Anamorphic, progressive dvds
08-07-00 | 06:48 PM
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Hi all,
I'm a newbie to the whole anamorphic/progressive technology. Now, I'm in the market for a new TV and also considering a progressive scan dvd player, namely, the Toshiba 5109. Hence, I have several questions:
1) I know anamorphic dvds have more horizontal lines than non-anamorphic dvds. If I view an anamorphic disc and a non-anamorphic disc (both widescreen discs) on a regular 4:3 HD-ready set like the Sony 36XBR 400 using progressive output, what is the difference? Will there be vertical compression, etc, and how will the picture quality differ?
2) If I view the same two discs in interlaced mode, what will happen?
3) What if I repeat the above two steps in a HD ready 16:9 set? Will I see black bars on the top and bottom?
4) Will a progressive scan player output non-anamorphic dvds in progressive mode?
Thanks!!
I'm a newbie to the whole anamorphic/progressive technology. Now, I'm in the market for a new TV and also considering a progressive scan dvd player, namely, the Toshiba 5109. Hence, I have several questions:
1) I know anamorphic dvds have more horizontal lines than non-anamorphic dvds. If I view an anamorphic disc and a non-anamorphic disc (both widescreen discs) on a regular 4:3 HD-ready set like the Sony 36XBR 400 using progressive output, what is the difference? Will there be vertical compression, etc, and how will the picture quality differ?
2) If I view the same two discs in interlaced mode, what will happen?
3) What if I repeat the above two steps in a HD ready 16:9 set? Will I see black bars on the top and bottom?
4) Will a progressive scan player output non-anamorphic dvds in progressive mode?
Thanks!!
08-08-00 | 01:55 AM
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From: Northern Virginia
jyh168, you may be a newbie but at least your asking the right questions.
First, let me state that I have the 5109 and think it is a great player. However, if I were buying now, I'd go with the 6200 and not the discontinued 5109. The 6200 will give you more options than the 5109 and some improvements that are too technical for this response. In short, get the 6200 -- it will only cost a little more.
Response to (1) and (2): I am not familiar with the Sony 36 XBR 400, so I cannot specifically answer your question. However, assuming that it is a 4:3 set and assuming it can properly handle a 16:9 image -- ie. progressive squeeze -- then you will get 33% more lines with the anamorphic disk (progressive or interlaced). You will get more lines either way, however, the progressive signal will display all 480 lines at once, rather than interlaced 240 lines. You will notice the difference with a progressive player, particularly with an anamorphic disc.
Response to (3): The same will happen with a 16:9 set -- which I recommend. You may still get black bars. It all depends on the aspect ratio of the DVD. 16:9 has a ratio of about 1.77:1. So if the aspect ratio is 1.77:1 you will not get any black bars. Typically, people only notice the black bars on apsect ratios higher than 1:85:1 (which is very close to 1.77) So if your watching your favorite 2.39:1 film, you will still have black bars -- only much smaller than you would get if your watching on a 4:3 set. (Same goes whether progressive or interlaced),
Response to (4): Yes, but with a big but (this is one of the reasons I recommend that 6200 over the 5109). A progressive player will output any DVD as progressive (if it is setup right). The problem is complex in that many current model sets will assume that any progressive signal is anamorphic and strech the image as if it were anamorphic.
If the DVD is non-anamorphic, the picture will leave everyone short and fat. Notably, the Toshiba 16:9 sets do not have this problem, nor do the 2001 Mits models. Other than that, most sets will have have this "problem."
To get around this, you need a player like the 6200, which can output a progressive 4:3 image, the Panasonic 1000 ($1600+) or an expensive scaler ($1800+).
Don't let this one issue stop you. I get around this by using the progressive output for anamorphic discs and the s-vid output for non-anamorphic discs. Works great and this is an easy solution.
In short if your set can handle a 480p signal, you need a progressive player. The 6200 is currently available and the least expensive progressive player (other than the 5109). Buy it and you will be happy with both anamorphic and non-anamorphic discs.
(I also recommend a 16:9 set, but I'm biased against 4:3 HD sets)
------------------
Dave
My DVD List
First, let me state that I have the 5109 and think it is a great player. However, if I were buying now, I'd go with the 6200 and not the discontinued 5109. The 6200 will give you more options than the 5109 and some improvements that are too technical for this response. In short, get the 6200 -- it will only cost a little more.
Response to (1) and (2): I am not familiar with the Sony 36 XBR 400, so I cannot specifically answer your question. However, assuming that it is a 4:3 set and assuming it can properly handle a 16:9 image -- ie. progressive squeeze -- then you will get 33% more lines with the anamorphic disk (progressive or interlaced). You will get more lines either way, however, the progressive signal will display all 480 lines at once, rather than interlaced 240 lines. You will notice the difference with a progressive player, particularly with an anamorphic disc.
Response to (3): The same will happen with a 16:9 set -- which I recommend. You may still get black bars. It all depends on the aspect ratio of the DVD. 16:9 has a ratio of about 1.77:1. So if the aspect ratio is 1.77:1 you will not get any black bars. Typically, people only notice the black bars on apsect ratios higher than 1:85:1 (which is very close to 1.77) So if your watching your favorite 2.39:1 film, you will still have black bars -- only much smaller than you would get if your watching on a 4:3 set. (Same goes whether progressive or interlaced),
Response to (4): Yes, but with a big but (this is one of the reasons I recommend that 6200 over the 5109). A progressive player will output any DVD as progressive (if it is setup right). The problem is complex in that many current model sets will assume that any progressive signal is anamorphic and strech the image as if it were anamorphic.
If the DVD is non-anamorphic, the picture will leave everyone short and fat. Notably, the Toshiba 16:9 sets do not have this problem, nor do the 2001 Mits models. Other than that, most sets will have have this "problem."
To get around this, you need a player like the 6200, which can output a progressive 4:3 image, the Panasonic 1000 ($1600+) or an expensive scaler ($1800+).
Don't let this one issue stop you. I get around this by using the progressive output for anamorphic discs and the s-vid output for non-anamorphic discs. Works great and this is an easy solution.
In short if your set can handle a 480p signal, you need a progressive player. The 6200 is currently available and the least expensive progressive player (other than the 5109). Buy it and you will be happy with both anamorphic and non-anamorphic discs.
(I also recommend a 16:9 set, but I'm biased against 4:3 HD sets)
------------------
Dave
My DVD List
08-09-00 | 01:02 AM
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From: Reading, PA
I have the 5109 & the Toshiba DW65X91 HDTV. Before I had a Sony player & 4x3 tv. If your tv has progressive inputs, the picture will look better. I would think only 16x9 & 4x3 tvs that do the squeeze would be progressive, so with them you will see a difference. Aleve90 is right about non-anamorphic dvds. My friend has a Mitsubishi HDTV & it won't let him change the picture size/type while the signal is progressive. If the tv has 2 composite video-ins, you could use the interlaced composite-out or the s-video for non-anamorphic. I got lucky that my HDTV lets me change the screen for progressive, so I can watch non-anamorphic that way. If you can't, the picture will look much worse interlaced (at least on a big HDTV). Before I got the 5109, the image wasn't as sharp & even on anamorphic movies I would get pixelation around moving objects pretty frequently. Non-anamorphic were even worse. Of course on a smaller tv everything will look better. With the 5109 on my HDTV, since I can still watch progressively, the non-anamorphic look much better now (almost as good as anamorphic- but not quite as sharp). So I'd pick up the 5109 & try to get a 16x9 HDTV that lets you change the screen type with a progressive signal. Screen types are 4x3 standard (puts bars on the left & right to make screen 4x3), 4x3 Full (expands picture to the sides- used for anamorphic), Wide1 (expands a little & cuts a little of the top & bottom- mix of Full & Wide2), Wide2 (cuts some picture off the top & bottom of a 4x3 picture & makes whats left fill the whole screen- used for non-anamorphic, just takes off some of the black bars since that's whats at the top & bottom & sizes it the same as the anamorphic do), & 16x9 mode (you can't pick this mode, it automatically comes on when you get an HDTV signal). HDTV is another good reason to get the proper tv now rather than later. The broadcasts are definitely even clearer than dvd & look amazing on a huge HDTV.
