Billyspunk

IMO I do not understand what the big deal is with sending first or paying first in this web sites guidelines. If a person is selling, I don't care what his status is, then he should be able to ask for payment first, if the person is paying with Paypal. The buyer will be covered no problem if he does not receive the items, Paypal covers the buyer alot more than the seller. Why on earth should the seller send his dvd's first? He has absolutely NO way to cover himself, if the buyer takes the dvds and never pays who is out the money/dvd's? The seller gets screwed. I am sorry this whole trade guideline SUCKS in my opinion. Pay first or don't waste my time...

illini420

I personally agree, but when I read the send first policy of the website I read it as being a recommendation, or as being optional. Seems to me if a new seller wants payment first they can ask for that. And if a buyer wants further reassurances there are other methods to get those reassurances rather than demanding DVDs first (a friendly phone call, send half payment in good faith, PayPal protections, etc.)

Billyspunk

It seems to me the big sticking point with this whole exchange board is when a buyer and seller are trading not selling. I have been a Ebay seller for over 6 years and I have never sent anything first, granted I only sell on Ebay not trade, but IMO I do not trust most people...

justbarelymovin

Well, I am a Gold Trader here, and when I took it upon myself to trust someone with zero feedback in the Good Traders thread out of good faith, I got ripped off. I think it is more of a recommendation, obviously, as I did send payment first, but when someone new comes here asking for money first, I think it's a bit shady, and from now on, I will not be sending payment first unless said person has at least a few positive feedbacks. I sent money via PayPal, but while they found the whole thing in my favor, they weren't able to get me my money back. I think the guideline works well here--If you don't like the trading system, then I suggest going to eBay. I think it's fair and protects people from getting ripped off.

dmpre99

i think if a 0 feedback person trades or sells something to a gold trader the 0 feedback person should send first. It's to protect people who are reputable on this site. I have seen a lot of people over the past couple of years come by to try to make a quick buck and i think its neccessary that 0 feedback people try to signal their trusthworthiness to the gold traders. i know i never deal with 0 feedback sellers just because i dont want to end up with nothing....
just my two cents

hindolio

heya all!

quick background check:
looking at my profile, i registered here in 2/2006. ive prolly lurked 6 months before that. and finally i have been trading and purchasing dvds for the past couple months.

i have 6 or 7 trades that all went smoothly so far (and hopefully more to come!). i think they went well because i chose to deal with people that have some sort of rep here, regarding the good traders list and the number of posts they have. also, i try and outdo my fellow trader at least on my part (packaging, honesty of condition of dvd, etc).

and heres me:
now im not pointing fingers (although i guess i am), but it seems that some people are forgetting what this place is... a community forum. why would you compare this to ebay? or any site that sells dvds?

it seems this place is and should stay a community for dvd nerds like me!

my point is, i actually dont want "johnny come latelys" here. id rather have people who will contribute to the benefit of the whole. and that takes time and effort. and trust. to me, that sets this place apart from ebay and commercial sites.

leeta

I paid first, was never sent the DVD, disputed it with PayPal (who found in my favor) and was never refunded the money. PayPal is no guarantee of getting your money back. It was only $12 so it was a cheap lesson.

RonBoster

This forum is littered with members that have gotten ripped off still when using paypal as their form of payment. The paypal seller has to have money in their account or an active cc for paypal to be able to retreive the funds. If not, then the buyer is out of luck.

As far as the OP's comments, the rules are guidelines or suggestions as it relates to paying first blah blah....but with the recent increase in long time members getting ripped off, IMO you'll find members leary about sending dvd's or money upfront with brand new members.

Each deal is different, but getting defensive about it (that's the way your post comes off to me) won't help in becomming an active trader on this site.

My 2 cents

Ron

spartanstew

He's certainly able to ask for it, but many members won't send it. No way would I send money to someone with no transactions without getting the DVD's first. I've had over 100 transactions here. Does someone really think that by sending my their DVD's first that I'm going to rip them off? I've spent several years here and built up all that credit, so that I could rip off one guy on $20 worth of DVD's??? OTOH, someone with no history has no compulsions about pocketing the money, not sending anything and never being heard from again. I've declined to deal with 3 different people over the years because they were new and refused to send first. All 3 ended up ripping off other members.

Brent L

I posted the following in this thread:

Here is my quick advice for the future:

-First off, like everyone knows, never ever send payment first to a newbie no matter how great the deal sounds.

-If, for some reason, you do decide to send payment first using PayPal only do so when the other person has an established PayPal account so that you can purchase the PayPal's Money Back Guarantee. If you want, tell the other person that they must go down from their asking point to make up for your having to do this.

The point is to NEVER put yourself in a position where there is even a chance that you'll get ripped off. No deal is ever worth it, and always remember that we have great deals in this forum all the time.

There are also those scammers who try to be a bit sneakier than usual with their scams, like in this thread, so you've got to be more careful than ever.

When I first started here, I didn't have any problem at all with sending/paying first to established members, and I don't see why any newbies should have a problem with doing so as well. This isn't a place like eBay either, it's much more of a close knit community.

Go to other trade sites (especially CAG and GameTZ) and you'll see the same deal where people ask for new members with no history to send first, it's nothing new.

yourlocalcinema

I've never really understood why people have reservations about sending first to gold traders. Other people, sure, but gold traders have to be trustworthy. I've only done a few trades here and it's never been an issue, but if I've learned anything in being here a couple years, it's that it would take a pretty elaborate scam to "fake" being a gold trader, so I tend to just trust them once proof is provided.

Billyspunk

Sorry to rain on your parade boys but Paypal DOES protect the buyer, even if they don't have money in their account. You will get a refund from Paypal and the sellers account goes into the negative if he does not have the funds. His account will then stay negative until he pays Paypal back, if he never does his account will be locked. If I was to sell on here, the person who pays me with Paypal will see I have a verified account and a very high rating with Paypal, that is alot more important than being a gold trader IMO...

justbarelymovin

Okay, well, I hate to rain on YOUR parade, but several of us have been ripped off on here (especially recently), and we did use PayPal. While PayPal found the situation in our favor, they were unable to get our money back, so PayPal isn't always a guarantee. If you don't like the trading system we have going here, then I suggest you use eBay. I enjoy trading via DVDTalk because it's a really wonderful community, but if you aren't comfortable with the guidelines, then I don't know what to tell you. And it's just that--a guideline which many of us go by, and I believe it to be fair. I'm not trying to be ugly and single you out. I'm just saying that PayPal doesn't always protect its buyers.

Pointyskull

Ditto here. I just lost 16.99 on this board to a scammer, and PayPal could not do anything to refund my payment.

Consider it a life lesson.

illini420

I can see both sides of this, sellers not wanting to ship before payment, regardless of who the person is, and the other side being buyers not wanting to send payment first to a new seller. For me, whenever I buy via eBay or buy on here, I don't spend $ I can't afford to lose. Sort of like my approach with gambling in Vegas, only significantly better odds.

For those of you who have been screwed and PayPal found in your favor but still didn't reimburse you, what was PayPal's reason for not giving your money back? Just curious as I've always thought they would refund me if something went bad, and it seems many others are under that apparently false impression. Thanks.

Pointyskull

I paid 16.99 out my PayPal account to an email account I was given by someone I was supposedly buying a boxset from.

After it became apparent I was scammed, I followed the PayPal dispute process. They received no response from seller, and essentially sent me a form letter a week or two later saying they couldn't refund my money.

No real explanation given.

Billyspunk

I have never gotten screwed using Paypal for buying. The important thing to remember is send a Paypal payment to a VERIFIED user, if the seller is not verified then there is the big risk. I have gotten screwed by Paypal as a seller because of not sending a item with delivery confirmation. Paypal does nothing to protect the seller if DC is not used. The buyer really is protected if the seller is verified, I have been using Paypal for over 6 years and never got screwed with getting a refund, I only deal with verified users..

Pointyskull

Congrats to you, but this sort of goes against your original post quote of "the buyer will be covered no problem if he does not receive the items".

And I think that is a misconception amongst a lot of PayPal users.

Billyspunk

The bottom line I am trying to get to is this: I am considering selling some box sets here instead of Ebay. I am a verified Paypal seller (well over 500 transactions) with a Ebay feedback rating over 3600. If people do not want to send payment first for some great deals I will have then they should look elsewhere. The first person who does deal with me will be pleasantly surprised...GUARANTEED..

uvalaw2005

Well then good for them, and good for you. See how DVDTalk allows everyone to decide for themselves how they want to do business? No one stops you from asking for payment first. And no one will stop others from doing business with you on that basis, if they so choose.

dvds4u

Let's see, where to start. I have been on this site for approx 5 years, I am guessing. When it first got up, man it was awesome. Now, it seems like newbies are trying to make it a scam a minute site. I haven't done much on this site in the last year. I am trying it again this week, as a buyer. I will only send first with Gold Traders, just too many scammers on here of late. I have done probably 200-300 trades on here, most when I owned my DVD Biz. I guess my point is, buyer beware! If you are willing to send cash first to a non-Gold Trader, be aware, that it could come back to bite you in the ass.

Billyspunk

So if a seller scams someone doesn't he get banned from the site? I know they can easily just pop back up again, but where is the official list of good and bad traders?

uvalaw2005

It's the very first thread in the forum.

Billyspunk

I saw the list, it seems to just list the good traders...What about the bad ones?

uvalaw2005

They are at the top.