bfrank

LucasFilm Sell 60% Share of THX to Creative Labs

http://www.highfidelityreview.com/ne...snumber=499199

zargon

THX really isn't what it use to be. With pieces of equipment like Kenwood getting THX cert, it just leaves me to wonder. When I think of THX, I think of a strict standard, stuff that Bryston, Krell, Lexicon, Mark Levinson, Snell, Linn, etc... would carry. Not equipment like Kenwood, hell not ever stuff like Onkyo, Denon and even marantz.

Master J

THX certification serves a purpose, in stating a product meets a certain set of criteria. Can a non-certified component meet or exceed the same criteria?...you bet, but the THX stamp takes out the guess work, especially for those not intuned with highly technical specs or the latest reviews.

As for Kenwood getting certification...why not? If they make a qualty product that meets the requirements set forth by THX, why shouldn't they be certified as well. Thats why THX has Select, Ultra and Ultra 2 specifications to meet all customer requirements.

Whenever these THX debates come up people seem to forget about the processing modes offered by THX certified receivers. Their Cinema EQ mode is a very useful feature on many DVD titles to take some the harshness out of certain soundtracks. Don't forget they also developed THX (DD) EX which is a very nice feature if the soundtrack contains the proper encoding. You could also say that there would also be no DTS ES if they did not feel the need to match what DD was putting out.

J

zargon

I have nothing against Kenwood, it is they aren't really consider even a semi major player in receiver at least. I am saying that I think the THX cert is kind of a joke now. When you get a amp, or receiver with a THX cert, you are basiclly paying more for the name. Like I said, when I think of THX, I think of quality, high end quality. Not entry to mid level pieces of equipment. THX has lost its charm because of this, it isn't as exclusive.

Plus, you need to have a THX cert amp and pre-amp (or receiver), THX cert speakers and THX cert source devices (DVD players, CD players, etc...), or otherwise you are deminising the reason of THX. A THX source is mastered with all those in mind, so you are no gaining the full effect that you are ment to get by even breaking the chain.

Master J

THX mastering of a film source has absolutely nothing to do with the receiver, amp, speakers, etc. Where did you get this information from?.... it is completely erroneous.

A complete THX setup would meet a certain set of requirements set forth by THX. That does not mean all non-THX certified products would be weak links or have a negative effect on your system. They could just as easily meet the THX requirements. Look at the THX certification as a sort of a seal of approval. You are almost always guaranteed a very good degree of performance.

J

zargon

It has everything to do with that, since these pieces of equipment fall in the parameters of the THX standard, what is used to master the source by a sound engineer. Everything needs to be THX cert to get what it was ment to sound like.

Master J

Huh?

From THX Website:


Notice it says "fully compatible with all video and audio playback systems" No where does it say you need a complete THX setup in your home to enjoy a THX certified DVD release. If you check out THX's website you can gain even more information on the authoring process, which I am not going to explain here, because my job is not teach the uneducated, only point them in the right direction.

It never ceases to amaze me the ammount of flat out erroneous information perpetuated on the internet by individuals as actual facts.

J

zargon

Maybe if you actually read my posts, no where do I say that you absolulty need everything to be THX cert. You are putting words in my mouth and trying to twist it this way in that. If you have all THX cert equipment, then you will get the most out of it. You get how it is meant to sound, how the sound engineer makes it sound in the studio.

You seemed to have missed something on the THX web site:

The part I highlighted in red stresses my point, to get optimal sound... all your equipment should be THX cert.

Master J

Zargon,

My issue was with your statement that a THX system was needed to fully utilize the THX mastering of a DVD. The two certifications have nothing to do with one another. All it means is that the receiver, CD, speaker meet a certain set of requirements put forth by THX while the DVD meets a certain set of requirements.

The quote from the THX site that I posted refers to the DVD mastering process. Don't try to change the entire issue by quoting a passage referring to HARDWARE. You actually made my argument for me, by posting information on the synergies of the THX system that NOWHERE mentions DVD/SOURCE material. That is the issue my man, the software certification. Please READ my post instead of jumping into an argument and off the deep end just for the sake of arguing.

Your statement about the Hardware certification is actually pretty valid to a certain point (though THX processing IMHO can be helpful in any home theater system as long as decent equipment is used, certified or not). I would not say it is useless to get a THX certified receiver if the rest of your equipment is not certified.

J

zargon

You are not getting my point here. Lets see if I can explain it so you can under stand.

When stuff is mastered in THX, they use all THX cert components. So, that is what the sound engineer is going from, he is using those components to get it to sound the way he thinks it should sound. Now that is is mastered with all THX cert components, to best replicated that, you also need all THX cert components. By having all THX cert components it "should" -- and I say should because every amp and ever speaker have their own sound so it is going to vary due to that -- sound like how it sounded in the studio when it is mastered. This is not saying that you need all THX cert componets to fully enjoy it, but apparently you are not getting the most out of it if you do not have all THX cert components.

Obviously they aren't goint to make it to only work with THX components, they wouldn't still be in business if they did. Yes they are shooting for "highest quality picture and sound wherever movies are presented", but they use THX hardware to get that quality. It is kind of like using your high performance Indy racing car on the highway. You can actually go way faster than the speed limit, but you have to go the speed limit. You are not getting the most out of you high performance Indy racing car.

For some reason you are just not seeing my point, I have read your post and understand what you are saying. I am not changing the subject since I feel what I am talking about is valid to my arugement. Also, no where do I say that not having all THX cert components is useless, I said that it diminishes the quality set forth by THX. Now, we all know there are a lot of components out there that could be THX cert, but the company just did not do it to keep prices do or for some other reason. I still feel that THX is not what it use to be, I think they should tighten up their standards a bit more, at least their ultra/ultra2. That way you can still have THX select, which I still think isn't really needed. If companies put time, effort and thought into their components, they could easily meet that standard. I guess it may be good since some companies really don't seem to put the time, effort and thought into their components and it gives them guide lines to follow.

bfrank

Many components meet THX but to not get the certification because of the licensing few that must be added to the price of the product. But for someone that is not as into this stuff as us it can be a help.

Bottom line I think you are both right here

aam

THX hardware seems to be going the same way as THX software has always been - a total waste of money. If there are standards to uphold, why do some discs look so bad and why do they badge vhs at all. Can't wait to see a BUSH THX system!

Cheddarmuff

Guys, simmer down now...no need to get into a pissing match over who has the better opinion.

If you want true THX........buy a movie theatre..

zargon

I have seen home theater systems that would just blow away a movie theater. I was in one at a local stereo shop, pretty wild.

bfrank

We have one like that at work (But the some of the stuff is THX certified)

macsax

It might be healthy to bear in mind the original reason for THX certification. Georgie (Lucas) pays more attention than most to the sound track. The whole sound track and not just the music. He was one of the very first to utilize surround sound. He and the hard working sound guys put in a lot of effort to get a desired end product. So imagine the dismay when the impact at many theaters was not there (heck, there were a good number of theaters that weren't even equipped for surround on his early efforts, and some not even for stereo, which is why the first variations of surround were 4 channels encoded on two).

The primary reason was the equipment being used. Some of the key concerns for movie theater sound were, and still are, filling the room: Quantity - having it be loud enough for the audience to hear; coverage - having dispersion patterns that adequately cover the room side to side and front to back, possibly using fill speakers to make up for "volume" and coverage moving towards the back; and intelligibility - making sure that what is being spoken is heard for what it is. Up until the early 70's quality as we know it really didn't come into play. The technology for sound on film up to that point honestly produced atrocious results (try a 42 dB signal to noise ratio for one) so dynamic range and frequency response weren't big concerns. Some of Dolby's first noise reduction efforts were for the film industry. Two of your almost exclusive players in the theater speaker market at the time were Altec Lansing (not the one most of you know now that makes computer speakers) and JBL (oddly enough both companies had the same founder who first left Altec and then started the James B Lansing company). Their primary design considerations on a vast majority of the models in use at this period had to do with efficiency, coverage and intelligibility. Many of the electronics used also had similar shortfalls and in some theaters acoustics were unheard of (no pun intended).

There was stuff out there though that was up to the task. This was what George and the boys used to put everything together and view it to produce the final product. The two big boys, Altec Lansing and JBL were not complacent and had models of speakers that could do the job and there were electronics companies that had been bellying up to the bar for several years as well. So here comes the idea. Go help set up the theaters that want it (and strongly push it for the big major market ones). George's audio guru, Tomlinson Holman (sorry if I mis-spelled the name), would go to theaters and check the sound and if necessary, make recommendations on equipment that would do the job, help set-up room EQ and make suggestions on acoustic treatments like side drapes and ceiling alterations. Once the room was up to snuff it got the official okey-dokey. The original certs were not for equipment but for system performance/acceptance.

Everything we see now grew from there.