Question about the Gamecube CD size....
 

Ok, I know that PS2/Xbox games are mostly DVDs which hold gigs of data, so what does the little dinky GC disc hold? Im curious about games like Tony Hawk 3, which are on both PS2 and GC. Its a DVD on PS2 packed with movies and music etc. I dont see how that can fit on the GC disk.

1.5gb

from what i hear nintendo has this super duper compression technology they use.

Very few games on the PS2 and Xbox actually go above 1.5gb. Let's use your example, Tony Hawk 3, for instance. The PC version fits on one CD (600 Mb).

The biggest advantage of the smaller discs is the shorter load times. On most games, they're practically invisible.

Discostu: Sounds like you had your mind made up that you weren't gonna like Nintendo's discs. If that's the case then why ask the question?

Anyways, in addition to much shorter load times I think the discs are also hard to pirate.

Everything in the PS2 version of Tony Hawk 3 is in the Gamecube version as well.

1.5 GB is more than enough space for any game. The only thing that takes up a bunch of space is high resolution FMV, and those suck anyway.

As good as in-game graphics are today all cinema scenes should be done with the in-game engine. Having a high-clip pop up in the middle of the game takes me out of the game. An ingame cinema keeps you in the game as the characters look the same and it's not a disruptive.

The quick load times on the Gamecube are well worth slighty more compressed FMV I will probably only watch once. I know the videos on Tony Hawk 3 had more compression artifacts than say the xbox version, but that couldn't be a more minor issue with me.

Kellehair, I have nothing against the small discs, just wondering what they could hold etc. I do have something against the poor games that are on the discs though, but thats another story :)

They're small for three reasons:

1) Fast load times. I didn't believe all the hype 'til I got my system. There's no loading here at all, 5 secs max for NBA Street is the most I've seen.

2) No pirating. These mini-discs are available some places to use to burn stuff...except they hold like a measely 200 mb or something. So until they come out with 1.5 gb discs that small for anyone to buy, there will be no pirating on the Cube whatsoever. You can't, obviously, fit a regular 700 mb CD-R either.

3) It's cute. You get the feeling Nintendo went very cute with this console, seems like Miyamoto was intent on that from the beginning. So, thus, the discs are cute and small to fit in that cute console.

Speaking of fast load times, anyone notice that Eternal Darkness has zero load time in the game (except for the initial load when you load your saved game), I'm not sure how they did that. Though I don't really mind loading unless its really long, the less there is the better :) In addition to that these small discs also look really sweet! ;)

In addition to games having almost no load time (except THPS3, which has a little), since the discs are cheap to product, companies can easily put games on two disks (such as RE).

-rolleyes-

actually you can buy MINI-DVDs with 1.5GB capacity and can mod it to run reg size cds/DVDs.

Well.. the small discs aren't the only piracy prevention put in place obviously. But yeah, there is a version of the gamecube made by Panasonic called the Q that plays regular DVDs as well as gamecube games.

The GameCube discs are 3" DVD media, which hold 1.5 GB.

You can buy 3" DVD-R's here:

http://www.cdmedia-dvd.com/shopping/cdmedia/dvdr.htm

I didn't know you could buy those, that's pretty cool. Kinda sucks how they're $10 a disc though.

True, but normal sized DVDs hold much more, and they are also a lot less costly. Therefore, PS2 and XBOX will be able to drop the game prices down to like $39.99 for all new titles, and GC may have to still shot for a $49.99 price. As much as you may want to fight this, it is true, there is a much greater demand for bigger capacity, and cheaper DVDs then the 3" dealies.

Gamecube discs are slightly more costlier than the conventional DVDs used by PS2 and XBox...but not $10 costlier. If Sony and Microsoft go down to a $39.99 pricepoint, Nintendo would have no problem doing the same. Actually in this scenario Microsoft would take the biggest hit, as they are the most dependant on Software sales to offset Hardware losses.

This is simple. When the chapters are being read at the very beginning the GameCube is busy loading the level. You can hear it accessing the disc while the character is beginning the chapter. I'm sure other reading is done while playing the game, but I'm pretty sure the majority happens at that point.

That doesn't mean te 3" ones are more expensive to produce.. You'd have to be a manufacturer of them to convince me :p

Actually it's quite easy to understand why they are more expensive, not many companies make 3" disks for one. There is no big demand for them; besides GC what major unit requires them? And finally a PS2 game that is 1.5 gigs can be a lot less compressed then a GC game that is 1.5 gigs. If this was the scenario then Nintendo may decide to release it as a 2 disk set, and although the smaller disks may be not much more money then regular sized ones to them, it adds up when they are being mass-produced.

1.5gigs is 1.5gigs.. doesn't matter what disk it's on. One wouldn't be more compressed than the other.
95% of games probably don't even use 1.5gb of the PS2 or xbox disk.
And ok.. maybe the 3" disk would be like.. 2 cents more expensive to produce.. If it was a big deal, Nintendo wouldn't have went with the format.

I thought the G.O.D (gamecube optical disc) is a propietary format developed by Nintendo and cannot be copied, unless you can get your DVD-R to spin in the opposite direction that is.

I think it spins in the opposite direction of "normal" dvd's, could be wrong though.

I've heard that also.. but I dont know if it's true.

Huh?
Can the PS2 and Xbox read dual-layered discs? If so, that's 9 gigs. Assuming no compression, that's 6 GC discs. Even in this highly unlikely scenario you still aren't talking a $10 difference between production costs between the PS2/Xbox and the Gamecube version.

Resident Evil was on 2 discs with no extra cost.

Well Nintendo released Dr. Mario (N64) for $29.99, so if they can release a cartridge for that price, I'm sure they can lower the price of their GCN games.

IGN also reported in their rumors section, that both Sony and Nintendo were thinking about dropping the price for their new games from $49.99 to $39.99.

I have a question for all you technical Talkbackers, is it possible for Nintendo to increase the size of their disks to say 3.0gb? Or is the GCN locked at reading only 1.5gb disks?

The Gamecube discs will always be locked at 1.5Gb. What will happen, however, is that developers will be able to use that space more efficiently. Compare a first-generation 1 disc PSX title to a 1-disc PSX title released right before PS2 came out...big difference.

I just opened my GC while the disc was spinning and it was spinning clockwise, the same as regular CDs/DVDs.

The GameCube media itself is based on DVD laser and media standards, though the file system encoded on the discs is likely proprietary.

Really!?, Because N64 came out at a time when CD production for digital media was in it's prime. That didn't seem to stop them from being different before, why would it stop them now. Also N64 games didn't drop much in price because it was a more expensive medium.

There are no negatives to the disk size. With the cartridge based system, there was a clear disadvantage.

But you proved you don't know what your talking about when it comes to storage mediums with this statement

1.5 gigs of space is 1.5 gigs of space. A 1.5 gig PS2 game would fit just the same on a GCN disk as a GCN disk holds 1.5 gigs. It would not have to be compressed at all. Only a game larger than 1.5 gigs would have to be compressed. And then it could be put on 2 disks and sold at the same price.

So there's no negative to the disk size there. Plus the load times are much faster, which is a huge advantage as load times suck you out of a game real fast.

Production costs are also no big deal. You act like these disks cost manufacturers a buck more a piece than a full sized one or something, when in reality it's a couple of cents.

GCN games cost the same as all the other systems. They could easily lower price.

The only disadvantage to using this medium has nothing to do with games. It simply made the GCN the only of the three that can't play Cds or DVDs, which is a negative to some.

Wow, I'm surprised this made it to page 2 without some insight into the media.

Nintendo's #1 concern for this new machine was piracy. Piracy in their mind was more important than whether or not the machine could play DVDs or if it could sing or wash the dishes.

The media itself was produced by Matsushita and is a proprietary format. It is not a DVD format, hence Nintendo doesn't need to pay any dues to the DVD consortium for every disc produced. It's my understanding that they are of similar shape to the 3" CDs that have become so popular recently for personal business cards, etc. -- however, it is not a Mini-DVD (such as Metropolis's 2nd disc). This, outside of Matsushita's production plants, should not be able to be copied.

I forgot they didn't have to pay the dues to the DVD consortium. So in actuality, these discs probably don't cost anymore to produce per unit than say an X-box game on a full sized DVD.

So toss that lame argument out the window. ;)

So like I said, that the G.O.D is a propietary format.

I was incorrect about the direction of spinning though.

Finally, some people that know what they're talking about come in...

I wonder if all the things that people have been thinking is coming from anti-GC web sites or something...
Lots of mis-informed people out there.

From <a href="http://cube.ign.com/articles/083/083749p1.html">The Ultimate GameCube FAQ</a>:

An explanation GameCube's storage format.

Nintendo GameCube Disc: Holds 1.5 Gigabytes of data condensed onto an 8cm in diameter disc. If you compare the data storage capacity of the media to one of Nintendo 64's most popular games, Super Mario 64 (which holds 8MBs), you'll find that the GameCube disc can store 190 times the data -- or roughly twice the amount of a regular CD game.

"This 8cm pocket size disc that can fit in your pocket was designed to be an advanced medium that can be easily inserted/removed from the main drive and is user-friendly for all levels," says Nintendo on its GameCube disc. "Also in the near future, when you consider the merging of TV games in the home and portable games, we are confident that this fashionably-sized disc will lead the way for entertainment in the 21st Century and become the de facto standard for the game industry." When questioned if future handheld devices from Nintendo (beyond Game Boy Advance) would utilize the mini-DVD-sized medium, a company representative hinted that it was a possibility.

The inner curves of the 8cm disc, which feature proper branding, are also key to the protection against piracy -- and like the disc itself, are provided from Matsushita Electric Industrial Company's proprietary technology.