Stupid Caption Tricks!!

 
Old 12-29-03, 04:28 PM
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Stupid Caption Tricks!!

I'm catching up on DVDs during this holiday, but it isn't as fun as it should be. I've come to discover that some studios are idiots when it comes to caption placement. The most recent case, in fact, so recent I had to pause the movie to go and vent here on the forum (and look for solutions, but I didn't find any so now I'm just venting), is the Charlie's Angel's Full Throttle disc.

The stupid effing studio decided to put the captions in the matte portion of the picture and not in the image itself, where I'm sure they must have put them in theaters. This ticks me off because I mask out the black bars (on CRT and RPTV sets it is the cheapest most effective picture quality upgrade you can do), and so the captions are hidden (or rather 9/10ths of captions are hidden, I see just barely enough of the tops of them to know that they are there, but still have no chance of reading them).

This isn't the only disc made with this stupid layout, I've seen, and been annoyed by others. Is there a way to force player-generated captions out of the matte and into the image?
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Old 12-29-03, 04:30 PM
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On my player I can move the subtitles around. Check your manual and see if yours has this option.
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Old 12-29-03, 04:40 PM
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It's that an anamorphic release? If so, then there must be a means for moving the subtitles location.
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Old 12-29-03, 04:51 PM
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Yes, it is anamorphic - but I don't see what that has to do with anything. Either way, I don't see anything for moving the caption placemen - it is a denon 1600.
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Old 12-29-03, 04:57 PM
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Originally posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
Yes, it is anamorphic - but I don't see what that has to do with anything.
Okay . . . so where would the captions appear then when the DVD is viewed on a 16:9 television?
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Old 12-29-03, 05:43 PM
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In the matte area as I said in the original post. Please, if you don't understand the question, I don't think you are going to be able to help with an answer.
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Old 12-29-03, 06:02 PM
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Originally posted by Jah-Wren Ryel
In the matte area as I said in the original post. Please, if you don't understand the question, I don't think you are going to be able to help with an answer.
Instead of being rude to him, maybe you could word your question a little more clearly. The problem here is that most people here don't understand what you're doing.

To clarify, Jah-Wren cuts black matte board and tapes it to the front of his TV when watching a widescreen movie. The matte covers the black bars, which some people feel enhances the picture by making them completely invisible.

The problem is, the vast majority of people don't do this. The vast, vast majority of people benefit from having the subtitles in the black area because they are easier to read than they are when they're superimposed over the picture itself.

I have to vote with the studios with this one. They aren't idiots at all for placing the subtitles where the majority of viewers can read them easier.
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Old 12-29-03, 06:18 PM
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No, it's not how it appeared in theaters, so it's wrong! I don't buy movies that have this done.
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Old 12-29-03, 06:39 PM
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"Okay . . . so where would the captions appear then when the DVD is viewed on a 16:9 television?"

I think what he means here is-If it is on a widescreen TV, there will be no black bars for the subtitles to be printed on.It would have to appear on the movie picture itself.

Am I correct here?
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Old 12-29-03, 07:03 PM
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No, you're not correct. Player-generated subtitles are moved higher up on a 16:9 display.

His question is what I explained above. He tapes a piece of cardboard to his TV to black out the black bars. Any subtitles appearing in the black area will not be visible.

But then again, most people don't tape cardboard to the front of their TV sets.
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Old 12-29-03, 07:14 PM
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Mr Salty, you are right, I am being rude, but given my first posting it should be obvious I'm in a pissy mood about this so wasn't willing to cut him any slack for answering out of ignorance instead of asking like Outlaw did. To answer Outlaw - very few movies will have no black bars on a 16x9 set, 16x9 is 1.78:1 aspect ratio while most movies are either 1.85:1 or in the case of Charlie's Angels here, 2.35:1.

As for it being more readable - if the studio uses a font with a light color and a black outline it would be just as readable if not more so in image than in matte for those vast unwashed masses because there would be just as much contrast and less eye travel required to read the captions.

Also, FWIW, I don't tape black matte board to the front of my tv, I just used that as an example. I use a front projector with a manual masking system that will do 4:3, 1.78:1, 1.85:1 and 2.35:1. I realize that makes my setup even less common than spending $10 on matte board and velcro although it shouldn't be since a decent used projector and screen setup are easily cheaper than a new mediocre hi-def RPTV.


Hey Alan, for a guy with your alias your position ought to be predetermined on a topic like this.
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Old 12-29-03, 07:22 PM
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New-AgeOutlaw
If it is on a widescreen TV, there will be no black bars for the subtitles to be printed on.It would have to appear on the movie picture itself.
Mr. Salty-
Player-generated subtitles are moved higher up on a 16:9 display.
So I am correct then?

Groucho and Yakuza Bengoshi are suggesting that if the subtitles can appear in the black bars on a regular tv and "are moved higher up "on the image for 16:9 display, then apparently there is a function on the dvd player to allow the subtitles to be moved as needed.Is this a function done automatically by the dvdplayer or is it something that can be manually selected.

I don't think I can do this on my Player.
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Old 12-29-03, 07:29 PM
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I am not sure how to edit my post so I have to do another one.

So on a 16:9 screen there will still be black bars and the subtitles will still be printed on them.

So will the black bars still be wide enough to fit the whole subtitles on them or are they smaller.

Sorry for my misunderstanding,I thought Yakuza Bengoshi
was indicating that the subtitles would appear on the image.

PS Never mind.I found the edit button.
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Old 12-29-03, 07:45 PM
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On most players the subtitles are moved automatically by the player to accommodate a 16:9 display. I haven't seen a player that allows the user to reposition the subtitles, but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

With a 1.85:1 movie on a 16:9 display there should be no problem because the black bars are so thin the subtitles will be over the picture. The problem here is with wider movies, such as 2.35:1, which do still exhibit black bars on a 16:9 display.
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Old 12-29-03, 10:13 PM
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New-AgeOutlaw, you understood my point exactly. Even if I may have been incorrect, I still don't know, my question was how could the subtitles be a fixed position in the "matte" when the black area really isn't matted--at least not as I understand the term as it's used in the context of letterbox.

Though I didn't have an answer to Ryel's question, I thought my questions might point in the right direction. Apparently my questions weren't helpful.
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