Format war bickering in the HD Talk forum
09-11-06 | 03:20 PM
#26
DVD Talk Hero
Originally Posted by Suprmallet
Namja,
I just wanted to make sure you got my email. I sent it before this thread was created, I didn't want to keep discussing it in the HD forum.
I just wanted to make sure you got my email. I sent it before this thread was created, I didn't want to keep discussing it in the HD forum.
09-11-06 | 05:22 PM
#27
New Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
that blitz dude got me banned for 3 days at AVS' high def forums which then in turn ticked me off and a mod there decided I was public enemy #1 and just banned me for 30 days simply because I actually asked him to do his job modding everyone and not just me.
I have no idea how it works here but I would just like to say that mods should be NEUTRAL when it comes to posts. If person A says something "against forum rules" as does person B then delete both posts not just that of person A. This is the crap I got at AVS simply because the mod there is a *$%^$@ and couldn't accept I didn't like his obvious bias against me and called him on it. He then went out of his way to delete almost every post I made even if it didnt come close to breaking rules. I would send him reports of posts that clearly broke the rules HE GAVE for that forum yet he wouldn't do anything about them. Furstrating to have a mod egg you on since they are supposed to be the classy people at a forum and imply everyone "should take the high road on every post" when in reality they act like 12 yr olds because someone doesn't kiss their ass. Love that hypocrisy. Nothing worse than when mods can't take some criticsm and go on power trips and vendettas and think they are God.
Sorry for my rant. Anyway, based on my limited time here I think the HD section doesn't seem bad but if you guys feel it is and change it then that's cool. Hopefully you mdos and I can be cool with each other and you guys wont make it your job to kick me off the forum for no reason.
I have no idea how it works here but I would just like to say that mods should be NEUTRAL when it comes to posts. If person A says something "against forum rules" as does person B then delete both posts not just that of person A. This is the crap I got at AVS simply because the mod there is a *$%^$@ and couldn't accept I didn't like his obvious bias against me and called him on it. He then went out of his way to delete almost every post I made even if it didnt come close to breaking rules. I would send him reports of posts that clearly broke the rules HE GAVE for that forum yet he wouldn't do anything about them. Furstrating to have a mod egg you on since they are supposed to be the classy people at a forum and imply everyone "should take the high road on every post" when in reality they act like 12 yr olds because someone doesn't kiss their ass. Love that hypocrisy. Nothing worse than when mods can't take some criticsm and go on power trips and vendettas and think they are God.
Sorry for my rant. Anyway, based on my limited time here I think the HD section doesn't seem bad but if you guys feel it is and change it then that's cool. Hopefully you mdos and I can be cool with each other and you guys wont make it your job to kick me off the forum for no reason.
09-11-06 | 11:02 PM
#28
Banned
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 15,957
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: NYC
rlindo,
the boards here are NOTHING compared to AVS. It's just a mess over there. I think you'll find DVDtalk is much more organized and open-minded. We may not have some of the "insiders" that AVS has but the people here sure are a helluva lot nicer.
welcome.
the boards here are NOTHING compared to AVS. It's just a mess over there. I think you'll find DVDtalk is much more organized and open-minded. We may not have some of the "insiders" that AVS has but the people here sure are a helluva lot nicer.
welcome.
09-13-06 | 02:24 PM
#29
DVD Talk Legend
And now the free-for-all, or "polite-discussion-a-thon," thread at HD Talk is closed.
09-13-06 | 02:38 PM
#32
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by Qui Gon Jim
In this case, not taking care of ONE member was the mistake.
Thanks, Spiky.
Thanks, Spiky.
09-13-06 | 02:50 PM
#33
DVD Talk Reviewer/ Admin
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 31,677
Received 2,787 Likes
on
1,853 Posts
From: Greenville, South Cackalack
Originally Posted by Jay G.
That you're so quick to lay the blame on one person is probably indicative of why the thread was closed.
The entire diode situation...at least for the couple of pages or posts...was ridiculous, and the skepticism of some users in that thread is not unwarranted. I've purged as many of those posts as I could quickly find and reopened the thread.
I'd prefer to see actual discussion, not bickering over the validity of unverifiable rumors.
09-13-06 | 03:12 PM
#34
Banned
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 15,957
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: NYC
Why don't you just close the whole thread down? It's obvious that there's been a diaper put on the whole forum at this point. If we're not allowed to debate and we're not allowed to post rumors, what the hell CAN we post???
I don't mean to be rude at all. It's just really frustrating. There's no reason that this all can't be debated in a civilized manner and I don't get where all of this is coming from. This isn't the first time something "unverifiable" was posted. Shall we go through all the posts today alone and post things that are speculation? Hell, we have an entire thread right now about a rumored 360 with HD DVD in console.
Honestly, I just feel this is getting too ridiculous.
I don't mean to be rude at all. It's just really frustrating. There's no reason that this all can't be debated in a civilized manner and I don't get where all of this is coming from. This isn't the first time something "unverifiable" was posted. Shall we go through all the posts today alone and post things that are speculation? Hell, we have an entire thread right now about a rumored 360 with HD DVD in console.
Honestly, I just feel this is getting too ridiculous.
Last edited by digitalfreaknyc; 09-13-06 at 03:15 PM.
09-13-06 | 03:45 PM
#35
DVD Talk Reviewer/ Admin
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 31,677
Received 2,787 Likes
on
1,853 Posts
From: Greenville, South Cackalack
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
If we're not allowed to debate and we're not allowed to post rumors, what the hell CAN we post???
You can't post a rumor, claim it's fact, and when anyone questions it, smirk at them or quip that they must be supporting "the other side".
09-13-06 | 03:57 PM
#36
Banned
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 15,957
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: NYC
Originally Posted by Adam Tyner
You can debate. You can post rumors.
You can't post a rumor, claim it's fact, and when anyone questions it, smirk at them or quip that they must be supporting "the other side".
You can't post a rumor, claim it's fact, and when anyone questions it, smirk at them or quip that they must be supporting "the other side".
So please tell me how I should have phrased the information that I had??
Look, I wasn't meaning to be snide or even sarcastic in my post. If it was taken as such, then I can't help that. I didn't insult anyone and I didn't do anything wrong. I just had a couple of people jumping down my throat and they all just so happen to have a stance towards the BD-side. Should I have not pointed that out? Or are we just not supposed to even talk about people's preferences and pretend we're all clearly cut down the middle?
And you can do a search. This is definitely NOT the first time I've mentioned this "rumor" on this board since i found out about it. It's just the first time people went apeshit.
09-13-06 | 09:34 PM
#37
DVD Talk Legend
Keeping in mind I'm not a moderator, and thus have no say in what is or isn't allowed, here's my opinion on what went wrong, and how to create a more healthy dialogue:
I still have a few of the quotes:
In both of these you present the idea of Toshiba and Microsoft as confirmed facts. You even insult a responder by suggesting they're having reading difficulties when they don't agree 100% with your claim.
When you finally admit you can't corroborate your claim, and someone says that it must then be considered an unsubstantiated rumor, you reply:
The off-the cuff response was possibly intended to be humorous, but gives the impression that you're dismissing his reasoning as not valid.
Probably in the context of, "I have heard from sources I cannot divulge...." If something's a widely known fact, then restating it doesn't need citations. However, if presenting new info, it's probably best to provide as much info as possible on where it came from so that others may judge its validity. I typically try to cite as many sources as I can for my posts.
Actually, you can. Communication is a two-way street, and language is inexact, doubly so when written down. People occasionally read things into what one writes that was never intended. However, it's not entirely their fault, as words can have different connotations when read different ways. Your responses should attempt to clarify and engage, instead of simply dismiss.
Probably not, no. You should be able to justify a claim or opinion regardless of where the challenge came from. Pointing out that the challenge came from someone with a different viewpoint than yours doesn't make the challenge less valid. And it certainly doesn't help to categorize everyone who challenges a point you make as being on "the other team." It comes off as partisanship.
I did a search, and couldn't find you mentioning Microsoft stockpiling blue laser diodes in any other thread.
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Since you deleted everything, I can't even defend myself.
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That's what the press is being told. Behind the scenes, the HD DVD camp is apparently doing just fine. 
Where do you think all those blue diodes went?
Where do you think all those blue diodes went?
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That may be a factor but, again, you don't seem to be reading. Toshiba/MS were the ones that bought up the blue diodes for their own personal use.
When you finally admit you can't corroborate your claim, and someone says that it must then be considered an unsubstantiated rumor, you reply:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Whatever makes you happy.
So please tell me how I should have phrased the information that I had??
Look, I wasn't meaning to be snide or even sarcastic in my post. If it was taken as such, then I can't help that.
I just had a couple of people jumping down my throat and they all just so happen to have a stance towards the BD-side. Should I have not pointed that out?
And you can do a search. This is definitely NOT the first time I've mentioned this "rumor" on this board since i found out about it. It's just the first time people went apeshit.
09-13-06 | 10:18 PM
#39
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
And with all due respect, you're the last person I'd take advice from about "healthy dialogue."
09-13-06 | 10:42 PM
#40
DVD Talk Special Edition
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 1,705
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Toledo, Ohio
Originally Posted by Jay G.
Keeping in mind I'm not a moderator, and thus have no say in what is or isn't allowed, here's my opinion on what went wrong, and how to create a more healthy dialogue:
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Since you deleted everything, I can't even defend myself.
I still have a few of the quotes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That's what the press is being told. Behind the scenes, the HD DVD camp is apparently doing just fine.
Where do you think all those blue diodes went?
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That may be a factor but, again, you don't seem to be reading. Toshiba/MS were the ones that bought up the blue diodes for their own personal use.
In both of these you present the idea of Toshiba and Microsoft as confirmed facts. You even insult a responder by suggesting they're having reading difficulties when they don't agree 100% with your claim.
When you finally admit you can't corroborate your claim, and someone says that it must then be considered an unsubstantiated rumor, you reply:
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Whatever makes you happy.
The off-the cuff response was possibly intended to be humorous, but gives the impression that you're dismissing his reasoning as not valid.
Quote:
So please tell me how I should have phrased the information that I had??
Probably in the context of, "I have heard from sources I cannot divulge...." If something's a widely known fact, then restating it doesn't need citations. However, if presenting new info, it's probably best to provide as much info as possible on where it came from so that others may judge its validity. I typically try to cite as many sources as I can for my posts.
Quote:
Look, I wasn't meaning to be snide or even sarcastic in my post. If it was taken as such, then I can't help that.
Actually, you can. Communication is a two-way street, and language is inexact, doubly so when written down. People occasionally read things into what one writes that was never intended. However, it's not entirely their fault, as words can have different connotations when read different ways. Your responses should attempt to clarify and engage, instead of simply dismiss.
Quote:
I just had a couple of people jumping down my throat and they all just so happen to have a stance towards the BD-side. Should I have not pointed that out?
Probably not, no. You should be able to justify a claim or opinion regardless of where the challenge came from. Pointing out that the challenge came from someone with a different viewpoint than yours doesn't make the challenge less valid. And it certainly doesn't help to categorize everyone who challenges a point you make as being on "the other team." It comes off as partisanship.
Quote:
And you can do a search. This is definitely NOT the first time I've mentioned this "rumor" on this board since i found out about it. It's just the first time people went apeshit.
I did a search, and couldn't find you mentioning Microsoft stockpiling blue laser diodes in any other thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Since you deleted everything, I can't even defend myself.
I still have a few of the quotes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That's what the press is being told. Behind the scenes, the HD DVD camp is apparently doing just fine.
Where do you think all those blue diodes went?
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That may be a factor but, again, you don't seem to be reading. Toshiba/MS were the ones that bought up the blue diodes for their own personal use.
In both of these you present the idea of Toshiba and Microsoft as confirmed facts. You even insult a responder by suggesting they're having reading difficulties when they don't agree 100% with your claim.
When you finally admit you can't corroborate your claim, and someone says that it must then be considered an unsubstantiated rumor, you reply:
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Whatever makes you happy.
The off-the cuff response was possibly intended to be humorous, but gives the impression that you're dismissing his reasoning as not valid.
Quote:
So please tell me how I should have phrased the information that I had??
Probably in the context of, "I have heard from sources I cannot divulge...." If something's a widely known fact, then restating it doesn't need citations. However, if presenting new info, it's probably best to provide as much info as possible on where it came from so that others may judge its validity. I typically try to cite as many sources as I can for my posts.
Quote:
Look, I wasn't meaning to be snide or even sarcastic in my post. If it was taken as such, then I can't help that.
Actually, you can. Communication is a two-way street, and language is inexact, doubly so when written down. People occasionally read things into what one writes that was never intended. However, it's not entirely their fault, as words can have different connotations when read different ways. Your responses should attempt to clarify and engage, instead of simply dismiss.
Quote:
I just had a couple of people jumping down my throat and they all just so happen to have a stance towards the BD-side. Should I have not pointed that out?
Probably not, no. You should be able to justify a claim or opinion regardless of where the challenge came from. Pointing out that the challenge came from someone with a different viewpoint than yours doesn't make the challenge less valid. And it certainly doesn't help to categorize everyone who challenges a point you make as being on "the other team." It comes off as partisanship.
Quote:
And you can do a search. This is definitely NOT the first time I've mentioned this "rumor" on this board since i found out about it. It's just the first time people went apeshit.
I did a search, and couldn't find you mentioning Microsoft stockpiling blue laser diodes in any other thread.
09-14-06 | 05:44 AM
#42
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,389
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Reading the comments again, I do understand. That does not exonerate the people taht got all hot and bothered by DF'scomments from taking personal jabs. And I'm not talking about you, Jay G.
I think we need to abandon this "no bashing" BS and just go after the people who can't discuss things like an adult. I love that thread, and there is useful info revealed there daily by supporters of both formats. HEALTHY discussion and debate should be allowed to happen.
I think we need to abandon this "no bashing" BS and just go after the people who can't discuss things like an adult. I love that thread, and there is useful info revealed there daily by supporters of both formats. HEALTHY discussion and debate should be allowed to happen.
09-14-06 | 08:37 AM
#43
Banned
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 15,957
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: NYC
Originally Posted by gcribbs
I think the HD forum needs this additional attention.
It should have the same no bashing rules as the video game forum.
It should have the same no bashing rules as the video game forum.
The problem is that the "censorship" is going beyond bashing at this point.
Last edited by digitalfreaknyc; 09-14-06 at 08:49 AM.
09-14-06 | 10:10 AM
#44
Retired
To use the VG forum as an example, we still express opinions all the time with the no bashing rules in affect.
It's just that people that want to "bash" say the Playstation 3 have to do so by intelligently outlining what they dont' like about it.
They can't just make stupid jokes, just say "Sony Sucks" etc. At the same time the mods crack down on people that make attacks at people who have opinions that differ from their own.
They place was unbearable during the PS2/X-box/GC launches 5 years or so ago. This go aroudn with the 360/PS3/Wii has been MUCH better so far because of the mods stopping those kind of basing posts from causing flame wars, and for many of the trolls that did a lot of the bashing either being banned, or just leaving the site on their own since then.
HD talk could benefit greatly from the same if members were required to post opinions, positive and negative, in an intelligent manner and refrain from out right bashing of the other format rather than just stating why they don't like it. That in in itself will eliminate a lot of the personal attacks, snide comments etc. and suspensions/subsequent bans will take care of the few trolls who can't play by the rules.
It's just that people that want to "bash" say the Playstation 3 have to do so by intelligently outlining what they dont' like about it.
They can't just make stupid jokes, just say "Sony Sucks" etc. At the same time the mods crack down on people that make attacks at people who have opinions that differ from their own.
They place was unbearable during the PS2/X-box/GC launches 5 years or so ago. This go aroudn with the 360/PS3/Wii has been MUCH better so far because of the mods stopping those kind of basing posts from causing flame wars, and for many of the trolls that did a lot of the bashing either being banned, or just leaving the site on their own since then.
HD talk could benefit greatly from the same if members were required to post opinions, positive and negative, in an intelligent manner and refrain from out right bashing of the other format rather than just stating why they don't like it. That in in itself will eliminate a lot of the personal attacks, snide comments etc. and suspensions/subsequent bans will take care of the few trolls who can't play by the rules.
09-14-06 | 04:11 PM
#45
DVD Talk Legend
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 17,816
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Work. Or commuting. Certainly not at home.
Originally Posted by Josh Hinkle
To use the VG forum as an example, we still express opinions all the time with the no bashing rules in affect.
It's just that people that want to "bash" say the Playstation 3 have to do so by intelligently outlining what they dont' like about it.
They can't just make stupid jokes, just say "Sony Sucks" etc. At the same time the mods crack down on people that make attacks at people who have opinions that differ from their own.
They place was unbearable during the PS2/X-box/GC launches 5 years or so ago. This go aroudn with the 360/PS3/Wii has been MUCH better so far because of the mods stopping those kind of basing posts from causing flame wars, and for many of the trolls that did a lot of the bashing either being banned, or just leaving the site on their own since then.
HD talk could benefit greatly from the same if members were required to post opinions, positive and negative, in an intelligent manner and refrain from out right bashing of the other format rather than just stating why they don't like it. That in in itself will eliminate a lot of the personal attacks, snide comments etc. and suspensions/subsequent bans will take care of the few trolls who can't play by the rules.
It's just that people that want to "bash" say the Playstation 3 have to do so by intelligently outlining what they dont' like about it.
They can't just make stupid jokes, just say "Sony Sucks" etc. At the same time the mods crack down on people that make attacks at people who have opinions that differ from their own.
They place was unbearable during the PS2/X-box/GC launches 5 years or so ago. This go aroudn with the 360/PS3/Wii has been MUCH better so far because of the mods stopping those kind of basing posts from causing flame wars, and for many of the trolls that did a lot of the bashing either being banned, or just leaving the site on their own since then.
HD talk could benefit greatly from the same if members were required to post opinions, positive and negative, in an intelligent manner and refrain from out right bashing of the other format rather than just stating why they don't like it. That in in itself will eliminate a lot of the personal attacks, snide comments etc. and suspensions/subsequent bans will take care of the few trolls who can't play by the rules.
... 100% Agreement.Now if you'll excuse me, I have to bash my head against the wall for an hour or so after dfnyc used the word "censorship" in this context.
09-14-06 | 04:37 PM
#46
Banned
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 15,957
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: NYC
Originally Posted by WildcatLH
... 100% Agreement.Now if you'll excuse me, I have to bash my head against the wall for an hour or so after dfnyc used the word "censorship" in this context.
Feel free to educate me and The Dictionary if it was improperly used.
09-14-06 | 04:49 PM
#47
DVD Talk Legend
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 17,816
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: Work. Or commuting. Certainly not at home.
And even you're to accept that definition (don't feel like having a semantics argument), this is a private site and they're free to "censor" any way they like. And if you don't like that, you're free to leave for AVS or any number of other forums that discuss this subject.
09-14-06 | 04:59 PM
#48
Banned
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 15,957
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From: NYC
Originally Posted by WildcatLH
And even you're to accept that definition (don't feel like having a semantics argument), this is a private site and they're free to "censor" any way they like. And if you don't like that, you're free to leave for AVS or any number of other forums that discuss this subject.
As are YOU, btw. Please don't forget that.
And luckily, we all have the ability to block those that we don't care to read posts from.
The poor mods are the ones who unfortunately have to wade through all the bullshit.
09-15-06 | 01:38 AM
#49
DVD Talk Legend
Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Of course it should. No one is disputing that. There shouldn't be bashing of forum members anywhere on DVDtalk. But there's constantly bashing of movie studios, releases, etc in every forum and I think to censor that is ridiculous. What are we all here for if not to give an opinion? If we wanted news, we could go to any blog or website that promotes itself as DVDNews. Fortunately, this is DVD TALK and as long as you're not threadcrapping and you're respectful to others, it should be tolerated.
The problem is that the "censorship" is going beyond bashing at this point.
The problem is that the "censorship" is going beyond bashing at this point.
I respectfully disagree.
I think the HD Forum needs the same rules that helped the VG Forum. I would actually like to get news about HD on DvdTalk although I am really not that interested in opinions on HD.
09-15-06 | 10:29 AM
#50
DVD Talk Hero
And now, we're bickering in the Feedback Forum about HD Talk Forum. Great. We will post a clearer guideline in the HD Talk Forum by 5 p.m. ET today.
Closing thread.
namja
Moderator, DVD Talk Forums
Closing thread.
namja
Moderator, DVD Talk Forums
