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Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

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Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Old 06-13-23, 08:53 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by K&AJones
Overall I thought the show was pretty good with some surprises...Clockwork looked very interesting with Bioshock vibes. Star Wars; Outlaws also looked great....

Starfield presentation was about expected with a lot of indepth behind the scenes...However, every aspect they showed from the game was right out of No man's Sky, just with mor realistic visuals. Starfield will do great but the Locked 30FPS has a lot worried and some concerned. Doesn't make sense for a game that long in development and for PC and XBox....I'd take 60PFS with 1440P all day.....30FPS at 2160...hmmmm don't know....
spoken like someone who hasnít written a line of code in your life, no offense.

One thing Bethesda games have going ó that basically no other does ó is item/NPC persistence. You can drop a sandwich at an exact location on some remote planet then come back to it two months later and itíll still be there.

Another is the vastness of the systems/mechanics in place, all in a single game. Most games barely implement a handful of these things.

These things are CPU heavy things, and have less to do with raw GPU power, even though that plays a part. Cramming all this into a single persistent RPG experience isnít trivial, especially in order to reach a solid 16ms frame time.

As for the NMS comparisons, not all space games are NMS clones just because people like to pretend itís some kind of new gold standard. These are entirely different if you look at it at anything but the most basic, surface level.
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Old 06-13-23, 08:58 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Is item persistence going to be a thing in this game though? With hundreds of procedurally generated planets I'm not sure how they're handling all that but that seems like a ton of stuff to keep track of. Like I don't envy their devs or the QA department.
Old 06-13-23, 09:04 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by fujishig
Is item persistence going to be a thing in this game though? With hundreds of procedurally generated planets I'm not sure how they're handling all that but that seems like a ton of stuff to keep track of. Like I don't envy their devs or the QA department.
yep. They showed it with the woman talking about being a sandwich pirate. Her gag was going to bases on all these different planets and collecting their sandwiches.

item persistence is ó like it or not ó a key piece of the Bethesda-style RPG. I get that it sounds trivial, but when itís built into their games from the ground up, it takes resources to do it.

That said, PC players with $1,000 - $10,000 machines will be able to tweak the settings and brute force their way to 60fps or higher for what they want. Thatís one nice thing about the game releasing on PC on day one, and not a year later in a broken ported mess.
Old 06-13-23, 12:12 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Extended showcase is live now:

Currently they're going over the Cyberpunk 2077 DLC with Keanu Reeves.
Old 06-13-23, 03:03 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

For those interested in Jusant (the mountain climbing Don'tNod game), the demo is on Steam now.
Old 06-13-23, 03:29 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Awesome game is getting awesomer
Old 06-13-23, 05:00 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Dan
spoken like someone who hasnít written a line of code in your life, no offense.

One thing Bethesda games have going ó that basically no other does ó is item/NPC persistence. You can drop a sandwich at an exact location on some remote planet then come back to it two months later and itíll still be there.

Another is the vastness of the systems/mechanics in place, all in a single game. Most games barely implement a handful of these things.

These things are CPU heavy things, and have less to do with raw GPU power, even though that plays a part. Cramming all this into a single persistent RPG experience isnít trivial, especially in order to reach a solid 16ms frame time.

As for the NMS comparisons, not all space games are NMS clones just because people like to pretend itís some kind of new gold standard. These are entirely different if you look at it at anything but the most basic, surface level.
I am a total dolt when it comes to stuff like this so can you explain why the Frames Per Second have to do with item persistence?

Also, I thought all games were all going to 120fps so going back to 30fps is better for a game like this?

My son and I were having this conversation yesterday and I was totally lost.
Old 06-13-23, 05:22 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by fujishig
I feel like I've been burned by so many expensive collectors editions trinkets in the past that I have no faith that this watch is going to be any good. Plus Gamepass really does remove most of the FOMO from collectors editions (and I know they have a smaller collectors edition without the game but I still don't completely understand what you're getting with that besides a steelbook for no game and a patch)
It looks like it's sold out abd scalpers have jacked the price up.
There should be a companion app for smart watches I hope...
Old 06-14-23, 08:48 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Spiderbite
I am a total dolt when it comes to stuff like this so can you explain why the Frames Per Second have to do with item persistence?
Iím definitely not the right person to go into the gritty details, but the gist of it is it all has to do with the simulations and systems that Bethesda has running in their RPGs at all times. A counter-example I saw was that Cyberpunk literally despawns people and items as you turn the camera around if theyíre not within a certain range. Add that to all the customization, NPC relationships/schedules, world rendering, etc, and it all eats away at the raw processing power. Ultimately, to get things on screen, it doesnít just take a beefy video card, as these things are reliant on CPUs. In order to push a solid FPS, it requires processing all the relevant details related to how youíre using those systems at any given time. At some point, compromises are made, particularly if you want to maintain a higher resolution.


Also, I thought all games were all going to 120fps so going back to 30fps is better for a game like this?
120 is extremely rare on consoles, and a lot of compromises tend to be made to reach it; lower native resolution, less foliage, etc. Digital Foundry did a really good analysis of Nioh 1 & 2 on PS5 that goes over some of the handoffs related to that. That saidÖ 120fps is beautiful to behold

Ultimately Bethesda does not want to compromise image quality or simulation performance in Starfield in order to hit a solid 60fps at all times. Itís just not as easy as Gamers think it is. And variable 40-60fps can look like WORSE than a solid 30fps unless you have a TV specially capable of doing VRR, because itíll feel like itís stuttering all over the place as the gameís frame rate is not in line with the TV.

and then thereís frame timing, a whole other can of worms! A game can have solid 60fps but garbage frame timing, and itíll look like a mess. If Starfield hits 30fps with well-used motion blur (think The Last of Us 2 on PS4) it can look and feel almost (but never 100%) like a solid 60. Even better if you have a tv that does black frame insertionÖ

Maybe a separate Ďgaming techí thread is needed
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Old 06-14-23, 09:11 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Dan
Maybe a separate Ďgaming techí thread is needed
oh god no.. the PC Gaming thread is all about that.
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Old 06-15-23, 06:48 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Dan
spoken like someone who hasnít written a line of code in your life, no offense.

One thing Bethesda games have going ó that basically no other does ó is item/NPC persistence. You can drop a sandwich at an exact location on some remote planet then come back to it two months later and itíll still be there.

Another is the vastness of the systems/mechanics in place, all in a single game. Most games barely implement a handful of these things.

These things are CPU heavy things, and have less to do with raw GPU power, even though that plays a part. Cramming all this into a single persistent RPG experience isnít trivial, especially in order to reach a solid 16ms frame time.

As for the NMS comparisons, not all space games are NMS clones just because people like to pretend itís some kind of new gold standard. These are entirely different if you look at it at anything but the most basic, surface level.

no...I haven't...but the debate of FPS be it 15, 30, 60, 120 is just a another part of the entire equation....far more factors play a overall part in the final result which we se on a TV or Monitor......Not all games are created equal of course and the foundation of any game is The Engine. In this case The Creation Engine which bethesada uses has been around a long, long time yet recieved a huge upgrade a few years back...how much longer it can stay is anyone's guess..

be it Starfield, Red Dead II, Warframe, Destiny, God of War, COD and countless other ...realistic games...they all strive for realism at it's core....hence Eye Candy as it was once called....those type of games when it comes to pologon counts are far much higher...and dmanding than say cell shaded type games...Howefver....Lighting & Shadows on any type of game can be the most CPU and GPU intense and demanding on any hardware; Console, PC, TV, monitor...then you add 1080P, 1440P and 2160P in the mix....all these add up...and I haven't mentioned your Internet Connection as a role.

Starfield looks really good and for the most part will do fine...PC's will have more visual options no doubt.....they've probably figured a way to smooth rendering within the engine with space battles and already known there's parts that will be on-the-spot generated which games in the past have done...just will have to wait and se but still, for a highly touted game in the works for lots and lots of years and be 30FPS on a New Gen Console a couple of years old...have to ask why....
Old 06-15-23, 07:29 AM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

I can't even...
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Old 06-15-23, 03:50 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Microsoft officially no longer developing games for Xbox One (trueachievements.com)

Xbox Game Studios chief Matt Booty told Axios that Xbox Game Studios has now "moved on to Gen 9" and that no internal teams are working on games for the previous gen console outside of providing support for ongoing games such as Minecraft.

Booty pointed out that first-party Xbox Series X|S games are playable on Xbox One via Xbox Cloud Gaming with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate. "That's how we're going to maintain support," he said.
Old 06-15-23, 03:52 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

I got confused for a minute there (because I always forget this gen is called Series S/X) and thought they had moved on to developing for their next console. Whew.
Old 06-15-23, 03:56 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Yeah, this (Series / PS5) is the 9th generation of consoles.
Old 06-15-23, 05:41 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

So it looks like from this batch of games I'm mostly excited to play the new Flight Simulator, Fable, Starfield, and Forza Motosport. Starfield and Fable will prob get the most play.
Old 06-15-23, 05:50 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by GatorDeb
So it looks like from this batch of games I'm mostly excited to play the new Flight Simulator, Fable, Starfield, and Forza Motosport. Starfield and Fable will prob get the most play.
Fable is probably 2-2.5 years out.
Do you play Flight Sim now? I don't play it much, but it is a really cool thing to have on the system. Too bad it's such a space-hog on the SSD.
Old 06-15-23, 06:30 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Decker
Fable is probably 2-2.5 years out.
Do you play Flight Sim now? I don't play it much, but it is a really cool thing to have on the system. Too bad it's such a space-hog on the SSD.
When I had Gamepass I tried to unsuccessfully install it It's so big! I gave up, but I have played it and whenever I get GP again I'll give it a go on the Ally.
Old 06-16-23, 12:51 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

So I saw some videos of Flight Simulator and it must have been longer than I thought since I played because I thought it was more arcadey. I'm out It's an actual technical know how to fly game. Nope!

Ok down to 3.
Old 06-16-23, 12:57 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Flight Sim has never been a "game" or arcadey. It's always been a real simulation (as close as tech could get it). I'd imagine you're thinking of something else.
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Old 06-16-23, 03:24 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Noonan
Flight Sim has never been a "game" or arcadey. It's always been a real simulation (as close as tech could get it). I'd imagine you're thinking of something else.
Maybe this one


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Old 06-16-23, 03:27 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

I was thinking Pilotwings or something akin to that.
Old 06-16-23, 07:45 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Crimson Skies was fun. We had a team here on DVDTalk. But I was definitely thinking MS FS, I just remembered wrong.

I know I won't spend a lot of time on Forza Motosport, I'll just tinker a bit through Gamepass, so I guess it's really just Starfield and Fable 2. Fable 1 is on PC now, I never played it on the XBOX, going to put it on wishlist because I heard it was fantastic.
Old 06-18-23, 02:50 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Phil Spencer says to not expect an upgraded Xbox anytime soon:

Microsoft Gaming Chief Doesnít See a Need for New Xbox Yet
Old 06-18-23, 03:50 PM
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Re: Xbox Series X - 11/10/20

Originally Posted by Sub-Zero
Phil Spencer says to not expect an upgraded Xbox anytime soon:

Microsoft Gaming Chief Doesn’t See a Need for New Xbox Yet
Video game console makers typically release major upgrades about three years into a gaming machines’ life.
They do? They did last gen... not sure how that is "typically" done.
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