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"Alien 3" ?'s

Old 01-06-06, 05:06 PM
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"Alien 3" ?'s

I just saw the SE and really thought it was ok. Not as bad as many made it out to be. I saw in theater as well and liked it better now. But, why oh why couldn't Fincher use puppets and models instead of that fake CG effect for the alien. So...

1. Why was the alien warrior different in physical stature in this one? Walking on all 4's like some cat when it was born, coming from the bull. I mean how did it evolve like that when there was no way it could realistically?

2. Did they wipe out the end scene when
Spoiler:
Ripley commits suicide in the pit and the alien mother inside her bursts out and Ripley holds her while they are consumed by fire
, or is that in the TE still? I know I saw it in the theater and thought it was very poignant.
Old 01-06-06, 05:40 PM
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1. I believe the explanation is that the Alien takes on certain physical aspects of its host, which is why the Aliens in "Aliens" walked around on 2 legs mostly, since they came from the colonists.

2. The scene remains the same in the Theatrical Cut. They changed it only for the Special Edition Cut.
Old 01-06-06, 06:03 PM
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About the puppets and CG thing, I think that many of those scenes were cut early and only cleaned up for the dvd, hense a limited effects budget. I would think that if Fincher (or the studio, which notoriously meddled during production) intended on keeping the scenes, he would have made sure they looked better than the . That said, I prefer the special edition cut of the film and the added character exposition. If you're interested in the production of Alien3, look around on the net for all of the different scripts that were considered. Very interesting.
Old 01-06-06, 07:34 PM
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Yes, the reason for the physical traits is that of the host. If you see the end of AvP, you'll see the alien takes on characteristics very similar of that to the host.

I really didn't think Alien3 was as bad as some, but it was by all means a let-down from 1 and 2. I liked Fincher's dark style and the whole concept of the prison was kind of interesting. I think most people gave up in the opening credits after they saw what Fincher did to keep the story consistent, given some actors didn't want to return for a next installment.
Old 01-06-06, 07:37 PM
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Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenomorph for more information than you ever wanted to know about the aliens from Aliens.
Old 01-06-06, 07:40 PM
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I think the problem with Alien 3 for most people can be summed up by the fact that my dad and sister were severely depressed when they came walking out of the showing (I chickened out from seeing it at the last minute).
Old 01-06-06, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by kurupt
About the puppets and CG thing, I think that many of those scenes were cut early and only cleaned up for the dvd, hense a limited effects budget.
That's definately true. There are no CG aliens in the theatrical release, and Fincher had nothing to do with the workprint release. That they even put that together is more than enough for me.

The majority of the alien though...those are puppets and models.
Old 01-06-06, 09:58 PM
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As for number 2 of the OP, I always felt seeing the alien burst out her chest takes away from her sacrifice.
Old 01-06-06, 10:12 PM
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One of the main complaints I hear about #3 is the beginning and what they did w/ the survivors of #2. I understand their point but frankly I don't think it really detracts from the movie. If anything it helps recreate the hopeless/trapped feeling from the original movie.
Old 01-06-06, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by jaeufraser
That's definately true. There are no CG aliens in the theatrical release, and Fincher had nothing to do with the workprint release. That they even put that together is more than enough for me.

The majority of the alien though...those are puppets and models.
how could they be puppets? they looked so insanley fake...especially compared to the other 3 movies...now those were puppets and models and great ones at that. Alien 3 was so phony each and every time the alien appeared.
Old 01-06-06, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
how could they be puppets? they looked so insanley fake...especially compared to the other 3 movies...now those were puppets and models and great ones at that. Alien 3 was so phony each and every time the alien appeared.
Actually in the first two films they aren't puppets, they're men in suits. Only the Alien queen was a giant puppet.

The aliens in Alien 3 are puppets, but not practical on set ones (save for close ups). I forget the exact way, it might've been stop motion but I'm pretty sure not. Actually I believe they were smaller scale puppets that were moved by the puppeteers, and composited into the shots (except for the closeups). And truthfully, puppets do look fake. Heck the chestburster in part one isn't exactly the pinnacle of realism either.

Alien Resurrection is the only Alien film proper that features CG aliens (save for the workprint Alien 3).

Truthfully the first Alien film benefits a lot because you never actually see the Alien. While those shots may not look as real in Alien 3, if you look at the prior two films there aren't really any full body shots of a moving alien like in Alien 3, save for perhaps the Queen sequence at the end of Aliens. So what they were doing in some of those shots was more ambitious techincally speaking as they had longer, more visible sequences with the creatures.

But truthfully, while Alien is a great film, I can't really say those SFX are fantastic anymore. They do the job, but Ridley Scott's filmmaking takes almost more credit than the actual creature effects in the first film. Hell there's even one shot I recall which looks like a guy in a suit, which truthfully...it was. Now the effects in Aliens...it's the filmmaking and way Cameron shot those men in suits that makes most of that film work so well, but that Queen Alien still impresses me on a technical level.
Old 01-06-06, 11:46 PM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
I just saw the SE and really thought it was ok. Not as bad as many made it out to be. I saw in theater as well and liked it better now. But, why oh why couldn't Fincher use puppets and models instead of that fake CG effect for the alien. So...

1. Why was the alien warrior different in physical stature in this one? Walking on all 4's like some cat when it was born, coming from the bull. I mean how did it evolve like that when there was no way it could realistically?

2. Did they wipe out the end scene when
Spoiler:
Ripley commits suicide in the pit and the alien mother inside her bursts out and Ripley holds her while they are consumed by fire
, or is that in the TE still? I know I saw it in the theater and thought it was very poignant.
It originally was supposed to be a bull, but they changed to a Rottweiler for esthetics and techinal mechanations.
Old 01-07-06, 12:32 AM
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It's funny how people rag on the alien<sup>3</sup> warrior when it actually garnered an Academy Award nomination. The warrior puppet created and filmed by Boss Film Studios was essenial to the development of motion capture for Species (3 years later).
Old 01-07-06, 12:46 AM
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4 was probably the worst one out of all of them.
Old 01-07-06, 05:32 AM
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I've always thought one the coolest aspects of the "Xenomorph" was it's abiltity to take on the trates of a host form on a DNA level. Dog host = Dog Alien, Predator host = Predator Alien, Human host = Human Alien.
Old 01-07-06, 05:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Morf
Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenomorph for more information than you ever wanted to know about the aliens from Aliens.

To cool!! I love when shit like that is mapped out.

I had the game AVP:Extinction and all the variants on the Xenormorph were awesome. It was fun to have them attack humans, Predators, and various animals in the game to breed specific Alien forms.
Old 01-07-06, 02:15 PM
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was alien 3 originally going to take place on earth? there's a teaser trailer for that idea. resurrection had ripley land on earth for the se ending.
Old 01-07-06, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Fok
4 was probably the worst one out of all of them.
Only if you're not counting "Alien vs. Predator" as part of the series.
Old 01-07-06, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by deadpool24
was alien 3 originally going to take place on earth? there's a teaser trailer for that idea. resurrection had ripley land on earth for the se ending.
Check out this link, it has William Gibson's draft for Alien3, which does take place on Earth.

http://www.awesomefilm.com/script/Alien3.txt
Old 01-07-06, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by FinkPish
Check out this link, it has William Gibson's draft for Alien3, which does take place on Earth.

http://www.awesomefilm.com/script/Alien3.txt
You guys should check out the additional stuff on the dvds in the Quadrilogy box. It's true that they wanted it to be on Earth. They released a teaser in the theaters a year before they actually came out with the movie with a variation on the original catchline (In space no one can hear you scream). It showed a shot of Earth I think and it said "On Earth, everyone can hear you scream". They also had an idea of a weird wooden sphere-like planet but it cost too much. James Cameron was set to make this film early on but I forget why he decided to leave the series.
Old 01-08-06, 05:24 PM
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Since this has expanded into a more general discussion of Alien Xenomorphs, is there an explanation of how the little chestburster is able to grow to adult size in just a matter of hours?
Old 01-08-06, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by dhmac
Since this has expanded into a more general discussion of Alien Xenomorphs, is there an explanation of how the little chestburster is able to grow to adult size in just a matter of hours?
Read that Wiki page someone posted earlier; it has the whole life cycle in there. And the real answer to your question is: to serve the plot. It wouldn't be a very scary or efficient movie if it took weeks or months to get to full size, plus it is more scary that it can grow so fast, especially in the first film, since they are looking for something the size of a cat when it is around 7 feet tall.
Old 01-09-06, 08:31 AM
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dammit. Reading that wiki page and the Fox channel's airing of "ALIEN" over the weekend totally rekindled my interests in the franchise. It made me want to buy the Quadralogy or whatever ALIEN boxset is out there so I can see all the added scenes in the 4 movies.

I hate when that happens....

Last edited by Giantrobo; 01-09-06 at 08:38 AM.
Old 01-09-06, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Giantrobo
dammit. Reading that wiki page and the Fox channel's airing of "ALIEN" over the weekend totally rekindled my interests in the franchise. It made me want to buy the Quadralogy or whatever ALIEN boxset is out there so I can see all the added scenes in the 4 movies.

I hate when that happens....
the only ? is why you don't have this awesome collection already??
Old 01-09-06, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
the only ? is why you don't have this awesome collection already??

Because Iv'e seen the movies so many times it just seemed silly to lay down that kinda scratch for the boxsets. PLUS, Fox keeps re-releasing them so It's like, Let's see if the next set has more".

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