the Lucas talents of old shines through. I just find it funny that the people who continually slam Lucas can't bear the thought that Lucas is a big reason that Star Wars was great to begin with. He's the main reason their Star Wars fans.
I think Lucas needs to get away from Star Wars. Go back to his THX roots. But he almost seems trapped by it, never allowing himself to let go of it. I think we'll see Lucas start to do good work again when he allows other to write his screenplays and edit his films.
Thats a fair critique, and I respect that you are willing to defend Lucas and notice his flaws in the same breath.
I do agree with you that Lucas was past his prime when doing the PT. I do agree that he probably didn't have the drive to make it as great as the OT, mostly being older and rich and more at peace as a father now.
But I think a huge reason Lucas has never been the same as a director, is he is now a businessman. To me his last great effort as a director/producer was Raiders of the Lost Ark. He was still building Skywalker ranch and wasn't totally focused on the mighty buck yet, also he didn't finance it like ESB & ROTJ.
I tend to see Lucas's decline right at ROTJ. It is still great to me cause it is SW, but it pales in comparison to SW & ESB. ROTJ resembles the PT in many ways, really good scenes and really bad scenes.
It had the ewoks for merchandising, and recycled Death Star cause I believe he just ran out of ideas. I never bought that he had this huge plan for all these movies, when it looks like ESB is the last original SW movie in the saga. After that, there are so many recycled things in ROTJ & the PT, now some are done intentionally to parallel trilogies, but ROTJ is a blantant rip off of the Original SW in so many ways, except for the Emperor scenes.
In the end, Lucas will be married to Star Wars forever because of one thing: $$$$$$$$$$$$$. In some ways how can you fault a man for making money? He will keep putting out boxset of SW movies, the O-OT, updated SE, the TV series. If I were him, I would stop tampering with the OT and just make this O-OT set the last. But Lucas knows he can make a boatload of money for the supposed 2007 saga boxset with more changes.
But in other ways if you look at what he did as director/producer from 1971-1981, Spielberg & Lucas were the kings of fantasy movies that weren't dumbed down like many summer blockbuster today:
THX-1138 (1971)
American Graffiti (1973)
Jaws (1975)
Star Wars (1977)
Close Encounters of the Third King (1977)
The Empire Strikes Back (1980)
Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981)
E.T. (1982)
That is a pretty good run for those two friends. Those movies will not be forgotten years from now.
05-18-06, 07:44 AM
#18
Non-Anamorphic = Out of touch
Anybody who even likes this guy anymore needs to get their head checked. He is putting out the O-OT on DVD in non-anamorphic widescreen! No studios do this anymore with a major release. This is unheard of!
It is insulting and the final straw, and there is no way I am buying Laserdisk quality DVD's, Pssst........I already have them from Ebay
F**k you Lucas, I don't give a s**t anymore, if you are going to piss on the fans, why they wish you a happy birthday?
Anybody who even likes this guy anymore needs to get their head checked. He is putting out the O-OT on DVD in non-anamorphic widescreen! No studios do this anymore with a major release. This is unheard of!
It is insulting and the final straw, and there is no way I am buying Laserdisk quality DVD's, Pssst........I already have them from Ebay
F**k you Lucas, I don't give a s**t anymore, if you are going to piss on the fans, why they wish you a happy birthday?
