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HD vs BluRay help? please

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HD vs BluRay help? please

Old 05-27-06, 07:13 PM
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HD vs BluRay help? please

I am sorry if I am in the wrong forum, or if my questions are lame, or have been answered somewhere else. I did a search, but confusion still reigns.

I want to upgrade to one of the new formats, but I am so very confused. I do not understand any of the technical information at all.
Am I correct in thinking that Blu-ray and HD-DVD are competing formats like the beta and vhs formats were?

If this is correct do we choose one format and hope that the player and discs we purchase will win out over the other format?

Is the smartest thing to do is wait until the so called war is settled?

Again I am sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere, but I really am confused.

Thank you all
Old 05-27-06, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Randy810
Am I correct in thinking that Blu-ray and HD-DVD are competing formats like the beta and vhs formats were?

If this is correct do we choose one format and hope that the player and discs we purchase will win out over the other format?

Is the smartest thing to do is wait until the so called war is settled?
My take on things:

- This isn't like Beta vs. VHS because Beta was technically superior (by a noticable margain).

- Blu-Ray isn't out quite yet, but ALL first generation players (for either format) are lacking, IMO. None of them have HDMI 1.3, naturally. The Toshiba is 1080i-out only at this point (really though, you'll never notice a difference). The initial Blu-Ray players are pretty limited in terms of the new HD-sound formats (much more so than the Toshiba) and cost twice as much as the Toshiba model. The players are going to get a lot better with the next generation on both sides, but as for Gen.1, I think the HD-DVD players win.

- Reports are that the initial Blu-Ray discs will be essentially damaged goods. There are threads on the black/white clipping done by the Sony MPEG-2 software. Additionally, they are initially releasing on single layer discs (where they even leave 5 GB off due to problems filling the discs) and MPEG-2 compression. This is far from ideal for Blu-Ray and I'd be VERY hesitant to buy any initial Blu-Ray titles.

- Blu-Ray has a good deal more studio support. This can change, of course, but is the case today.

You be hard pressed to find a totally unbiased opinion on this (or any) site. My opinion is that if you are dying to get into either format with this current generation, HD-DVD is the way to go. I'd personally avoid the first-generation Blu-Ray players and initial Blu-Ray discs like the plague.

If you can wait, I would. Things will become more clear with studio support (staying as it is or changing). And the players on both sides will have worked out their issues. And I'd sure Sony will have fixed (and re-released) their initial discs at some point.

Blu-Ray was poised for the win, IMO, but they are fouling up the first generation launch terribly. I'm not totally sold on HD-DVD (I want more studio support before I officially buy in), but they are definately mucking up things less than Sony is. If Sony doesn't get their act together (I personally think they will), studio support will likely change. But who knows... if HD-DVD gets enough of a support base, it is quite possible that both formats survive and do well.

Just my $0.02.
Old 05-27-06, 08:21 PM
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What's your budget?
Old 05-27-06, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by mbs
But who knows... if HD-DVD gets enough of a support base, it is quite possible that both formats survive and do well.

Just my $0.02.
The more I think about it the more I have to agree. I don't think its possible for Blu-ray to fail because it has too much support, but I think it could take it so long to get out of first gear that HD DVD will have dug in too far to completely kill off. I really think there is a chance that HD DVD and Blu-ray will have to share the HD video market.

I really hope my first Blu-ray player purchase is a combo player from someone like Denon so I no longer have to worry about one format or the other losing. Hopefully Blu-ray will give in on the combo player restriction sometime in 2007.

Personally I think it would be a good idea for Blu-ray to give in on this. For one they claim their disc format is superior and if that is true and those of us with HD DVD collections buy combo players we will start making all our future purchases in Blu-ray without worrying about replacing the HD DVDs we already own. That could be a way for Blu-ray to finally beat HD DVD by stealing away their customers.

Last edited by darkside; 05-27-06 at 08:44 PM.
Old 05-27-06, 10:37 PM
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Why should "all our future purchases" be in Blu-Ray? If there's no difference, I'll keep supporting HD-DVD, thank you very much.
Old 05-27-06, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Why should "all our future purchases" be in Blu-Ray? If there's no difference, I'll keep supporting HD-DVD, thank you very much.
He stated, "they claim their disc format is superior and if that is true..." It might be a big if, but if Sony truly believes their discs are/will be superior, he has a point. Sony should have nothing to fear from a dual-format player.

With a dual-format player no one will need worry about which format they support. Instead, we can all buy the releases we want. I'd much rather prefer watching movies I enjoy in either format that worrying and arguing about which of these formats will win this format war. Sony just needs to allow someone to make a dual-format player and I'll be first in line to snatch one up.
Old 05-27-06, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Randy810
Is the smartest thing to do is wait until the so called war is settled?
Pretty much, yes. Unless you have money to burn, or just really need to have an HD capable disc RIGHT NOW, the smartest thing is to wait.

Most people seem to have one format which they prefer, but since both aren't even out yet, its pointless to compare them. And its not really the early adopters that will decide which format (if any) will win the battle.
Old 05-27-06, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Why should "all our future purchases" be in Blu-Ray? If there's no difference, I'll keep supporting HD-DVD, thank you very much.
We all know that your an avid spokesman/advocate of HD-DVD, but stating: "there's no difference" in reference of Blu-Ray, is strictly unfair by anyone without overall observance of the Blu-Ray counterpart to efficiently compare.
Old 05-28-06, 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by SINGLE104
We all know that your an avid spokesman/advocate of HD-DVD, but stating: "there's no difference" in reference of Blu-Ray, is strictly unfair by anyone without overall observance of the Blu-Ray counterpart to efficiently compare.

Re-read what I said. I never stated that there was no difference.
Old 05-28-06, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Why should "all our future purchases" be in Blu-Ray? If there's no difference, I'll keep supporting HD-DVD, thank you very much.
Its purely an "if" statement. Basically if by next year when they get the bugs worked out the 50 GB Blu-ray versions are better than the HD DVD versions on dual format releases of the same film (something the BD supporters keep claiming will happen) then why not push for dual format players to win the HD DVD people over to your side.

If I was Sony and I had lost a few hundred thousand possible customers early on to HD DVD because of cost this is the way I would try and get them back a year or two down the road.

Strickly commenting on what the original poster asked, I agree waiting is by far the safest bet. However, if owning HD video is a must (as it was for many of us) HD DVD is really the best 1st generation format from a standpoint of cost and being ready for market.
Old 05-28-06, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by darkside
Basically if by next year when they get the bugs worked out the 50 GB Blu-ray versions are better than the HD DVD versions on dual format releases of the same film (something the BD supporters keep claiming will happen)
I really doubt there'll be a perceptible difference on movies released on both formats down the road just because I think to keep costs down, the format-agnostic studios will start using the same encodes for Blu-ray as they do for HD DVD.
Old 05-28-06, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Adam Tyner
I really doubt there'll be a perceptible difference on movies released on both formats down the road just because I think to keep costs down, the format-agnostic studios will start using the same encodes for Blu-ray as they do for HD DVD.
Exactly. There's absolutely no reason to believe that a BD version would be "better" than the HD DVD version. Just cause you have 50gb of room to play with doesn't mean it will be used.

Remember, BD is just another storage option. They're not going to use a different encode just for it. If they're fitting fine on an HD DVD, they're going to use the same encode for the BD.
Old 05-29-06, 03:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Randy810
Is the smartest thing to do is wait until the so called war is settled?
Yes. Not only will you avoid the financial risk, but you'll have a cheaper, bug-free player (second or third generation) and a wider movie selection (no need to buy a bad movie just to have some hidef to play).

The advantage of jumping in right now is instant gratification: packaged HD right here, right now.
Old 05-29-06, 04:32 AM
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When I do decide to jump in it will be with either a XBox 360 + HD DVD or PS3 + Blu Ray.

Granted you wont get all the bells and whistles but most of the cost will be for the game system side of things and so if i did choose the duff standard at least i'd still have a games system to play with .
Old 05-29-06, 06:34 AM
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Definitely wait, unless like others have said, you NEED HD right now and also have the money to burn. I don't regret purchasing my HD-D1 one bit, but it definitely has a fair amount of minor bugs that probably won't be around next generation, not to mention the newer players will startup/load much faster.
Old 05-31-06, 03:29 PM
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the way i understand it the compression formats are essentially the same, so its just storage form factor thats different. like compact flash vs sd:P makes it all a bit silly. bluray has more space but its basically irrelevant as special features spilling over to a second hddvd disc is not exactly a huge problem. right now its a tossup, i prefer hddvd because i dislike sony, and wouldn't want to suppor ttheir controlling a format considerng the shadiness they've been involved with, and their track record on previous formats.

its best to wait. the general consumer isn't going to bite for a while. we are used to cheap dvd and cheap dvd hardware. its all so convenient. at walmart one can get a divx+progressive magnavox or philips player for 30-50 dollars. name brand not junk! and the films cost squat these days. you can play them in your laptop, your 150 dollar portable dvd player in your car or whereever. its hard to beat the value. so hd won't compete for a while. i mean seriously, buying a film in hd to enjoy at home and then not being able to play it back to entertain the kids in the back just sucks. in the future i guess we could rip and transcode, but not likely soon.
Old 05-31-06, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by terisma
the way i understand it the compression formats are essentially the same,
Not really. At least, not in the beginning. BD will still be using the same codec as SD DVD. The results are yet to be seen.
Old 05-31-06, 04:07 PM
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True, but we have to be fair. Even though the first discs from the BD camp won't be using the best compression technology, the specs for the two formats are more similar than they are different in that regard. So technically terisma is correct. The discs we see in a year or two from the rival camps will have virtually identical image and sound quality capabilities. The only major difference between the formats at that point will be storage capacity.
Old 05-31-06, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by terisma
at walmart one can get a divx+progressive magnavox or philips player for 30-50 dollars. name brand not junk!
???

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