Heroes -- "The Eclipse Part 2" -- 12/1/08
12-04-08, 09:32 AM
#126
DVD Talk Legend
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Picture a cup in the middle of the sea
Posts: 10,706
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
The only way to explain Adam and the eclipse, and no, i don't think the writers thought this way is:
- With the Eclipse our Heroes superpowers molecules/DNA/whatever is there but it's not active/running/activated
- Adam's superpowers molecules/DNA/whatever were "extracted"/removed by Pa Petrelli. So he doesn't have them anymore in his body.
Or something like that.
- With the Eclipse our Heroes superpowers molecules/DNA/whatever is there but it's not active/running/activated
- Adam's superpowers molecules/DNA/whatever were "extracted"/removed by Pa Petrelli. So he doesn't have them anymore in his body.
Or something like that.
12-04-08, 09:48 AM
#127
DVD Talk Godfather
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Gateway Cities/Harbor Region
Posts: 63,299
Received 1,815 Likes
on
1,131 Posts
*If HRG is to be believed...this week.
12-04-08, 09:57 AM
#128
DVD Talk Godfather
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Gateway Cities/Harbor Region
Posts: 63,299
Received 1,815 Likes
on
1,131 Posts
That was a huge mistake they made with Adam. I think they went for the "cool looking effect" rather than any kind of logic. If the character had run his course, then he should have had his powers taken, and then had Pa Petrelli break his neck.
I think they have really ruined consistency with Claire's powers. She can't heal herself if something is lodged in her brain, yet it's her blood that supposedly heals as evidenced by HRG's revival. So why would something lodged in her brain prevent her from healing? Also how can she be immortal? You chop off her head and put it in a box is she supposed to grow a new head?
Will her head grow a new body? You have to wait to reattach them? What if they degenerate to bones in the mean time?
OK maybe I'm overthinking the last part, but I really feel that the Adam death was a HUGE mistake in logic. I am expecting a revision in a future episode where we find out Pa Petrelli has "people dissolving" powers and that's actually how he killed Adam, not through old age.
I think they have really ruined consistency with Claire's powers. She can't heal herself if something is lodged in her brain, yet it's her blood that supposedly heals as evidenced by HRG's revival. So why would something lodged in her brain prevent her from healing? Also how can she be immortal? You chop off her head and put it in a box is she supposed to grow a new head?
Will her head grow a new body? You have to wait to reattach them? What if they degenerate to bones in the mean time?
OK maybe I'm overthinking the last part, but I really feel that the Adam death was a HUGE mistake in logic. I am expecting a revision in a future episode where we find out Pa Petrelli has "people dissolving" powers and that's actually how he killed Adam, not through old age.
I hear you. But it seems, and I say this in all Fanboy speculation because as Raul3 pointed out the writers haven't thought this deeply on the issue
, Claire's Brain is part of the Healing equation here.
12-04-08, 10:34 AM
#129
DVD Talk Hero
To those who thought the Eclipse was a waste... Didn't Pa Patrelli and oddly enough Peter both sum it up? Pa made a comment about how we got to see what was really inside of people without their powers. And Peter said something to The Haitian about seeing if he still had it in him to be a hero even without his powers.
2. Peter didn't have powers right before the eclipse, he didn't have powers during the eclipse, and he doesn't have powers after the eclipse. I think he was talking about why he went to Haiti when he didn't have powers, not about the eclipse. I'm not even sure that the people in the Haitian arc even knew that the eclipse had anything to do with losing their powers (if I were Nathan, no way I'd fly back under my own power).
As far as the Haitian/flying powers thing, this is consistent with Nathan flying away from the Haitian and HRG in season 1... though this is NOT consistent with the Haitian automatically turning Hiro and Daphne's powers off earlier this season, even though he didn't know they were there (unless he can just create a no-power zone around him)
I can also buy Adam disintegrating without his powers while the rest stayed healed during the eclipse, the difference being that only Adam had used his power to stay alive for a long, long time...while wounds are permanently healed. Where's my no-prize?
This also doesn't explain future Peter's scar, which he might've gotten when he was powerless, but should've healed once his powers came back.
If Elle is permanently dead, they should have shown more in the show... at this point, I would think most of the viewers think she's coming back, because they didn't show her death explicitly, nor her body (though that may be next week). Sylar seemed to take a step backwards as well, so there's not only a lack of progression in the storylines, but it seems like the whole Sylar redemption arc was pretty much a waste of time.
I'd like to think that Kring and co. had this all meticulously planned out, and then had to change things last minute when the ratings/complaints/network interference came in. But who knows? These are still the episodes with Loeb and co., right?
edited to add: Also thought it was odd that they flat out said that the reason they were seeking out the Haitian was because only his powers could stop Pa Patrelli. However, they had a whole period where no powers were working... why not send some of the company's trained agents in now?
Last edited by fujishig; 12-04-08 at 10:36 AM.
12-04-08, 10:49 AM
#130
DVD Talk Legend
Whenever I wonder what the writers are thinking I just remind myself that these are the same people who had Peter give himself an aneurysm opening up the safe instead of walking through the door with his walk through wall powers, and had him run in slow motion to catch a vial rather than fly to it at high speed or even teleport. Then I know that they just don't think, and are more impressed with how things "look" than any kind of logic.
12-04-08, 05:37 PM
#132
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Posts: 3,031
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pa Petrelli removed Hiro's memories but not his powers; perhaps he not only removed Adam's powers but his life force too. Besides, Adam must've survived dozens of eclipses. Speaking of which, why does it seem like Pa Petrelli and HRG are surprised that eclipses affect people's powers?
12-04-08, 07:11 PM
#133
Pa Petrelli removed Hiro's memories but not his powers; perhaps he not only removed Adam's powers but his life force too. Besides, Adam must've survived dozens of eclipses. Speaking of which, why does it seem like Pa Petrelli and HRG are surprised that eclipses affect people's powers?
12-04-08, 07:31 PM
#134
Hmm...I just realized this may be intentional. Remember when HRG was trying to catch Nathan with the Haitian? He couldn't block Nathan's powers then, either. Or his own brother. Hmm. Maybe this means something. Like he can't block artificially created ones, or something.
12-04-08, 08:00 PM
#135
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 630
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hmm...I just realized this may be intentional. Remember when HRG was trying to catch Nathan with the Haitian? He couldn't block Nathan's powers then, either. Or his own brother. Hmm. Maybe this means something. Like he can't block artificially created ones, or something.
12-04-08, 08:35 PM
#136
DVD Talk Godfather
Hmm...I just realized this may be intentional. Remember when HRG was trying to catch Nathan with the Haitian? He couldn't block Nathan's powers then, either. Or his own brother. Hmm. Maybe this means something. Like he can't block artificially created ones, or something.
...but SteelWill is probably right.
12-04-08, 08:36 PM
#137
DVD Talk Hero
People here are giving these explanations way more thought than the writers apparently do. I think what has happened is a bunch of random television writers got on a hit series with the most obsessed fanbase, namely comic book fans, and are failing under the expectations set in season one. It was easier to wing it in season one as no continuity or rules of the fictional universe had been established yet. Serial shows of this type need meticulous planning by the writers and a "bible" to keep the episodes consistent.
12-05-08, 07:27 AM
#138
DVD Talk Legend
Finally caught this episode. I thought Nathan's heel turn was so bizarre and out of nowhere I couldn't stop laughing. So Sylar turns evil for the 500th time? Hopefully Crosseyes is dead but they didn't really show the whole thing happening.
12-05-08, 08:35 AM
#139
DVD Talk Godfather
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Gateway Cities/Harbor Region
Posts: 63,299
Received 1,815 Likes
on
1,131 Posts
1. What did we really find out? That Mohinder, when cornered without powers, will hit a guy on the head with a stapler? I'm serious, what did we find out about these people?
2. Peter didn't have powers right before the eclipse, he didn't have powers during the eclipse, and he doesn't have powers after the eclipse. I think he was talking about why he went to Haiti when he didn't have powers, not about the eclipse. I'm not even sure that the people in the Haitian arc even knew that the eclipse had anything to do with losing their powers (if I were Nathan, no way I'd fly back under my own power).
2. Peter didn't have powers right before the eclipse, he didn't have powers during the eclipse, and he doesn't have powers after the eclipse. I think he was talking about why he went to Haiti when he didn't have powers, not about the eclipse. I'm not even sure that the people in the Haitian arc even knew that the eclipse had anything to do with losing their powers (if I were Nathan, no way I'd fly back under my own power).
That without powers Mohinder was less of a pussy than one would expect and that Fire Guy was perhaps more of pussy than one would expect. I mentioned Peter because even without his powers pre, during, and post eclipse he was still willing to go into battle against horrible odds.
Last edited by Giantrobo; 12-05-08 at 08:37 AM.
12-05-08, 08:43 AM
#140
DVD Talk Legend
Fire Guy isn't a pussy. He is just stupid to fall for Mohinder's ploy. We already knew he was stupid.
Apparently now Mohinder is an angry person. We were led to believe at first it was a side effect of the power, but now I guess he has been all along? Meek timid Mohinder, steroid freak.
Apparently now Mohinder is an angry person. We were led to believe at first it was a side effect of the power, but now I guess he has been all along? Meek timid Mohinder, steroid freak.
12-05-08, 09:46 AM
#141
DVD Talk Godfather
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Gateway Cities/Harbor Region
Posts: 63,299
Received 1,815 Likes
on
1,131 Posts
Apparently now Mohinder is an angry person. We were led to believe at first it was a side effect of the power, but now I guess he has been all along? Meek timid Mohinder, steroid freak.
12-05-08, 12:09 PM
#142
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Muncie, IN [Member formerly known as abrg923]
Posts: 6,341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Agreed. I've actually enjoyed this season, but that was the one thing that was driving me nuts about it.
12-05-08, 12:14 PM
#143
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Muncie, IN [Member formerly known as abrg923]
Posts: 6,341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This thread is hilarious.
Seriously. Watch another show people. This is a huge waste of time.
I don't even think about half this stuff. I know exactly what I'm going to get from Heroes (and I just rewatched Season 1...which I think people are remembering a LITTLE too fondly) and this episode fit right in.
Claire getting hurt, Mohinder being stupid, Nathan doing something that makes no sense, Peter whining, Sylar playing 8 different characters in the course of an episode (good, bad, sort of good, kind of bad, etc.), Parkman getting a stupid subplot, Hiro acting like a child, and so on.
Every week, we get some variation of these things. And every week I still tune in, because I like the world and I like the characters. A lot of you obviously don't, so I'd recommend flipping the channel because it will NEVER meet your expectations.
Seriously. Watch another show people. This is a huge waste of time.
I don't even think about half this stuff. I know exactly what I'm going to get from Heroes (and I just rewatched Season 1...which I think people are remembering a LITTLE too fondly) and this episode fit right in.
Claire getting hurt, Mohinder being stupid, Nathan doing something that makes no sense, Peter whining, Sylar playing 8 different characters in the course of an episode (good, bad, sort of good, kind of bad, etc.), Parkman getting a stupid subplot, Hiro acting like a child, and so on.
Every week, we get some variation of these things. And every week I still tune in, because I like the world and I like the characters. A lot of you obviously don't, so I'd recommend flipping the channel because it will NEVER meet your expectations.
12-05-08, 12:15 PM
#144
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Muncie, IN [Member formerly known as abrg923]
Posts: 6,341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Seriously, do any of you even pay attention to the show?
12-05-08, 12:19 PM
#145
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Muncie, IN [Member formerly known as abrg923]
Posts: 6,341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Multiple references were made - in this episode alone! - to the fact that the Haitian has CONTROL of his ability - he can "turn it off" if need be.
Come on... no one except Maya is as pointless as Tracy/Jessica/etc.
12-05-08, 12:24 PM
#146
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Muncie, IN [Member formerly known as abrg923]
Posts: 6,341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As far as the Haitian/flying powers thing, this is consistent with Nathan flying away from the Haitian and HRG in season 1... though this is NOT consistent with the Haitian automatically turning Hiro and Daphne's powers off earlier this season, even though he didn't know they were there (unless he can just create a no-power zone around him)
12-05-08, 12:45 PM
#147
DVD Talk Hero
Hmm...I just realized this may be intentional. Remember when HRG was trying to catch Nathan with the Haitian? He couldn't block Nathan's powers then, either. Or his own brother. Hmm. Maybe this means something. Like he can't block artificially created ones, or something.
I agree with PhantomStranger that they should have a series Bible to keep all these things consistent... because this appeals to comic book fans and sci fi geeks, it'll get a lot more scrutiny plot-wise, but sometimes it's like they're not even trying. Maybe there's some really subtle theme about how superhero comic books are really inane (characters never staying dead, characters changing motivations and even personalities over time, powers being inconsistent, pointless storyarcs taking up multiple issues/episodes while the main plot goes nowhere, etc.), but I doubt it.
12-05-08, 02:00 PM
#149
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Muncie, IN [Member formerly known as abrg923]
Posts: 6,341
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not going to go back and watch the episode to give exact quotes, but on more than one occasion during the Haiti arc Nathan and/or Peter told The Haitian to "turn off" or "switch off" his powers. That, for one.