fumanstan

I'm curious how people will criticize the Avengers a year or two from now after it's success.

RichC2

Did anyone actually get hyped for it over Heath's death? I know Imaginarium bombed. Other than on the wonderful internet there was no actual discussion as it being a selling point, most people seemed to just want to see Batman Begins with the Joker in it. They pretty much got that, though Batman Begins is more or less the better movie (The pacing in Dark Knight is way too breakneck, like they cut out any character moments in service of more plot points, a bit of an issue with Nolan flicks in general imo, and the final act a little too drawn out.) Dark Knight did have moments of depth which made it more intelligent than most of these comic book movies, but usually attached them to something weak. Additionally, even if a death like that made an impact, most of that would dissipate on the opening weekend, so it doesn't explain it making it to $533m domestic. It's a lazy excuse.

They came for BB w/ Joker, and they returned for Heath's performance, which is the highlight of the film. TDKR doesn't have that same appeal going into it, though it does have the appeal of being the last in a trilogy, hopefully one that will end properly. It also has that horrible football scene, a less appealing villain and well Nolan is due for a dud. So we'll see. I do think TDKR will open around $100m, nowhere near the $158m TDK made.

I will say I'm a bit surprised at the turn out for The Avengers. The movies building up to it varied pretty greatly in quality (Iron Man was solid, Iron Man 2 was pretty dull, Thor was ok, Captain America was ok, Ang Lee's Hulk movie was interesting, the Incredible Hulk was pretty bland) and Whedon's record is shaky (Buffy was decent, Serenity was derivative as hell, Dollhouse sucked, Angel was watchable) but I guess you put all the characters together and turn it into a long money shot and people flock.

My Other Self

People will find plot holes and issues with the third act.

I think people are overreacting now as it is. It's an awesome, awesome movie that really blew me away in terms of how well it flowed with all of the different characters but as the internet does with most "epic comic book films", the excitement is more than really is warranted. Once the hype does down people will look back and find problems.

bluetoast

Yeah people only got hyped for TDK after Ledger's death. That explains why a six minute intro was attached to I Am Legend and everyone ignored it, as well as any and all trailers prior to January 2008.

fumanstan

Well, that and the people tend to come out of the woodwork for every massively successful movie to bash it with ridiculous reasons. Like The Dark Knight, Avatar, Titanic, whatever.

B5Erik

When I went to see The Avengers this morning at a 10:00 am show the place was PACKED. In a large theater. I've never seen a crowd that big that early. They had 3 screens showing this in 2D, and another 3 in 3D. And the crowd applauded at the end. Loudly.

This thing is going to have Iron Man 1 kind of legs. I don't think TDKR will do as well.

And the reaction of the crowd to the trailer for TDKR was pretty, "Meh." (You could literally hear people muttering, "Meh," to themselves or the people with them.) I still expect TDKR to do well, but not as well as the last one.

The trailer that really looked good was The Amazing Spider-Man. I'm just wondering how well that one will do. The first 3 Spidey movies did extremely well, but this is a reboot with an all new cast and director. What a summer - Avengers VS SpiderMan VS TDKR.

My Other Self

I don't know if this was directed to my response or not but I wasn't referring to the hype surrounding the pre-release of the film. And I'm also mainly referring to comic book movies, not necessarily big blockbusters like Titanic or Avatar. My initial post was also tongue-in-cheek because a number of people on other forums I frequent as well as this board seem to go on the "TDK was good, but not that great" argument with reference to plot holes and issues with the final act.

The gripe I was touching on is how most people find nearly absolutely nothing wrong with a movie and go on and on about how amazing it is then retract and reflect back a year or two down the road.

I don't tend to be one of those people. I still watch TDK often. It's one of my favorite movies. To me it became cool to hate on it or find issues with it because there were so many people praising and finding no fault when it first came out. I remember everything leading up to the movie, and the aftermath more than any other film I can remember.

Driving 3 hours to have to see it in IMAX was an experience I'll never be able to replicate since I wouldn't do it again for another movie. People will find reasons to bitch and complain or look for problems about anything regardless.
Exactly. To me, The Dark Knight is still a near-perfect film. There really isn't much I'd change about it. Titanic I've always been lukewarm about but I didn't have any problems with Avatar. I mainly enjoyed it for the revolutionary film making it presented with the 3D.

RoboDad

That's fair. I just wasn't sure what you intended. I know at some point some hardcore Nolan fan is going to make the claim that the only reason The Avengers did so well is because of the TDKR trailer being attached.

bluetoast

Nah, mcfly I was referring to Gizmos post. Didn't quote it though, sorry for the confusion.

movieguru

LOL. There's $192 million between the first and second highest grossing movies this weekend!!

Supermallet

Avatar and Titanic have very real flaws worth criticizing. Titanic, to me, is unwatchable. Avatar I was sick of before it even ended its theatrical run. Dark Knight has flaws but I think the overall film is strong enough to overcome them.

My Other Self

Not a James Cameron fan?

RoboDad

Unfortunately, that is the big problem many of us have in these discussions. There is a huge difference between being your favorite film and being a 'near-perfect' film.

Dragon Tattoo

Only an unabashed "James Cameron 'fan'" could look at Avatar and Titanic and not see the many glaring faults those movies contain.

Supermallet

Terminator through True Lies is a pretty amazing run. Aliens is one of my favorite films. I can certainly appreciate the craft of both Titanic and Avatar. What I cannot appreciate are the crap scripts and wildly varying levels of acting on display in those films.

Matthew Chmiel

I went and saw a 6AM IMAX showing of Spider-man 3 on release day that was sold out.

I saw a 9AM IMAX showing of The Dark Knight on the Sunday after it opened that it was sold out.

... and I also saw a 9:45AM showing of Pearl Harbor on the Sunday after it opened that was sold out.

B5Erik

Interesting.

Of course, I was talking about a Sunday 10:00 AM showing of The Avengers (today). And, as I noted, I've never seen a crowd that big for a show that early before.

Draven

It wasn't attached to the screening I saw, and considering how easy these things are to see to people on the Internet...who are the only people who'd go to a movie just to see a trailer...I think those days are long past.

Matthew Chmiel

My theory is that if theaters offered earlier show times for films on the weekend, they might see more of an audience. Especially when the film is longer in length.

Whenever I've gone and seen a film on a weekend prior to 11AM, there's usually a large crowd.

joe_b

I agree completely. In fact, the review on this site by Tyler Foster really brings up a lot of my issues with the film. This thing was a long time coming and I understand everybody's excitement, but it is by no means a perfect film in my book.

As for the TDK debate, I think both Nolan Batman films are well made, but I'd be lying if I said I understand the unheralded devotion they receive from internet movie fans. Frankly, I got a tad bored during both films (not to mention Bale's Batman voice is so overdone that it made the audience crack up). I just found them both extremely dreary. I'm sure I'll catch hell for this, but I prefer my superhero films a tad more lighthearted and colorful. Not Batman & Robin campy, but able to depict these larger than life scenarios with a sense of humor to offset the danger. The Avengers definitely fits that mold, flaws and all. I know the Batman comics have taken a decidely more serious and dark tone since the '80s and Nolan's trilogy is probably a good depiction of that. Personally, I found Batman: TAS to be the only screen incarnation of the character that hit the right tonal balance. Nolan has created a very specific Gotham and I could never imagine a flying man from Kryton existing in that same space. Hell, I couldn't even picture a woman walking around with cat ears fitting into that reality -- which is why it doesn't surprise me they got around it by making them upturned goggles.

To each his own.

B5Erik

I've seen the opposite around here. The earlier the showing, the smaller the crowd. People just don't seem to like to drag themselves out of bed and then rush to get ready to go to the movie theater. Especially not on a Sunday. And since it usually isn't necessary most people don't do it.

Again, just from my experience in the San Diego/Riverside County areas.

JesseCuster

Speaking for myself, I enjoy the Nolan Batman films immensely and part of why probably is the grittiness and relative realism of them as opposed to the Burton films, which I have never remotely cared for. I fully recognize the artistry and creativity that went into them but I've always found them to be silly and trifling. And then of course the whole franchise went to hell in a handbag with Schumaker.

DonnachaOne

Also, places like AMC run early specials (shows are $5-$6 before noon at most locations, minus the 3D/IMAX surcharge), and Marcus runs discounts on the first show of the day. By offering deeper discounts than the usual matinee, it gives the money-saver an option to see a flick for dirt cheap (or a 3D flick for around ten bucks or less), and so the theater gets more than just seniors and homeless people.

Shannon Nutt

I liked it, but I already think it's being WAY overrated. Yes, it might be the best movie we see THIS summer (although I doubt it, with a lot of promising releases to come), but there are people out there saying it's their favorite superhero movie ever...really? Better than The Dark Knight? Better than Superman I and II? I don't think so.

Yeti4623

I think the Burton Batman movies are better made, but the Nolan ones are better movies. If that makes sense.