Joe Schmoe

Bought and returned a copy of this yesterday because the center channel volume was low and distorted through most of the film. Never had this problem with other BD's or DVD's, nor did I have this problem when I owned this film on HD-DVD last year. Anyone else have an audio problem with Superman Returns on Blu-ray?

(And why doesn't this disc offer a lossless track? The HD-DVD version does.)

Mr. Salty

Newer pressings of "Superman Returns" do have a Dolby Digital TrueHD track.

bunkaroo

It should be noted the TrueHD pressing has never been confirmed as actually being shipped to retailers outside of the Pioneer player pack-in it was created for.

Any copies found at retail were confirmed as having the TrueHD sticker on the front. In the AVS thread someone who worked for Pioneer (I believe) confirmed he created the stickers and placed them on the discs himself. These discs likely found their way to shelves since units were used for display and not sold, or were returned by people who bought the Pioneer player.

I do expect we'll see it at retail eventually. I would think it will be like the corrected T3 disc, where Amazon winds up with a new listing because it's a different UPC.

Joe Schmoe

I've been looking for new versions of Superman Returns and Terminator 3 at my local stores for about a month now, but I have yet to find them. If I were to order them online, is there any way of knowing which versions I'd end up with?

bunkaroo

I see Amazon still has both T3's listed in stock. Pretty stupid.

Anyway, this is the listing I used and got the right one:

http://www.amazon.com/Terminator-3-R...dp/B0013ND36G/

You'll notice it has a release date of 2/26/2008, which is the date of the re-release. The original bad disc was released 12/18/2007.

It has a different UPC as well - there's a thread at AVS with details on which UPC is which, but again, if you use the Amazon link for the 2008 release, you should be good.

Superman Returns is trickier. The TrueHD version does have a different UPC than the DD version, so if Amazon eventually carries it you should see a new product listing for it. For now your only shot is getting extremely lucky at a Best Buy with someone who shelved one of the Pioneer discs, or get it on Ebay.

Joe Schmoe

Thank you, bunkaroo!

Gizmo

Odd, I could have swore he also mentioned the TrueHD versions would be making their way to shelves in May. Very odd for Warner to press Superman with a TrueHD track only for the Pioneer player.

Mr. Cinema

The new version of Superman Returns was supposed to be showing up earlier this year. The warehouses supposedly don't have anymore DD 5.1 versions. Looks like there are still plenty of old copies in stores. Once these finally dry up, we should start seeing them replaced by the new disc. All of the BBs I visit, they only have 2-3 copies on hand. But they continue to collect dust.

WB should price those at $9.99 and blow them out of the stores.

bunkaroo

Agreed. We're going to be stuck with these DD copies in stores until they blow them out. I don't see anyone rushing to buy this title for $20 or more even if they are new to Blu-Ray.

They need to drop the list to $28.99 so places can sell it cheaper at least.

PhantomStranger

Pioneer paid Warner for the entire cost of authoring and pressing the PCM/Dolby TrueHD version. I have no idea why it hasn't shown up yet. Maybe Warner had some sort of exclusivity contract with Pioneer that hasn't ended yet, but that player has been out of retail for months and months now.

Joe Schmoe

I followed your link to order T3 with Dolby True HD, but the version I received only has Dolby Digital. Strangely, the UPC code on the back of the case matches the UPC code listed on Amazon's site for the one that arrived in February 2008.

bunkaroo

I think you're confusing what was wrong with T3 and what was updated for the Superman Returns Pioneer release.

The first T3 disc was only playing in 1080i when it was supposed to be 1080p. That is why they re-released it. So the February '08 version has the correct 1080p encode. But both only had DD.

Gizmo

It never came with TrueHD...DD only. You did get the corrected version of T3 which is a good thing though!

bunkaroo

Echo.......

JACOB

I also had problems with the superman returns audio bluray. I remember the volume would be low when lois and superman are on top of the daily planet. I did notice that the superman returns on HDdvd also had the same problem.. even the dvd. they all have the same problem.

Jacob

Joe Schmoe

You're right. I wasn't aware that T3 was originally released in 1080i. I wonder if someone got fired for that blunder.

As far as it never having Dolby TrueHD, any theory as to why not? Generally speaking, why do studios release BD's without a lossless track? Isn't lossless audio and 1080p video kind of the point when it comes to this new format? I have Mission: Impossible I & III on BD, and neither of them offer lossless audio. The promo for Blu-ray on the discs brags about sound "unlike anything you've ever heard." Think again, Paramount. We've all heard 5.1 Dolby Digital before.

Joe Schmoe

Amen to that!

Gizmo

The original release of Super Returns was on a 25GB Blu-ray disc while the HD DVD was on a 30GB. Size may have been an issue back then (I have no idea if the TrueHD Blu-ray version of Superman is on a 50GB disc as I have never seen it before), but honestly I do not know. The link I posted above shows many titles that Warner/Paramount released on both formats where the HD DVD version had better audio (either TrueHD to a DD track or DD+ to a standard DD track).

Edit:
Here is a graphic that shows the comparison. Its old so new titles have not been added.

Josh Z

The Blu-ray didn't have a TrueHD track because Dolby's authoring tools for TrueHD weren't working on Blu-ray yet at the time. Due to the BD format's added programming complexity, they could only get it to work on HD DVD. It would be a few more months before the first TrueHD tracks appeared on Blu-ray.

Gizmo

Perfect. Glad to finally know why it was like that.

Joe Schmoe

Does this also include other types of next-gen soundtracks? Did some studios rush titles to market just to get them out there even though they didn't offer any kind next-gen audio? The chart that GizmoDVD provided (thank you!) shocks me. So many titles where the now-dead format HD-DVD received the better soundtrack. How long did studios have to get their titles ready for Blu-ray before it debuted? Geez!

bunkaroo

I figured it was something like this, as the original Superman Returns BD is actually a BD-50 - I just checked it again.

That's what makes the lack of lossless all the more frustrating. WB had the room to put PCM on like they did on The Departed. I can only guess they weren't even prepared to put PCM on a Blu-Ray at that point, but who knows.

bunkaroo

There was no doubt HD DVD (and specifically, WB on HD DVD) was delivering better audio product in 2006. Many of the LG Blu-Ray's from 2006 were just DTS-HD (and not MA) IIRC. Sony was releasing a lot of PCM tracks from the start as was Disney. Fox didn't jump in until November 2006 with DTS-HD MA, which no one could decode. Paramount was always iffy about lossless on both sides.

I literally bought both formats the same day, but I was definitely leaning towards HD DVD due to the usually better audio tracks (since PQ was typically equal). However, in the first quarter of 2007, Uni pulled a disappearing act and barely released any titles of note. That coupled with WB and LG finally seeming to get their act together (somewhat) with audio on Blu and a sharp increase of Blu releases I wanted made me start leaning the other way.

Gizmo

I really wish the OP who did the chart I posted above continued with what he was doing as that's a great thing to look at if you are format neutral and could careless if HD DVD is dead. I only thought a few titles on HD DVD had better audio, not so many.

Bunk, thanks for confirming Superman Returns was a 50GB disc. I thought that one was a 25GB due to lack of TrueHD (or PCM).

PhantomStranger

Warner could have easily included PCM audio on their Blu-ray releases that were gimped compared to the HD DVD versions. The people making the decisions at Warner in the early stages of the format war were mostly former employees of Toshiba. Warner had contractual obligations to favor HD DVD as a format with Toshiba. Ever wonder why HD DVD got so many HD DVD exclusives from Warner or gimped audio on the Blu-ray releases? Or why they continued to release HD DVD titles even after they announced they had picked Blu-ray as the sole format? They got paid a boatload of money for that. Thankfully the corporate people at Time Warner above the studio level put an end to that nonsense.