robot

just trying to get an idea of how much these things typically cost...

... and can you tell me what some good models are?

Thanks!

Frank S

First off stay clear of Pioneer's ripoff DVD player the DV434 as they claim Progressive scan but it is simply a DVD player with a line doubler (and not a very good one to boot). This is why it is so much cheaper then other true Progressive scan players.


Models to look for are Toshiba's 5109, 6200, 9200, Pioneer's DV37, and Sony's 9000ES. The Sony, Pioneer and Toshiba 9200 are much more expensive becuase of added abilities for playing either DVD-Audio or SACD. The Toshiba 5109 can be found in the $350+ range as they have been replaced with a newer generation 6200 a few months ago. Panasonic, JVC also make Progressive scan players and I have not heard any horror story about any of these as well so these would be good choices as well.

One more thing... I wanted to be sure you are aware that Progressive scan DVD players will only be of benefit to those who own HDTV's or ones that can at least display a 480p (Progressive) picture. Make sure your TV has this ability or you will be paying extra money for something you will get not be able to take advantage of!

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My DVD/LD List
My Home Theater Equipment

[This message has been edited by Frank S (edited January 05, 2001).]

PoorBoy

Considering I bought my old Toshiba 3108 back in 1998 for $450, I could easily justify spending upwards of $700 on a progressive scan player. Actually just recently I purchased the Pioneer DV-37 Progressive scan player for $625. That was the best price I could find anywhere for the player. What sucks is either Pioneer is sucking some serious ass getting the players to their distributers (underestimated the demand), or the place I ordered it from just plain sucks. Been about a month now and still so sight of the DV-37, although the receiver I ordered is already here...

palebluedot

I paid $650 for my Mitsubishi DD6000 and it is a great player. It has great picture and sound and I have not had a single problem so far.

BTW it retails for $999

djones6746

$500

I will purchase one when I finally purchase an HDTV ready 16X9 TV!!!


As FrankS stated...stay away from Pioneers supposed progressive scan player!!!



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"You know Andy...I never thought it would come to this....Mayberry....Gateway to danger."

Barney Fife

Pharoh

First all "progressive scan" DVD players use line doublers, just with extremely varying levels of quality. Considering that you can only hook up these types of players to Digital capable tvs you have to get a player that uses a better doubler than that of the TV. Expect to pay a minimum of 800 to 1500. The new Denon will be 799 and looks very promising. Just my .02

steve f

The Toshiba 6200 is a very good player and sells in the $550-$600 range on the net. I've had one for 7 months and really like it.

ppc

Hi,
I have a question on the pioneer DV-37 progressive scan player. I just received this player, and I connected it to my RPTV via 2 connection methods, one with S-video, and the other with component video with 480p. I tried to calibrate my TV with VE. However, I noticed the picture from the S-video connection is quite a bit brighter on my TV than the component video connection. Do any of you experience the same thing. Is there something wrong with my DVD player or my TV, which is a couple of years old now, but it accepts 480P input.

Thanks
Paul

Ali-Man

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Pharoh:
First all "progressive scan" DVD players use line doublers, just with extremely varying levels of quality. Considering that you can only hook up these types of players to Digital capable tvs you have to get a player that uses a better doubler than that of the TV. Expect to pay a minimum of 800 to 1500. The new Denon will be 799 and looks very promising. Just my .02<HR>

Just to clarify Pharoh's message ...
All DVD's are mastered in progressive video. Therefore, progressive DVD players are designed to pass through the "unaltered" image to and 480p capable television. Therefore, no line-doublers are used. Some tv's take the 480p image (infact all images) and up-convert to 1080i (Sony XBR for example).

Just wanted to clear that up since it can be very confusing.
Ali-Man

Movie_Man

Based on reviews of CES/VSDA, it looks like there will be a lot more selection at much better prices for progressive players this year. Many will also include DVD-audio, so my advice would be to wait for the new models.

Hannibal

Movie_Man is right, in fact if you go over to http://dvdfile.com and read their report from CES on new progressive players from most of the makers, their are alot that will retail for $399.00. Internet prices are usually 30-35 percent cheaper. Most of the rollouts of the new models will be in February or March. I'd wait a little longer.



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"Tonight we make soap. To make soap, first we render fat."
Tyler Durden

bdshort

I think some TVs have different calibration levels for different inputs. Just calibrate each one seperately with VE and you'll be fine.

Brian

quote:<HR>Originally posted by ppc:
Hi,
I have a question on the pioneer DV-37 progressive scan player. I just received this player, and I connected it to my RPTV via 2 connection methods, one with S-video, and the other with component video with 480p. I tried to calibrate my TV with VE. However, I noticed the picture from the S-video connection is quite a bit brighter on my TV than the component video connection. Do any of you experience the same thing. Is there something wrong with my DVD player or my TV, which is a couple of years old now, but it accepts 480P input.

Thanks
Paul<HR>

Frank S

ppc
You do realize that when you are playing the DVD player through the S-video you are only getting a Interlaced (non-progressive) signal? You only get a Progressive Scan picture through the Component output. Yes it is normal for the Interlaced S-Video output to have different brightness, color, tint etc... then the Progressive Component output. The best thing to do is to calibrate the TV when in Progressive mode (Component output) and write down the settings, then switch the TV to Interlaced (S-Video) and calibrate the TV again and write down the settings. Then you can quickly change the settings when going from Progressive to Interlaced modes. If you are luckly like some of us your TV will let you set different settings for each input in which case you can just hook up each connection and calibrate to each input on the TV.


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My DVD/LD List
My Home Theater Equipment

[This message has been edited by Frank S (edited January 11, 2001).]

Pharoh

quote:<HR>Originally posted by Ali-Man:
Just to clarify Pharoh's message ...
All DVD's are mastered in progressive video. Therefore, progressive DVD players are designed to pass through the "unaltered" image to and 480p capable television. Therefore, no line-doublers are used. Some tv's take the 480p image (infact all images) and up-convert to 1080i (Sony XBR for example).

Just wanted to clear that up since it can be very confusing.
Ali-Man

<HR>

I have not been led to believe that this is true, as a pure progressive output would bypass the 5C copy protection and bring mass copyright lawsuits. The way around this is to double digitally before the signal is outputed. Even the Sony 9000 uses a line doubler chip, which they even boast about. They freely talk about the new top of the line Genesis doubler. So where I agree that all DVDs are mastered in Progressive, no present players output that pure signal. Again what I have been led to believe by the manufacturers. But?

DigIt

I have heard the same thing that
Ali-Man has stated, but I believe that Pharoh is actually correct. The advantage in a progressive player is that the signal is not converted to analog - the player should take the native digital signal and perform the "line doubling" before outputting the signal, thus avoiding an unneccessary extra stage and resulting degradation. (Of course, not all players do this correctly.)
Still, Ali-Man's post is something I have often heard. Can anyone confirm which is correct?

Ali-Man

quote:<HR>Originally posted by DigIt:
I have heard the same thing that
Ali-Man has stated, but I believe that Pharoh is actually correct. The advantage in a progressive player is that the signal is not converted to analog - the player should take the native digital signal and perform the "line doubling" before outputting the signal, thus avoiding an unneccessary extra stage and resulting degradation. (Of course, not all players do this correctly.)
Still, Ali-Man's post is something I have often heard. Can anyone confirm which is correct?<HR>

Thanks a lot DigIt and Pharoh.
Now I have more research to do on this damn progressive image stuff. I wish was an a/v dealer and could make money on being so informed but unfortunately I am just trying to be an informed consumer. I am going to consult my "expert" source and I'll post what I find out.
There has to be something up because if all progressive players do use line-doublers, than the picture on the TV should be no better than a TV using a line-doubler on an interlaced image but they definitely are not. You can't tell me the $399 to $899 Toshibas are just using better line doublers. I've seen the Toshiba 5109 versus the 2200 with DVDO-i and the 5109 was better in my mind.
On to better knowledge.
Ali-Man

DigIt

It took me a while, but I found this page: http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/vidprog.htm
If you look at the second section, there is a good illustration that shows how a prog-scan DVD player should behave in comparison with other line-doubling techniques.

Also, I'm not quite sure, but it's possible that the player does not need to de-interlace the signal because it gets full frames from the DVD. If true, this would be another benefit over doubling the interlaced output from a regular DVD player.

robot

just wanted to thank you all for the extremely helpful posts!

Currently i'm leaning towards a Toshiba Progressive scan DVD player and an Infocus projector (lp340 or 350).

If anyone thinks this combo is bad, please let me know.

Thanks again all you dvd studs!