Valve Co-Founder, "PS3 is a total disaster"
#77
Originally Posted by daddydaryl
So what if HD or BR is cracked..... the blanks cost as much as the movies and that's if you have a burner.....
but in reality (despite what the MPAA would claim) the cracking of either format might actually help the format.
#78
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I wasn't trying to say BD is better because HD-DVD is cracked, I know they use the same encryption but BD uses two layers instead of one. I was merely being objectionable. Personally, I hope Sony closes it's doors thanks to BD and the PS3. Wait, if they do that what happens to the PSP? Never mind closing their doors, but being a distant 3rd in the home console race is good enough for me.
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So I was in a Best Buy tonight. FINALLY got my hands on another wii-mote and nunchuk. There were only two left, and no Wiis in sight. I was shocked to see shelves FULL of PS3s. Nobody seemed to be paying them much mind either...
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Great thread with a lot of terrific posts! I always try to look at these console wars (particular this one) as a marathon and not a sprint. Truthfully, I don't know what to make out of current or projected numbers (shipments, sales, profits/losses), but it always seems to go back to strong game titles garnering interest and moving consoles (the "killer app"). Many of y'all have pointed this out already, but that is the factor that I keep eyeing.
In my perspective, the Wii naturally offered the freshest gaming experience off of the blocks, with a pack-in game arguably worth the price of admission for most (and a not so shabby launch title called Zelda). PS3 did not. But if Wii goes through an ill-timed lull with new quality titles, it could begin its fade into being just another very good multi-player machine with top-notch first party franchises (and little more), like Nintendo's previous consoles. (For the record, I loved the N64 and GC for single and multiplayer games). Certainly nothing would be wrong with that, but if PS3 has some real strong titles hitting the shelves during this lull, interest will shift. Folks will go from talking about Wii Sports and Zelda to something else. It's inevitable. It takes only a few developments in our beloved gaming world to turn the tide for any of these machines. And sometimes, turn them for good.
As for the tech stuff, I always overlook the huge HD factor (I'm a standard TV dude, myself). Like others have stated, I think the BR and HD-DVD thing will turn out like LDs, mostly for collectors and tech enthusiasts. But many gamers are tech enthusiasts too, and I know several who are jumping on-board the PS3/360 bandwagon just because of the video/audio perks. Of course, gamers love new machines in general, and these rigs are looking leaps and bounds over the previous gen.
I dunno. I guess I am being a little vague with details/examples, but I will just say that this discussion could have a very different vibe come next summer or Christmas. Obviously, we all know things are going to change in some form or fashion (heck, popular games are coming and going all the time), but it is way too early to write anyone off - unless Sony's financial losses become downright crippling.
I just realized my post is very "Captain Obvious," and has plenty moments of topic retread, but there you go.
BTW, I currently do my gaming on a PS2, GBA and a Microsoft Windows XP-operated PC, so no strong leanings for or against any of these companies. As a side note, being a long-time PC gamer, I never would have thought I would see the day when Microsoft and Gates would have so many allies in the gaming community. Talk about the tide turning ...
In my perspective, the Wii naturally offered the freshest gaming experience off of the blocks, with a pack-in game arguably worth the price of admission for most (and a not so shabby launch title called Zelda). PS3 did not. But if Wii goes through an ill-timed lull with new quality titles, it could begin its fade into being just another very good multi-player machine with top-notch first party franchises (and little more), like Nintendo's previous consoles. (For the record, I loved the N64 and GC for single and multiplayer games). Certainly nothing would be wrong with that, but if PS3 has some real strong titles hitting the shelves during this lull, interest will shift. Folks will go from talking about Wii Sports and Zelda to something else. It's inevitable. It takes only a few developments in our beloved gaming world to turn the tide for any of these machines. And sometimes, turn them for good.
As for the tech stuff, I always overlook the huge HD factor (I'm a standard TV dude, myself). Like others have stated, I think the BR and HD-DVD thing will turn out like LDs, mostly for collectors and tech enthusiasts. But many gamers are tech enthusiasts too, and I know several who are jumping on-board the PS3/360 bandwagon just because of the video/audio perks. Of course, gamers love new machines in general, and these rigs are looking leaps and bounds over the previous gen.
I dunno. I guess I am being a little vague with details/examples, but I will just say that this discussion could have a very different vibe come next summer or Christmas. Obviously, we all know things are going to change in some form or fashion (heck, popular games are coming and going all the time), but it is way too early to write anyone off - unless Sony's financial losses become downright crippling.
I just realized my post is very "Captain Obvious," and has plenty moments of topic retread, but there you go.
BTW, I currently do my gaming on a PS2, GBA and a Microsoft Windows XP-operated PC, so no strong leanings for or against any of these companies. As a side note, being a long-time PC gamer, I never would have thought I would see the day when Microsoft and Gates would have so many allies in the gaming community. Talk about the tide turning ...
#83
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Apple really isn't known for their games, though... at least MS had a lot of experience making quality games.
#85
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Originally Posted by Save Ferris
Can the market support an additional console from Apple? I wonder where they would fit in the grand scheme of things....
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Originally Posted by Save Ferris
Not the phone--Ive heard rumors that Apples ambitions may lead them to consoles.
AN apple system would only work as a portable...iPod, iPhone, and Mackbooks, apple products are ment to be seen, and if its gonna be hidden in your house, you could buy something better
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The industry cannot support four consoles, this is a rule that has never been broken. Three is honestly pushing it and the only reason three are supported is due to the fact that Nintendo is aiming for a totally different group than the other two companies. If Apple was to launch a console, I'd call it a sure-fire failure from the start.
#88
My prediction is that Sony will lose this generation. I think they will fold like Sega did and a new company will release a console. I'm also betting on Apple. But Apple will surely have to wait till Sony folds because I don't see a 4 console war going on. Then after that, maybe a generation or two later Microsoft will fold and another tech company will release a console. And the circle of video games will go on and on. There will always be Nintendo. Twenty years from now, there will be Nintendo.
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Originally Posted by lawyer goodwill
Certainly nothing would be wrong with that, but if PS3 has some real strong titles hitting the shelves during this lull, interest will shift. Folks will go from talking about Wii Sports and Zelda to something else. It's inevitable.
Even worse, while PS3 targets a different demographic than Nintendo (which has long been considered the family friendly or "girlie" console), the 360 targets the same young adult male group and already has a long list of strong games with more on the way. Back to the price point issue, if people can have a 360 and a Wii for the same price as a PS3, they're probably going to go with that option.
Basically, I think that it's not just going to take a lull from both companies and a couple "real strong" games for the PS3 for Sony to regain what they've lost. They're going to have to bite the bullet and drop the price point by at least $150 (which I don't see happening, thanks to the Blu-Ray tech they're forcing on us), and they're going to have to find a way to release not just strong exclusive games, but ones that can do something that the Wii or 360 can't do.
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My prediction is that Sony will lose this generation. I think they will fold like Sega did and a new company will release a console. I'm also betting on Apple. But Apple will surely have to wait till Sony folds because I don't see a 4 console war going on. Then after that, maybe a generation or two later Microsoft will fold and another tech company will release a console. And the circle of video games will go on and on. There will always be Nintendo. Twenty years from now, there will be Nintendo.
#94
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Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt
My prediction is that Sony will lose this generation. I think they will fold like Sega did and a new company will release a console. I'm also betting on Apple. But Apple will surely have to wait till Sony folds because I don't see a 4 console war going on. Then after that, maybe a generation or two later Microsoft will fold and another tech company will release a console. And the circle of video games will go on and on. There will always be Nintendo. Twenty years from now, there will be Nintendo.
Nintendo, yeah, they'll be around too. They're awesome, and are always able to make profit.
Sony? Looks like they're in major trouble. Losing tons of money on the PS3, and didn't they take out a HUGE loan in order to support the PS3 and Blu-Ray? Man, that company is really starting to fall apart. Actually I hope they make it through their problems. I've always liked the Sony products that I've owned (just never got into the PlayStation...).
#95
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Originally Posted by LivingINClip
Even if Sony fails to "win" this console war, there is no way they will fold and go the way of Sega. For that to happen, they'd have to lose a few generations in a row.
I just wouldn't expect Sony to ever admit there is any problem with their PS3; to do so would be to invite disaster.
#96
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Originally Posted by Anubis2005X
I don't see Microsoft folding, ever. They have the resources and determination to do whatever they need to do to get into the videogame industry and stay there.
Nintendo, yeah, they'll be around too. They're awesome, and are always able to make profit.
Sony? Looks like they're in major trouble. Losing tons of money on the PS3, and didn't they take out a HUGE loan in order to support the PS3 and Blu-Ray? Man, that company is really starting to fall apart. Actually I hope they make it through their problems. I've always liked the Sony products that I've owned (just never got into the PlayStation...).
Nintendo, yeah, they'll be around too. They're awesome, and are always able to make profit.
Sony? Looks like they're in major trouble. Losing tons of money on the PS3, and didn't they take out a HUGE loan in order to support the PS3 and Blu-Ray? Man, that company is really starting to fall apart. Actually I hope they make it through their problems. I've always liked the Sony products that I've owned (just never got into the PlayStation...).
Aside from the PS3 launch issues, what problems?
#97
DVD Talk Godfather
Originally Posted by TheMadMonk
Will Apple's console strategy be to release the same console every year, in a smaller, shinier form, knowing that their faithful fans will keep re-buying it?
Now go back to your *NEW* Vista OS with all the latest and greatest features.*
*circa 2002 in OSX
#98
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Originally Posted by MovieExchange
It's a possibility, and I do believe that the lack of strong titles hurt the PS3's initial sales, but in the end I think that what hurt sales the most was the high price point. Now they have a long list of system problems, with more being found every day. That's sure to slow down sales also.
Even worse, while PS3 targets a different demographic than Nintendo (which has long been considered the family friendly or "girlie" console), the 360 targets the same young adult male group and already has a long list of strong games with more on the way. Back to the price point issue, if people can have a 360 and a Wii for the same price as a PS3, they're probably going to go with that option.
Basically, I think that it's not just going to take a lull from both companies and a couple "real strong" games for the PS3 for Sony to regain what they've lost. They're going to have to bite the bullet and drop the price point by at least $150 (which I don't see happening, thanks to the Blu-Ray tech they're forcing on us), and they're going to have to find a way to release not just strong exclusive games, but ones that can do something that the Wii or 360 can't do.
Even worse, while PS3 targets a different demographic than Nintendo (which has long been considered the family friendly or "girlie" console), the 360 targets the same young adult male group and already has a long list of strong games with more on the way. Back to the price point issue, if people can have a 360 and a Wii for the same price as a PS3, they're probably going to go with that option.
Basically, I think that it's not just going to take a lull from both companies and a couple "real strong" games for the PS3 for Sony to regain what they've lost. They're going to have to bite the bullet and drop the price point by at least $150 (which I don't see happening, thanks to the Blu-Ray tech they're forcing on us), and they're going to have to find a way to release not just strong exclusive games, but ones that can do something that the Wii or 360 can't do.
I fully expect, (I believe it to be a reasonably informed expectation), that the price will drop by a $100 before the 2007 Holiday season. $499 will be the magic price point, imho. Hell, as it is the 360 already costs me more to own, signigicantly more. I suspect more will come to that realisation as well, especially once there are games out there for the system.
And remember, an incredibly small percentage of people currently own one of these three systems, so while many of us don't find it necessary to purchase a F.E.A.R. or a Rainbow 6 Vegas for the PS3, or any other big non-exlusive title, over the upcoming years many households will only own a PS3. Besides, there will be exclusives for that and every system, exclusives that gamers want to play.
The major reason for my optimism for the Sony and the 360 is that this 'war' is one that will be waged over the next ten years and will entail far more than gaming, whether us gamers want that or not. The PS3 and the Xbox, (which will likely go to a built in HD-Player at some point), are greatly positioned for this. I think Sony will be okay.
#99
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Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
In your haste to trash apple you should have taken your time to think out that poor analogy. I assume you are making a jab at the ipod. Last I checked no one is required to buy the newest ipod to play all the new music. One can still use their G1 from 2000 if they choose and still play all the new releases.
Now go back to your *NEW* Vista OS with all the latest and greatest features.*
*circa 2002 in OSX
Now go back to your *NEW* Vista OS with all the latest and greatest features.*
*circa 2002 in OSX
My post was more directed at the Apple faithful, and their intense dedication to supporting most everything Apple makes. I was not implying that anyone would have to buy a new console to play the newest games, just that the form factor of the console would likely undergo yearly tweaks, making it newly tempting for the faithful to buy again.
Now go back to your new Apple pc that runs at the same speed as a 4 year old Windows Pc, and only costs twice as much!
#100
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Originally Posted by TheMadMonk
Now go back to your new Apple pc that runs at the same speed as a 4 year old Windows Pc, and only costs twice as much!