Count Dooku

I thought this was one of the series' best episodes.

The dramatic story held together all the way through to the end and they did not cop out by having things wrap up neatly. And I liked that Talla told off Klyden rather than "agreeing to disagree." But I am not really sold on Jessica Szohr as much of an actress.

The humorous beats in the episode worked and were more low-key than usual. And I liked that they acknowledged continuity mentioning past events.

Kelly's break-up was just sort of happening, but it was inevitable and it mostly occurred in the first half of the episode. So whatever.

I am pretty sure that was Bruce Willis as the voice of the giant flower.

General Zod

I wonder if the Kelly breakup wasn't the direction the show was going to go but have now decided to switch gears and have her be with Malloy.

I know the episode was a social commentary but I think it's a little unfair of the new security officer (Talla) to be mad at Klyden over this. I mean this is a cultural thing that's obviously deeply embedded in the population of the planet so it's not like he's just this one person who's got this pre-judgement about this. Perhaps you shouldn't go out and explore space if you're going to have a problem with every single cultures dynamics that don't match your own way of thinking. This is the way that culture has chosen to deal with this. Furthermore saying Locar didn't hurt anyone is really ignoring what he did. He would have been perfectly happy with Klyden sitting in jail for the rest of his life while he traveled the galaxy banging chicks. I guess that doesn't matter.

bluesix

I'm probably one of those on this forum who hate this show the most and I agree! This was a good episode!

The story was different enough that I didn't feel like I had seen it done better on another series. The annoying 12 year old boy humor was kept to a minimum and there was just enough humor to make the show different from other sci-fi shows (I like the 'eating the tooth bit' the best). The new characters were interesting and the actors playing them did a great job. There was an interesting mix in the storylines of both 'sci fi' - the deflector system itself, and the human interest aspect - the relationships, one ending and one exploring possibilities, as well cultural anthropology - the differences in how one society lives being seen as so backward compared to anothers.

Maybe this show is finally finding the balance to become a new classic scifi show?

Time will tell, but we only have a handful of episodes left for the audience to grow enough to show this is worth renewing....not sure it will make the cut.

Count Dooku

Without getting into all the stuff about their planet's culture, on a personal level Klyden was sentencing Locar to death by exposing him, so Locar's willingness to see Klyden accused of a murder he did not commit isn't so out of bounds, as I see it.

Putting Kelly and Malloy together because the actors are a real couple would be a terrible idea.

General Zod

Except one was a completely lawful act and the other wasn't. A chief of security should be able to discern that difference even if they don't agree with it.

Eric F

I hated this episode because the show has totally given up on the pretense of even trying to be a comedy. I found nothing humorous about the episode at all.

The sexuality storyline was a complete rip off of a TNG episode which itself was a rip off of The Left Hand of Darkness.

Count Dooku

Argument could be made that the "completely lawful act" was completely unjust, and the unlawful act had an element of "just desserts" to it.

I'm not certain what your complaint is, however. Talla followed the law. She proved Klyden was innocent, and turned Locar over to stand trial on the planet. She did discern the difference between lawful and unlawful. She is under no obligation to be civil to Klyden.

Count Dooku

You think this show is supposed to be a comedy?

You don't know what you are watching.

Eric F

Apparently they don't know what show they're producing.

They promoted the show as an adventure series with comedy elements. The first season was about evenly matched comedy/drama. This season there's very little/no comedy at all.

melasnus

Agreed.
It's a shame...the comedy is what distinguished it from the many Star Treks.

If SM actually wants to do a ST, he should contact Paramount pronto.
If he doesn't, he may be hearing from their lawyers.

Count Dooku

The problem is that when an episode plays up the comedy on the fringes, it detracts from the dramatic story-telling that is usually trying to be accomplished in the A storyline.

If the dramatic storylines are not being told in earnest, then the show is edging into parody. But the show is not a parody, and it already suffers criticism from fans who want it to be a Star Trek satire.

This episode was telling a serious story about a society that discriminates on the basis of sexual preference, a criminal investigation, and Talla's ethical dilemma of enforcing a law she thinks is unjust. There were some comedic moments. But if the show had including a bunch of goofs and silly jokes, then the "serious" story starts to look ridiculous.

A good comparison is Brooklyn 9-9. The squad investigates crimes and solves cases, but all of that action is shown in the quickest and most perfunctory manner. The police work is almost inconsequential to the series, and its a 30 minute show.

The reason I said, "you don't know what show you are watching," is because (it has become clear) that Seth wants the dramatic action in The Orville to be taken seriously. Yes, he wants to include humor in the show, but the show is very much in the Star Trek TOS mold of sci-fi action-adventure.

General Zod

I think they had the level of comedy in this episode just right. They were dealing with a serious subject so they kept the yucks down to a minimum. The Bruce Willis flower, the scene where Talla says this is all probably the weirdest thing to happen on the ship.. there was a few more... but that was it. This was never promoted as a comedy. It was a promoted as a sci-fi drama TV show with some comedic elements.

And SM did very much want to do ST but was told no. So he created his own. And I think he's done a fine job

melasnus

There definitely is a very fine line between drama and comedy.
However, it can be done.
We can go all the way back to Shakespeare to see examples.

IMO, SM has the talent to pull it off...he understands comedy AND the ST universe extremely well.

I guess my point/opinion is the Orville works better, at least for me, with less drama and more comedy.

As a derivative of ST, I agree.
He certainly has captured the look and feel of recent STs.

SteveA

I've been a critic of at least one other episode of this show, but I liked this one. Yes, it reminds me of a Star Trek episode, but to me, that's good. No, it wasn't as funny as some, but I like it when the don't force the humor, but still make nerdy jokes (like the tooth thing). To me, this show is like STTNG if one of the writers was a horny, wiseass teenager, throwing in stuff we all wished STTNG would have shown. If it happens all the time, it's annoying, like saying "that's what she said" after every other sentence. But sprinkled lightly, it's hilarious.

brainee

Like Dan and the Orville icing cupcakes. "We're caught in a tractor beam! We can't stop it! Aaaahhhhh!!!!!" *takes bite of cupcake* That's exactly the stupid sort of thing I would do if I was a member of the crew

Agree 100% about this episode (and the show in general). This week was more serious, but just last episode (Isaac and his amazing holographic penis) was sillier throughout. Before the premiere, the promos were a bit deceptive (making it seem like more of a full-blown comedy). But now we're about 20 episodes in and it's clear this isn't "Family Guy" in space (or even a weekly version of "Galaxy Quest"). And the promos that I notice now seem to be pushing this as more of a straight sci-fi/adventure (with maybe just a lighter touch). Which is good, because that's what the show is.

General Zod

I thought the no torpedoes bit on the bridge was funny as well. One could argue "A piece of the action" and "The trouble with Tribbles" from TOS was more comedy than sci-fi and they are ranked as some of people's favorite episodes. People like a mixing of comedy and sci-fi.

And it's funny you mentioned what you did brainee because my wife and I were discussing if we could be on the Orville vs. the Enterprise-D which we'd rather be on and it's no contest to us. Orville let's you be yourself as long as you get the job done and on TNG Picard was more or less the stuffy military commander type demanding everyone behave the same way. I still think the elevator music that Dann set up should continue to be a running gag in the show - they could do so much with it and it could be so subtle at the same time.

TGM

tired of Bortusentric episodes.

the new security chief is a much better actress than Halston Sage. Not that the new chick is Daniel Day-Lewis but I couldn't see sage puling that episode off.

General Zod

Agreed on both.

Next week's episode is part 1 of 2

Eric F

I have no problem with the show being more drama, but the less comedy there is, the more the show tends to be reliant on old TNG episodes for plotlines. If I want to watch TNG I'll watch TNG. I don't need another TNG, I want something else, new.

melasnus

Same here.
The use of Moclans and Moclus culture as stand-ins for gays and their issues in our society is getting silly.
OK, we get it, you don't need to beat us over the head, Seth....sheesh.

Amen to that.

windom

I don't think the Moclans represent gays because they are only accepting of their traditional relationships and gender structure.

Bill Needle

Wish granted!!

Count Dooku

I guess Seth needs to keep beating viewers over the head, after all.

MLBFan24

Initially I groaned when it seemed like it was going to a Bortus-centric episode. But by the end, I was pleasantly surprised and enjoyed it.

Oh hey, Jenny - the cupcake girl haha. Looked different with her hair up (the other scene was the bowling scene with LaMarr, from the robot love episode)

JimRochester

Enjoyed the episode but am growing tired of the Bortus centric stuff myself. There is a whole galaxy to invent and he seems to either be stuck on Bortus or rehashing ST stuff.