i don't care about going from 5.1 to 6.1 or 7.1, don't need component switching, or any more connections, etc.
all i'm wondering about is will there be differences in the dimensionality of the soundstage, etc.

right now i have a reciever that came with a HTIB. it has DD, DTS.
i just got some new speakers and one of the things i notice right away, is that i can set the reciever much lower to achieve the same sound level as before ( now its 35-40 db, where before it was 27-32 db).

the reciever i have now is listed at 100w per chan, but i remember reading somewhere its actually only about 33-35 w.

what would a true 75 w/chan reciever bring to these speakers?

Which receiver do you have. Most HTIB has cost reduced receivers but a few have good receivers straight from the standard line. So without that info its hard to tell.

It would help to know what speakers also.

As bfrank has already mentioned, it is tough to tell what kind of improvements will be had without knowing where you started from. But here are some common improvements that will occur when going to a good quality receiver.

First and foremost you generally get better components not only in the amplifier section, but in the power supply section as well. The most immediately noticeable improvement here is significantly better transient response. This is the ability to provide immediate and dynamic changes in volume, especially on the loud side. Explosions are an excellent example of a transient. These will sound cleaner and be more...well...explosive. The transition from soft to loud will be a lot more apparent and defined; again, especially on the loud side.

Additional quality power will also give more and better head room to help prevent distortion. And you will almost always get a richer, more defined and more responsive bottom end. Even if you are using a powered sub (one with its own amplifier built in) there are still some improvements to be had in the under 200Hz range for your mains, especially if the sub is crossed over at 50-60Hz.

As far as other differences, more info is needed.

sorry,
should have known better.

the reciever is the Kewood ( i think its the vr 407?)
i'll make sure later.

the speakers are Onix Rockets rs 250's w/ the 200 center.

i've had it on for the last 7 hours or so, and i can definitely hear a change in the bookshelfs at this point.
they've mellowed out a bit, and it seems like the soundstage and imaging have expanded a little.

when i first hooked them up, they had a fairly boxy sound, now the soundfield is starting to fill in.
the sweet spot seems to be confined to right down the middle, even a little bit of off axis listening tends to collapse this.
in the right spot, though, the sound has improved a lot for 2 channel listening ( i had to check several times and make sure there was no sound coming out of the center).

i have 30 days to evaluate them, and am trying to keep an open mind and give them a fair shake.

for this reason, i'm wondering how much of an improvement a new reciever will bring.

Better electronics can make a surprising difference. A quality amplifier circuit can provide an almost night and day difference, especially on the "staging" or "soundstage" aspect. I have done demonstrations between amplifiers when peoples eyes light up as the soundstage drastically increases and opens up. I have heard soudstage increase from an apparent two feet above and below the speakers to an easy 6-10 on the same music, same speakers, but different amplifiers.

It can make a discernible difference. Take some music that you know well (and maybe listen again paying closer attention to staging and imaging) to a local, quality brick and mortar. Some lines to look for (in alphabetical order): Denon, Harmon Kardon, Marantz, Onkyo, Pioneer Elite, Sony ES, Yamaha to mention some of the biggies. See if they have some of the regular line Pioneer, Sony or Kenwood stuff and have them switch between while playing your material.

Be fore-warned! You are on a dark and dangerous path. As you learn the lingo and fine tune your listening ability you may find your taste rapidly exceeding your budget.

Best of luck

-Shawn

Sorry, forgot about the speakers. I am not familiar with the name or the model numbers, so I can't give an honest opinion there. Maybe check into some competitive stuff when you check out receivers and audition other speakers as well.

Some advice though. Listen seperately for different things. Listen to differences on receivers, switching between models and then when you are done listen to speakers. Auditory recall tends to be short, so stay on target. It may also help to narrow in on one aspect at a time such as stage width, or height, then switch and listen to vocal positioning, switching for that. Also, listen to passages that move up and down in frequency. Saxophones, guitars if they start low and pianos are good (anything else that goes from low to high wil work) for this because of the ranges they fall in. What you are looking for is sound from a single source that traverses from woofer to tweeter. This can be a problem area for many speakers as you will hear them shift in their performance, that is the imaging and staging will change from woofer to tweeter.

Don't let salesman bias or eagerness sway you. If you get a jerk, tell him/her you don't want to waste their time and if they could please show you how to operate the switcher it will realy help and they can get to other customers.

Again, best of luck!

Shawn,
thanks, that gives me hope that a reciever upgrade might give me the 'room' i'm looking for.
also, the how to/what to listen for primer is much appreciated. i'll be doing that.
after a few more hours here is what i am hearing/noticing

-although i can have the volume set pretty low for 2 channel music (compared to using the regular speakers), i still have to dial it in to the same level for HT use (around -28-30db).
-also there is already a wider dynamic range.
quiet passages can be REAL quiet, and then when there is a loud noise, explosion, etc it can get LOUD.
its almost like going from DD (with the old cheap speakers) to DTS with the new ones.
the cheaper speakers seemed like the dynamic range was more compressed.
actually, i kind of liked that. it wasn't fatiguing to listen to- i didn't strain to hear something one minute only to madly dash for the volume control the next to turn it down.

here's the speakers in case anybody wants the specs etc.
www.rocketloudspeakers.com

i'm not entirely sold on the value per cost of these yet (one of their main selling points), but i have to admit that they are physically beautiful and impressive objects.
and damn heavy.

Those speakers are marketed by the same company that markets Swan Divas and they look similar.

My gut feeling is that you will hear a considerable difference. It also depends on how much you are willing to spend on a new receiver. If you can swing a $650-750 receiver like the Denon 3802 or the Onkyo SR-700, I'm sure that you will instantly notice a difference over your old Kenwood. Although there are some very nice receivers in the $400 range, the sound difference will probably not be as large.

I had a Denon 2801 that sounded great......
I upgraded to a Harmon Kardon 520 and it sounds AWESOME!!
It really depends on the construction of the unit (power supply, DAC's, etc.)

i ended up w/ an Onkyo 600 that was open-boxed pretty cheap.
yes i do hear a difference, but it seems to be more with amplification that actually tonal qualities. and the soundstage is a little airier, but not exceptionally so.
another thing i am noticing is much more sibilance.
in fact, from just a sound quality stand-point, i hate this reciever.
the Kenwood sounded a little more congested in every respect, but man o man, there seems like an awful lot of distortion now on everything i play.
like the asthetics of the Onkyo, and the ergonomics of the remote aren't too bad (its just way too big), but there is no way i would keep this reciever with these speakers.
i will probably try a HK next, as its the only other option, unless i can find a place that will rent me a Denon for a week or two.

one thing i did find out was using the DSP orchestra mode gave me the holographic dimension i was craving, at least on instrumental selections.
sounds like crap on most else, as does the other dsp modes.

It depends on your ears and the speakers. Higher end equipment will have a smoother fuller sound at lower volume settings. But you need the speakers and the ears to notice a difference. Years ago I worked in a Stereo Shop and could tell the difference between componenets played through the same speakers. Music tends to be more demanding than Home Theater though, but much depends on your tastes.

Have you thought about using an external amp with your current receiver? If it has pre-outs (which it probably does not due to its HTIB nature) adding an external amp will provide a much larger upgrade then a new receiver if you are happy with your current receiver's processing modes.

When i added an external 5 channel Parasound amp to my Pioneer Elite receiver, I noticed a much larger increase in sound quality then the change from my Sony db830 to the Pioneer Elite 35tx. Now if/when a new processing mode comes down the road that I really need (very doubtful for the next few years) I can upgrade to a new receiver/processor and keep my current amplification. I would classify going the seperates route the best investment I have made in my home theater to date.

J

Jim R.
would you happen to know of any good speaker stores in Rochester?
i was going to hit a place in Batavia next week to check out Energys, PSB, and M & K's.

would really like to find a place where i can hear Sonus Faber and Vienna Acoustics.

Master J;
that does sound like a good idea, currently thats a no-go with the Kenwood, but i will be looking for that ability in the next reciever i upgrade to.
the kenwood didn't have DSP modes either, so i probably would get something else anyway.

i read some good reviews of the HK-AVR520 so i'll definitely be picking that up to check it out.
wanted to do it today, but i wait till next week.
i want to get used to the sound of the Onkyo, so that i will better be able to tell a difference.