Joe Schmoe

Can anyone recommend a DVD recorder? I know Philips, Pioneer, Panasonic, and Samsung all make recorders. Anyone know the main differences among them? I want it to be progressive scan for sure since it will act as the DVD player in my home theater set up. Thanks.

zargon

So you basiclly wany a stand alone unit?

I would go with Pioneer, they are always ahead of the game when it comes to laser technology.

Mammal

I would say that the Pioneer is the best at this point, but costs a lot. You might want to wait for the Panasonic E30 model which will be out later this year. It will have progressive capability.

highdef

The Pioneer Elite, DVR-7000 is the way to go. Check prior threads on this topic to get the complete scoop.

Joe Schmoe

Yes, I'd like a stand-alone unit. I did a search prior to posting this but didn't see any other threads about DVD recorders.

I've been to the web sites of Pioneer, Samsung, Philips and Panasonic. They don't quite answer all my questions.

For instance, can you add chapter stops where you want them or do all of their machines stick chapter stops on the disc at regular intervals (every 5 minutes or whatever)?

The Panasonic DMR-E20K doesn't mention anything about being progressive. Can I assume it's not? Anyone know for sure?

The Philips DVDR1500 says it has "Dolby Digital 5.1 (AC-3) record quality." Most DVD recorders says they will record in 2-channel Dolby Digital, but this one actually says 5.1 "record quality." What does this mean? Will this machine let you copy a 5.1 Dolby Digital DVD onto a blank DVD and your copy will end up with a 5.1 Dolby Digital soundtrack? That seems too good to be true (and probably illegal).

Why are blank DVDs some damn expensive ($10 each)? Some movies on DVD are only $10, but at least with those you actually get 2 hours of Hollywood entertainment, surround sound, etc. If the disc is blank, then why isn't it cheap?

Thanks.

zargon

You shouldn't be able to copy from DVD to DVD, the MPAA would have nothing to do with it. That is why CSS was used to protect the DVDs and they sure as hell won't let you allow to copy due to the MPAA regulations.

As for blank DVDs, I don't know where you are looking, but they aren't that much. I have seen them as low as $2 a piece.

highdef

Joe Schmoe, I am an industry professional. I use the Pioneer DVR-7000 recorder (Progressive Scan & 5.1 Audio) to create "general" DVD's for my projects. The term "general" refers to the fact that they are backwards compatible with "most" current DVD players and PC drives, but CAN NOT be used for "authoring." The term "authoring" refers to the process whereby you are able to mass duplicate a finished DVD master once its been recorded. Authoring systems are really expensive
so I use a local production house for this purpose. All of my transfers to DVD are from DVCAM masters, via FireWire, directly to the Pioneer recorder. The results are nothing short of amazing. You do get what you pay for and the price tag on this unit may appear high, but it's worth every penny. Most other units, the Philips & Pansonic in particular, displayed odd micro-blocking and picture smearing even on the "best" recording mode. The best mode yields up to 2 hours of "studio quality" picture and sound.
Of course I am a professional so my standards are far greater than most consumer applications. The bottom line is that if you want your recordings to have the same quality as the DVD's that you buy pre-recorded, the DVR-7000 is the way to go. Be aware that your source material has everything to do with how well your recordings will turn out. VHS material will look okay at best, because of its low resolution factor. Anything "digital" such as:
DV & Digital8 will look outstanding. I've even seen some good looking S-VHS and Hi8 transfers as well.

As for the blanks, zargon hit the nail of the head. They can be had for around $2 a pop. I would make sure, however, that you purchase only brands that youy have heard of before. My experience with "no-name" blank CD-R's for music (a stand-alone
recorder) has been a nightmare! Friends of mine whom have taken the "cheaper" way out on "no-name" blank DVD-R's are not pleased with their end results.

Happy hunting...

Mammal

The E20 is not progressive. The E30 will be. I find the quality of the E20 to be satisfactory in recording quality at around half the price of the Pioneer. In this area name-brand discs can be had between $4 and $6. The E20 provides its own chapter stops.

The biggest problem with the E20 involves speeds between 1:00 and 2:00, or slightly over 2:00 - movie recordings. To get intermediate bit-rates you have to use the timer, which prevents pausing during LD side breaks for example. I think the E30 will allow manual settings of odd times (like the Pioneer) and I hope pause will be enabled.

If you can afford the Pioneer, I'd get it. If price matters, I'd wait for the E30. If price is critical, buy an E20 around the time the E30 comes out.

digitalfreaknyc

So let me get this straight...

if you're recording something that is between one and two hours, you can't pause it??

How much is the E30 going to be?

Joe Schmoe

Thanks to all who responded.

I haven't priced blank DVDs in a store. When I said $10, I was referring to the commercial Philips is running these days for the 985 model. If you buy it before the 19th at a S.F. area Good Guys, you get 10 blank DVDs for free, which they claim is a $100 value.

I thought duplication of pre-recorded material is fine as long as it's for private use. That's why people have been able to make mix tapes and CD's for years, right? It's distributing copies of pre-recorded material that's illegal, isn't it? If this is true, shouldn't someone be able to make a mix DVD if they want to as long as they don't distribute it?

highdef,

Sounds like you really like the DVR-7000. What can you tell me about the chapter stops? Do you have any control over when and where they occur on the disk? And when you mentioned 5.1 audio, are you talking about playback of pre-recorded movies or the ability to record a 5.1 channel soundtrack onto a blank disc?

Thanks.

Low RG

I picked up the Philips DVDR985 and couldn't be happier. Records on to DVD+RW disc. You can record with automatic chapter stops or you can put in your own chapter stops.

Each disc holds up to 4 hours of video.

nekobus

Welcome to the MPAA's world. They don't want people copying off DVDs for any reason PERIOD. That's why several copy protection methods are often used.

highdef

Joe Schmoe, the chapter stops, or "thumb nails" can be inserted manually or in automatic intervals. As for the 5.1 audio, remember that I am using this unit for professional use and all of my DVCAM masters are originated with a 5.1 surround mixdown.
Therefore, the DVR-7000 is able to recognize the 5.1 source material and properly render it to DVD. As for consumers being capable to record in 5.1 surround with this unit, I'm not sure?
So along as the source material contians the adequate 5.1 flags, transport of this audio to the recorder should work just fine. (It has always worked fine for me.) And yes, I am extremely pleased with this unit for "general DVD" recording purposes.

Mammal

One of the annoying things about the E20 is that you can select the 1 hour speed, or the 2 hour speed, but nothing in between unless you use the timer mode. That's a pain that I hope they correct with the E30.

Joe Schmoe

The salesman at the Good Guys told me the Philips 985 records on DVD+R and DVD+RW, which is supposed to be the most compatible discs for playback on other DVD players (according to him). The Pioneer 7000 says it uses DVD-R and DVD-RW for the same reason.

Is there a difference between the + and - on these discs? Are they both compatible for playback on most DVD players or is one more compatible than the other?

highdef

From my experiences, Joe Schmoe, DVD-R is completely backwards compatible with almost every player out there.
Even some of those Sony and Toshiba units that have difficulties playing back selected Disney titles. So far as th DVD+R is concerned, friends of mine with units handling this format have some problems with compatibility from time to time. This could be an isolated occurance though however. I personally have not had any experience with the +R's in any way. If you have a choice between the Philips and Pioneer units, (having used both)
I would recommend the Pioneer DVR-7000. The Philips is clearly better than the Panasonic recorders but, from a professional stand point, the image quality, via FireWire from DVCAM source material, looked better overall on the Pioneer.

I hope that this helps?

Joe Schmoe

highdef,

Thanks for the info.

highdef

Glad I could help. Goodluck with your purchase.

Joe Schmoe

highdef,

I thought of a few more questions about the DVR-7000, and you've been very helpful on this subject...

What do you see on the screen when you first pop in a recorded DVD-R? Do you see a menu screen? A title screen? Can you create these things on the DVR-7000? What about chapter titles? Is there any room for creativity? (I have a Pioneer CD recorder that lets you input disc, artist, and track titles, so I was wondering if their DVD recorder will let you do anything similar.)

The Pioneer PRV-9000 mentions something about generating titles. Have you worked with the 9000? Thanks.

highdef

The first thing you see is a "welcome to the world of recordable DVD screen." Then you select the media: DVD-R or DVD-RW.
Then if you don't engage manual chapter stops (thumbnails)
automatic ones will be inserted for user navigation upon the completion of your disc. It's onboard TBC (time base corrector)
eliminates picture jitters from lower resolution tape sources such as VHS. The only way to add "titles" to your chapters/thumbnails is by using a professional interface, via FireWire when tansferring your material to DVD. I do this everyday with my DVCAM, MiniDV and DVCPRO master tapes. Without this device, which is a broadcast interface and expensive to boot, you will only be able to access chapters based upon "visual" cues. Sorry, but that's the reality. However, the units ability to master color, luminance and the best bit rates for recording places this recorder at the top of the heap! Quantum Noise Reduction (QND) eliminates that awful micro-blocking and image smearing associated with scenes exhibiting fast movement. Variable Bit Control (VBRC) technology allows the DVR-7000 to perform ideal video compression encoding, resulting in significantly improved picture quality compared with conventional Constant Bit Rate Control technology (CBRC). The PureCinema circuit provides a progressive scan output with outstanding picture quality.

The bottom line here is that, this unit ROCKS!!!!!!

No I have not worked with the Pioneer, PVR-9000.
Is it a DVD recorder or CD recorder? Is it a professional/Elite or consumer device?

Joe Schmoe

highhdef,

The PVR-9000 says it's for professional use. I guess it's pro because you can add titles and it doesn't have a TV tuner. Of course, it's more $$ than the DVR-7000.

highdef

How much does the PVR-9000 cost and when was it released, as I am not familiar with this unit? Is it a PC recorder or stand-alone recorder like the 7000? I own two DVR-7000's and may decide to add a PVR-9000 to mix if the price is right.

Joe Schmoe

highdef,

Two DVR-7000's?? Wow. Why?

The PRV-9000 costs about $1,700. I don't know when it came out, but it is a stand-alone unit. You can check it out on Pioneer's website.

I'm wondering if at this point it would be cheaper to get a DVD burner for the PC and software that would let me personalize the disc more than a stand-alone unit would. I just don't know much about adding on to my PC. Is there a reason you went with two stand-alone units instead of a PC burner?

highdef

Yes there is. I am using a titling interface, authoring device for my chapters and thumbnails. I use DVD for professional applications and have yet to be satisfied with a PC system that's affordable. The production houses that I deal with use PC burners and software that cost many thousands of dollars. As for why I have 2 DVR-7000's, I use one in a dubbing rack for quick "general DVD" copies and the other is tied directly into my edit suite.

highdef

I was on the Pioneer website and can't find the PVR-9000 DVD recorder. I searched under Elite recorders and standard ones. Can you include the link to the specs on this unit? Thanks.