Nick Martin

I read Scott Weinberg's DVD review of The Crow: Wicked Prayer at http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=16721 and...


If you're going to call David Boreanaz "So Likeably wooden", at least have the decency to note his show, "ANGEL", and not that damn Buffy show.

Aside from that, good review.

Liquid Death

I thought it was a great review - funny stuff

RyoHazuki

That was really worth starting a thread over?

mifuneral

I thought the review was hilarious, and I might even rent this movie now.

Nick Martin

Hey, if I want to post a comment about a review, no matter what that comment is, I will.

RyoHazuki

I wouldnt have it any other way.

Joe Molotov

You know, you really shouldn't buy or rent this movie and thus reward these filmmakers efforts in sinking another movie series deeper into the quadmire of direct-to-video craptitude. But after reading this review, I think I'm going to have to rent it. If Crow movies are going to suck no matter what, I suppose I may as well try to squeeze some enjoyment out of their suckiness, because unintentional entertainment is still entertainment, right?

Scott Weinberg

Just be sure to Netflix the thing. I can't imagine anyone would feel happy after dropping 20 bucks on it.

And thanks, guys! I appreciate the comments.

areacode212

This is a really entertaining review. Good stuff, keep it up! Also, I was kinda-sorta planning on seeing this anyway, but now my mind is made up. Can't wait for the 19th!

Nick Martin

On a side note, considering ANGEL is my all-time favorite series, I fully intend to see this movie for no other reason then the fact that Boreanaz is in it.

I saw the first two "Crow" films, and didn't know of a third until hearing about this fourth film- back when it was announced/filmed in 2003.

Josh Z

There's someone out there who likes Angel but doesn't like Buffy?

This is truly perplexing.

Nick Martin

To me they are like "Cheers" and "Frasier" - entirely different shows, and I find ANGEL to be vastly superior in every way.

As for that little blond slayer? She should have stayed dead at the end of season 5. I would continue, but it's off-topic.

Gizmo

...For someone that dosn't like Buffy that much, you talk like you have seen the entire run. Kinda surprising to watch 145 episodes if you hate it that much.

Also, keep in mind, Angel was a different character on Buffy then he was on his own show. He was very 'wooden'.

Nick Martin

I watched it after it started syndicated reruns - only to catch up with the histories of the ANGEL characters/stories that originated there.

I ended up watching the rest of the series for the heck of it, but hated the Buffy character herself (hearing/reading things about that character prevented me in gaining even the slightest interest in the rest of the show)

Slayer2005

Buffy and Angel are a hell of a lot more similar than Cheers and Frasier. Bad comparison. Angel feels like a darker version of Buffy. They are different and VERY similar at the same time. I find them to be almost equal to each other overall though. I put Buffy very slightly ahead of Angel because it had a longer run and started it all. If Angel had gone one more season I think it might have passed Buffy. They are by far my two favorite TVs show of all time. Actually my two favorite things shot on film ever really.

I know you hate that Angel will kind of be in Buffy's shadow, but instead of hating Buffy for that just be thankful that the show existed & that Joss came up with it, otherwise Angel would have ever even been invented.

Nick Martin

Thanks for making me want to vomit with disgust. How does having a slightly longer TV run and coming first equal better?

I'm not saying anything more about this here, because with a name like "Slayer2005", I knew you just had to be more of a Buffy fan than anything else.

ANGEL is, was, and always will be the best series I have ever had the honor to see.

Slayer2005

No need for hyperbole. Vomit in disgust for me ranking Buffy slightly ahead or being thankful that Buffy was made so that Angel could be made?

Buffy was voted #1 Greatest TV Show of all time on TV Guides' online poll, so it's not a negative thing to be ranked very slightly below it by a fellow fan. Angel is lucky (maybe lucky is the wrong word since it was made by Joss Whedon. ) to be in that class of masterpieces of television alongside Buffy.

Don't forget that I said Buffy was very "slightly" better overall. BTW, I use Angelus on most of my other accounts, so the username doens't mean jackbleep. I actually believe I most likely hold Angel the series in higher regard than you probably do even though I rank it slightly below Buffy (I actually paid $117 for Angel season 4 region 2. ). Still, it's nearly dead even with Buffy to me overall though.

It's not just because Buffy had a longer run or that it came first (although that does give the feeling that "If it werent' for this Angel wouldn't even exist" that makes me very thankful, because it gave us Angel.). I've taken the seasons and compared each one to Angel seasons and to me it's fairly even up until there are no more Angel seasons left to compare against, so Buffy kind of wins by default in my view.

Here's how I rate the seasons against each other:

Buffy Season 1 vs. Angel Season 1 Winner: Angel Season 1
Buffy Season 2 vs. Angel Season 2 Winner: Buffy Season 2
Buffy Season 3 vs. Angel Season 3 Winner: Tie (although I'd lean slightly towards Buffy S3 if I HAD to pick a winner)
Buffy Season 4 vs Angel Season 4 Winner: Angel Season 4
Buffy Season 5 vs. Angel Season 5 Winner: Buffy Season 5
Buffy Season 6 vs. Nothing
Buffy Season 7 vs Nothing

That's how I see it. I don't understand your hatred for the show though. Any Joss show is great. So what if Angel lives in Buffy's shadow. It's like Kobe Bryant living in Jordan's shadow. Not a bad shadow be to living in if you ask me.

My best friend and I discussed Buffy vs. Angel after I showed him all of both series (BTW, they are also now his two favorite things shot on film. So he LOOOOVES them both about as much as I do. Way cool that he got into both of them like me after expressing hate before watching them.). He too ranks Buffy very slightly above Angel (and he couldn't hold Ange in much higher regard than he already does. Trust me.). BTW, He bought the Angel sets but not the Buffy sets and can still basically say that "Buffy is a smidge better overall." (smidge being being very nearly a tie).

I wouldn't argue with someone that thinks they're equal or that Angel is a little better, but they're definitely not worlds apart and far different like Cheers and Frasier.

I believe one more Angel season (Damn Jordan Levin) could've been enough for me to rank it a little over Buffy.

Nick Martin

Let me make these last comments.

I'm not trying to convince you or anyone else, that one is better than the other.

You seem to be trying to convince me, though which really shouldn't matter to you.

You have no idea as to how much I love ANGEL or whether you like it more or less than me. (Just because you could afford to by the R2 sets just means you have more money to spend than I do, nothing more)

If you want to talk about favorite episodes, what you think of DVD extras, or what the cast/crew are doing next, I'm more than happy to talk- but this comparison...well I'm a lost cause- can't be convinced. Give me Boreanaz, Carpenter, Quinn (RIP), Denisof and Richards over Gellar, Hannigan, Head and Brendon anyday.

I'm glad for Joss Whedon. I want his name to be associated more with a hit space western epic instead of a blond ex-cheerleader who kills monsters.

Slayer2005

Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to convince you to change your opinion. I'm just sharing mine. Buffy and Angel are a bit different and also very similar. They are definitely not far different like Cheers/Frasier. They are different like Hercules/Xena are different from one another. Both similar to one another, but the first being lighter in tone and the latter being the darker series of the two (the latter series which has a darker leading character who has a dark and evil past).

Actually, I kind of wonder if the idea to do a Angel spinoff came about due to the success of Xena, which is a Hercules spinoff. Both characters started out evil on the original series, became very popular characters, and then had a spinoff series about them trying atone for their past evil deeds by fighting evil alongside a friend(s). Makes one wonder.

BTW, me naming the price I piad for AS4 was really just a joke, not really a real reason why I think I might possibly hold the show in slightly higher or equal regard (which was really just to show that I am really a huge fan of Angel too, not just Buffy. I consider myself to be pretty much an equal fan of Buffy & Angel). I just couldn't wait another year for the US release and my best friend had just finished season 3 and wanted to start season 4 asap, so I spent more than I would have liked too.

The reason I say I probably hold it in higher regard is because there is NOTHING out there (movies or TV) aside from Buffy that I love as much as Angel the series. Thankfully, my best friend shares a similar opinion too after having seen both series. So, there is stiill a chance that you hold it in slightly higher regard than I do if you like it more than all other pieces of filmed entertainment.

I'd rather Joss' name be associated with the blonde ex-cheerleader than his FireFly/Serenity space western/epic. I've long grown past feeling a little negative about the sound of the silly title and premise of the series. The title and the premise don't matter when the series is as great as Buffy and is made by someone as great as Joss Whedon. Joss Whedon didn't care how silly the title was and refused to change it, because he knew it didn't matter when virtually everything about the show is great. I know how most people think of the show due to the movie/title/sound or premise/etc, because I used to be one of them and so was my best friend (AND his girlfriend too). Now I couldn't care less if she was once a cheerleader or that her name is weird. None of that makes a show or its characters.

About Firefly, it started out kind of slow, but did start to get pretty good and I'm sure it might have become great (although I still don't believe it could've ever reached the level of Buffy/Angel). IMO it is a bit overrated now due to its early demise, but that's ok because it's just something else of Joss Whedon's to be raved about and hailed as a masterpiece. Personally, I don't even know if I'd rank it over Buffy's first season (which isn't a bad thing), because I know I didn't care/like the characters more at the same time and it definitely wasn't as fun as Buffy. I started to enjoy the characters, but they' were not 1/100 the characters Buffy/Angel's are to me. That kind of love usually takes more than 13 episodes. Too bad it was cancelled though.

I am looking forward to Serenity a lot though. It's my #1 must see film this year because of Joss Whedon writing/directing. I really hope he resurrects his TV career in the near future by doing an Angel spinoff, Faith Spinoff or some new slayer spinoff (hell, ANYTHING Buffyverse). 2 hour films will not be enough Whedon entertainment for me. lol.

We'll have to agree to disagree about the Buffy/Angel thing.

I plan to check out Wicked Prayer because Boreanaz is in it. I have only seen the first Crow. God I rambled on for too long. Thank God I type fast.

joltaddict

I was with you til that.

Slayer2005

lol.

I'm well aware it's a love it or hate it season, but I LLLLLLLLOVED season 4 of Angel. Infact there was a ranking of of seasons on another message board and Season 4 had the second most votes for the #1 Angel season, but at the same time had the highest number of votes as the #5 ranked season. It also had the #1 most #2 total rankings, so it was a bit in favor of a "LOVED IT" season, but it's definitely a seasons with the most noticiable split. Most that liked it seem to rank it in the top to while that that didn't usually rank it right at the bottom. I don't recall there being very many votes for season 4 after #2 and before #5 (possibly none). I'm glad to be in the "loved it" group though.

I'm a big fan of long story arcs (very few stand alones. Made it feel like a novel unfolding before my eyes instead of a short forgettable movie. Very cool.) and this one was a rollercoaster ride from beginning to end and felt like it was closing in on the finale by around episode 8 or 9 (and then again later!!!). I'd never seen a series have so much momentum like that early on. Simply put, it was so compelling and addictive I forgave any flaws (like what happened to Cordy, whom I loved.). I have it about tied with Angel season 3. To me it was the most addictive season of either Buffy or Angel, but not necessarily the best. I guess I eventually understood why some fans didn't like it as much as the other seasons, but it was too addictive for me to complain.

There are others who agree with me and those who don't. I'm in the "I can't get how someone wasn't in awe of season 4 crowd though". Sorry.

I believe Nick will back me up on season 4 of Angel (I seem to recall him replying to someone who replied to my post in an Angel season 4 thread).

Nick Martin

The best thing about Buffy Season 4 for me was "Pangs"- where Angel returns, and Spike is used as a pincushion (probably the funniest thing I've ever seen on that show) and the episode "The Yoko Factor"- where Angel returns(again), beats the shit out of Riley, and Giles ges drunk.

ANGEL season 4....one 22 part episode, which was epic in every sense. I loved every minute of it. Who doesn't love the "Rain Of Fire" battle with The Beast?

As for my love of all things ANGEL- never have I cared so much about those characters, stories, and well, everything.

Some people consider the original "Star Trek" to be the greatest thing there is, I consider ANGEL to be the greatest thing there is.

Josh Z

Enough with the Buffy and Angel. This thread is supposed to be about bashing lousy Crow sequels.

Corvin

Nick Martin

Okay, back to topic-

I've just (as in a few seconds ago on my DVD-ROM) finished watching "Wicked Prayer", and as I always knew that David Boreanaz was going to be the one and only reason I wanted to see this, he was easily the best aspect of the whole movie, which itself was all right, but too disjointed in that the reasons behind everything going on, as well as the history of the characters (told through very disjointed flashbacks) needed to be made a bit clearer.

I certainly didn't see Angel or Angelus in this guy- Luc Crash was just plain nuts!
Everything I had read about his over-the-top performance was true, but that's why I liked him so much...it also doesn't hurt that he was wearing that ridiculous tux in the end. "Wooden"? In this film he's more like "superball".

As for Dennis Hopper...if he wasn't aware of how silly he sounded spouting off those hip-hop terms, he needs to be committed.

Intentionally funny or not, I suggest everyone reading this go and give it a rent. I actually had to track it down because the video store closest to me (a Blockbuster that had around 10 copies of the film) rented them all out.