Yeah, but she plays the ex of Pitt's character. So I doubt they will have much screen time together. Maybe as much as Pitt and Roberts in the first one.

It don't matter.....My eyes will be glued on Cathy Z.

Thank you. You speak so eloquently for so many of us.

though they are blockbusters...they are hardly mainstream...Star Wars is a Samurai epic in space...and Matrix is a philosophical action/sci-fi film...

Now you are just speaking crazy talk. Has there ever been a movie more mainstream than The Phantom Menace? Do you remember all the hype and promotion that led up to that one?

I love the movies, all 5 of them. But to say it isn't mainstream is a little loco. Just look at the ridiculous box office takes from each movie.

Oh yeah. Catherine Zeta Jones is irritating and her on screen chemistry with George Clooney was awful. The only "intolerable cruelty" of their movie was that I actually sat through it until the end.

Mate, you can't have a blockbuster without being mainstream. The two go hand-in-hand.

Just admit it: you got GrouchOwned!

I can understand anti-mainstream Hollywood sentiment... most of what they turn out is indeed crap.

However, has anyone actually watched the original Ocean's 11 for anything more than a fond recollection of the glory days of the rat pack? It's really not a very good film.

Saying that what's wrong with Hollywood is that they update already good movies to capitalize on a new audience isn't really looking at the big picture; it's not remakes, it's their perpetual desire to turn out lowest common denominator crap, screwing new artists with an original vision and bowing to pressure from a general public who nary wants to strain a brain cell when they go to the movies. Oh but wait, that's the business as dictated by the consumer. We can blame Hollywood all we want but until the zombies stop flocking to see movies starring Ashton Kutcher and Tara Reid, Hollywood's not going to stop... and why should they?

And to dismiss the Ocean's 11 remake as generic Hollywood crap is a teeny bit shortsighted. At least Ocean's 11 had style, a fun cast and a very capable director who tells good stories. It was a fun popcorn movie that succeeded in it's intentions. This tendency to dismiss a film just because it's a cog in the Hollywood system is ridiculous - it's just as much a problem as Joe Six Pack labelling all independent and foreign film "boring."

And, back on topic, the imdb news is almost as reliable as the Enquirer. Until I see a catfight on the Special Edition DVD, it's just a fun rumor to toss around the water cooler.

Well, that took up a good chunk of work time! Back to business.

It wouls seem to me that not making Roberts' character pregnant is a good idea for the simple fact that its a movie sequel cliche . The one thing this movie doesn't need is the Adrian Balboa character convincing Rocky to give up he game. It certainly doesn't need a manic Danny Ocean freaking out at contractions followed by a love conquers all delivery scene.

My hopes will fall for the movie is Tess is pregnant.

oh yeah, because the plot is sooooo important in a film like this . . .

What's wrong with Hollywood is the assumption that amassing ego upon ego on the screen makes for a worthwhile film. Odd that the same characteristics make it a bankable film.

And using the term thriller in relation to either version of Ocean's Eleven. Sorry, that's just wrong.

Star Wars isn't mainstream? Haha, now THAT'S funny. The movie that is the definition of the mainstream blockbuster and the inspiration for many another one is somehow...not mainstream. I can't even fathom.

But this bagging on Ocean's 11...I don't get it. While this stupid cat fighting is lame, especially since Julia Robert's presence in Ocean's 11 added little to nothing. But CZJ...is always welcome...drool.

But Ocean's 11 is indicative of everything that IS right in Hollywood. Sure it's a remake, sure it's a big budget star driven vehicle. But you know what? That's what the mainstream wants, that's what Hollywood does. And Ocean's 11 is at the top of its game in being a fun piece of slick entertainment. In my opinion, it stands as an example of Hollywood doing what it does best. But I know some people hate films that appeal to lots of people and have enormous marketing potential, even if they're well made and a lot of fun.

Having fun with the nitrus oxide tank again, Pixy?

Successful does not equal good.

Granted the film itself is not a very good film, but the ending was creative (a word that nary exists in Hollywood these days).

Agreed.

Maybe that was my problem with it. I expected so much more out of it based on what it was bringing to the table. I am resigned to the whole "I can't be original so let's steal somebody else's premise and call it a re-make" trend that is going on in Hollywood. And sometimes it does turn out some decent popcorn flicks (loved the new "Dawn of the Dead"), but I was massively disappointed in Ocean's 11 and I really don't need to see Nicole Kidman as Samantha and Will Ferrell as Darren in "Bewitched the Movie."

I suppose, I should clarify my use of successful here and it has nothing to do with Box Office. This successful corresponds to the filmmaker reaching his/her intentions (in O11 case - a fun (always debatable, but IMO true)) mainstream heist movie with enjoyable characters.

Again, I attribute this as much to the general public's desire to see the familiar as I do to Hollywood's laziness.

That's why 95% (as a rough estimate) of any original cinema gets sequestered to art house and independent theaters.

I still stand by my assertion that a well-acted, well-directed, well-shot fillm is not going to be as good if it lacks an underlying plot. The film doesn't need to be complicated...it just needs to have a point.

If you look at the original Ocean's 11, it was made up of an avalance of "superstars" and is still able to remain a good film. While not every film with a huge group of A-list actors will succeed (ConAir), some will (Heat, Get Shorty, Ocean's 11). I think the cast list is a tool to get people into the theater, but the film's success is determined by how good the film actually is.

No, this is whats wrong with hollywood...

Ben on 'Road' to next project
By DANA HARRIS, CATHY DUNKLEY

Ben Affleck's next picture will be Disney's Jerry Bruckheimer production "Glory Road." The Mouse House aims to start production this summer. Affleck will star as a college basketball coach who led the first all-black lineup of players to the NCAA championship.

^^ rolleyes. the answer: Lucas, Affleck and Disney. The question Alex, what are the most commonly based things on DVDtalk?

Have you read a script? Know the history? Know who else is starring? No? How easy to bash somehthing you know nothing about.

As far as Oceans 11, this is one movie Hollywood did right. Instead of taking a good movie and remaking it into a sub-par film, they took a sub-par film and remade it into a great entertaining flick.

My only concern for the new one is this: they already pulled off the most successful heist in history, they are all millionaires. What could they possibly do in O12?

That's fine. A good plot can make a movie better, but I consider the plot to be the least essential element in a film (well, maybe it's ahead of the actors). It's indicative by the influx of remakes these days that the "film as narrative" well might be dry.

You, bothanspy, know I'm all about abstraction, ambiguity, artfulness, etc. in cinema and even I'm not that naive or idealistic (those the same thing?) to expect the Hollywood machine to give up the ghost and do a 180. But the relevance of that machine to world cinema is waning. That is a shame.

Personally, the original Ocean's 11 is more intriguing as an artifact than a film. Ensemble casts are hit or miss and blame can fall on anyone. I blame P.T. Anderson for not reigning in the overacting in the bloated Magnolia. I give the actors in Get Shorty credit for making that film work. In the Ocean's 11 remake, everyone's to blame for how flat it turned out. I don't care how pretty it looked, everything seemed mailed-in.

While I worry about the direction Hollywood is leading American cinema, I'm certain that in the deluge of mediocrity, watershed moments are still ahead of us. We just won't be able to predict them.

I have to agree with this. To use a topical example, look at Kill Bill. The plot is so paper thin that it can be described in two words. Yet, critics and audiences alike find it to be a great film. A "better" plot would, IMHO, only weaken the film.